Talk:David Dinkins

Untitled

Okay, there seems to be an 'edit war' going on here, and it's silly.

Question: is the current photo (color image) in the Public Domain? It was not listed as such when I checked.

Quill 21:40, 7 Nov 2004 (UTC)

File:Frmr_NYC_Mayor_David_Dinkins_with_plaque.jpg Since there seems to be a question over the current pic, I uploaded this PD pic to commons--might want to use it, especially if someone can remove the flag growing out of his head (and arse). Niteowlneils 03:34, 24 Nov 2004 (UTC)

If you wanna help, try to rewrite his biography from [1]. It's very interesting, so I think someone who know better english than I should rewrite it. Darwinek 18:34, 24 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Sorry, 'rewriting' other people's work is unethical and I won't do it. Quill 07:56, 26 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Place of Birth

A web search reveals several sites claiming his place of birth to be Trenton, New Jersey. I'm going to take a chance and add that, as no place of birth is currently mentioned. --Do Not Talk About Feitclub (contributions) 11:27, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

'influential clique'?

The second paragraph describes him as being part of an influential clique of african-americans. Especially considering the Wikipedia definition of clique, that description seems POV to me.--Anchoress 23:07, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

Neutrality

After browsing this page, I find it hard-pressed to find anything outright positive Dinkins did. The 'Mayoralty' section has precious few details aside from events that Dinkins seemingly had little blame in causing. As well, I deleted a particularly racist statement about him supposedly getting a free pass for being black. Puh-leeze. =//Turnquest 07:22, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

• Just added an NOPV tag. Seems overly negative all the way through, and plenty of unverified claims. Hopefully, someone who knows a bit more about the man will spot that and clean it up a little. Paj.meister 19:10, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Big Picture=

I don't have the source, but I remember reading a story in Newsweek or Time about the Big Reduction in Crime during Guliani's time as mayor. The article said the new effective policing tactics implemented by Bratton would have been impossible without the extra police Mayor Dinkins hired during his term. In other words, the big decrease in crime in NYC had two components:

   More Police - implemented by Dinkins
   Better Policing - implemented by Guliani and Bratton

The current article here completely ignores this important piece of information. And paints an overly simplistic picture (Dinkins Bad / Guliani Good) of the transition of NYC from a high crime city to a low crime city.

If Dinkins had not increased the police department, it is doubtful that Guiliani / Bratton could have been as successful. (Republicans rarely raise taxes for anything - even public safety). I know this because here in L.A. today, Bratton is all but begging the city government to hire more police. But our Democratic controled government is too afraid to raise taxes to do it. (The conversavites are "lurking" just off stage in case they do!) California / L.A. is not as blue as portrayed in the media. Neither is NYC.

"Men's Room Attendant" Slur and Racial Tensions

Many in New York City referred to him as the "Men's Room Attendant" -a blatantly racist appelation. Shouldn't this be included? 71.249.13.251 20:17, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

He was referred to as a "washroom attendant" to be exact, primarily by Bob Grant and others like Rudy Guiliani (it has been rumored). Why is this racist? You've never seen white washroom attendants?? It was really a question of his background and what he has done to deserve to be Mayor of one of the largest cities in the world. Dinkins was a "nobody" in terms of politics and his brief stint as mayor reaffirmed this view. --24.189.35.249 (talk) 19:49, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

To the best of my knowledge, the only peson who ever publically referred to Mayor Dinkins as a "Men's Room Attendant" was WABC radio talk show host Bob Grant. 24.168.116.248 05:57, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Giuliani *encouraged* the racial tensions that intensified in New York during that time. The slur referred to above was made at a rally by police officers Giuliani spearheaded. See: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18108850/site/newsweek/ . Many New Yorkers, especially black and Latino New Yorkers but also whites and Asians believe Giuliani got into office by encouraging racial division in the city. This could be why New Yorkers continue to have such a low opinion of him: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/2007/05/14/2007-05-14_bloomy_tops_rudy_in_battle_of_the_titans-2.html

Giuliani referenced Dinkins frequently and seemed to compare accomplishments, (possibly due to questions about Giuliani taking credit for crime reduction that began under Dinkins). Giuliani would not refer to Dinkins by name on these occasions however, referring to him as "my predecessor".

Dinkins also was criticized for attempting to heal racial tensions in New York City during the Flatbush boycott of Korean green-grocer Red Apple, despite pressure from some political activists in the African American community: http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F3061FF73F5D0C718DDDAC0894D8494D81&n=Top%2fReference%2fTimes%20Topics%2fSubjects%2fF%2fFood

Death?

As of 11:13 pm ET on March 16, this article states that Dinkins died on March 7. I can't confirm that he is alive, but there has been no news coverage whatsoever of his "death" - and the links used as references for his "death" lead to blank pages on the websites of WABC and WNBC. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.119.89.184 (talk) 03:15, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

It's vandalism and it's been reverted. Thank you. — Malik Shabazz (talk · contribs) 04:15, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

He's not dead!

He was at David Paterson's swearing in! I'm changing it now - that's really horrible whoever did this. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.81.81.105 (talk) 19:20, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Neutrality

Amazing how negative and anti-Dinkins this article remains. Perhaps if no-one can find citations or neutral phrasing Instead of listing a litany of bad things, the facts should be presented, plus opinion or commentary on them if necessary by cited sources. Otherwise the only way to preserve NPOV will be to remove the listing of negatives. Slac speak up! 01:43, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

Eliminating all negative comment is just as detrimental to NPOV, and it's ludicrous to suggest that removing negatives will solve the issue. Much of what is listed is true of Dinkins -- perhaps editors should look to balance the negatives with some positives of his contributions to NYC? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.166.254.3 (talk) 18:46, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

The suggestion was to remove negatives only they couldn't be cited and phrased in a neutral manner. This is well with Wikipedia's guidelines. By stating that 'much' is true, you imply some things in the article are false, which should be removed. Also, if much is true, than it should be no problem finding the requested cites. 24.187.214.210 (talk) 14:33, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

I'm killing anything in the Mayoralty section that is without citation. there is a tremendous amount of baloney there, including an unattributable quote. Vinithehat (talk) 14:47, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Bob Grant

A bit about Bob Grant saying something not nice about Dinkins has been inserted three times and removed as inappropriate. Grant is known for saying not nice things about all kinds of people; this is not a controversy, and it isn't even worthy of note. That's what Grant does, and he does it to well-known people and even bills himself as "the inventor of controversial talk radio". This article is not a place to collect a listing of things people who don't (or didn't) like Dinkins said about him. In addition, this is something like 20 years ago; if it really was a controversy, there should be cites to support that. Saying that Grant said something does not a controversy make.  Frank  |  talk  17:10, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

Today's edits

I reverted some of today's edits because of WP:V and WP:NOR concerns, and because some of them just didn't make sense.

• According to our source (Ebony magazine), Dinkins was raised by his mother and grandmother. If somebody wants to say he was raise by his father, bring a reliable source that says so. Likewise, our source doesn't say anything about where Dinkins was when WWII ended.
• The section about Dinkins' election was changed into a "some say, others say" format. That interchange raises concerns about original research. To avoid that problem, we usually summarize what one source says, then we summarize what another source says, and we attribute both opinions to their authors. Another problem is that both "sides" seem to say the same thing. Finally, the new material was sourced to a search result from Google Books. Please cite the specific page of New York magazine, so other readers can find the source you used.

— Malik Shabazz ^Talk/_Stalk 05:38, 10 March 2011 (UTC)

I reverted today's edit because the Ebony article being used as source is wrong. It misstated the facts of his upbringing (see obituary of Dinkins's father in New York Times which states the facts correctly) and it misstates the facts of his education. Dinkins's professional biography at WLIB, where he works, states specifically that he graduated with honors. If he had graduated magna cum laude, a higher honor, it would increase his stature and have been stated there. — PK800  11:06, 13 March 2011

Wikipedia is about verifiability, not truth (or facts). Please see WP:V. We don't write articles based on "if a, then b". We write articles based on what is actually published in reliable sources. We cannot accurately say that "magna cum laude" would "increase his stature"; besides, the man is 83 years old and perhaps doesn't need stature. Perhaps instead he is displaying some humility by downplaying the exact honor from 50+ years ago. The point is - we don't assume anything.  Frank  |  talk  13:15, 14 March 2011 (UTC)