Talk:Gospel of Matthew

Current text

The current text says that the Greek text does not sound a though it is translated from Hebrew. This is true, as far as it goes, but see Matthew Black, "An Aramaic Approach to the Gospels and the Acts". The third edition seems to be the latest. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.160.45.120 (talk) 10:43, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

I gather that Black argued that there were Aramaic sources behind part of Q - in other words, the words ascribed in Matthew to Jesus himself (or at least some of them). The book is rather old now, but I also gather that it's regarded as very solid. That said, I think that including Black's nuances would take us to a level of detail that Wikipedia isn't really suited to - the Aramaic background to Q seems to me to be a bit abstruse for a readership still trying to come to terms with the very existence of Q. Still, if you can propose how it might be worked in, give us a proposal. PiCo (talk) 00:36, 24 April 2011 (UTC)

("Casey offers a compelling argument that Aramaic sources behind part of Q are of extremely early date" - maybe this fits better in the article on Q source?)PiCo (talk) 00:38, 24 April 2011 (UTC)

Any written Aramaic-language source for the New Testament (if there even was one, which many scholars doubt) would almost certainly have been a "sayings document", or list of quotations of Jesus, and so somewhat remote from any of the books of the New Testament as we have them. AnonMoos (talk) 03:43, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

No mention is made of the Hebrew edition of Matthew, as studied in some recent scholarly books (Example, "The Hebrew Yeshua vs. the Greek Jesus" by Nehemiah Gordon) and the evidence for Hebrew 'word play' in the parables. Shouldn't this information be referenced? 81.110.126.221 (talk) 10:26, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

The following seems to be rather POV:

"The narrative tells how Israel's Messiah, having been rejected by Israel (i.e., God's chosen people), withdrew into the circle of his disciples, passed judgment on those who had rejected him (so that "Israel" becomes the non-believing "Jews"), and finally sent the disciples instead to the gentiles.Luz (1995), p.84 The gospel is nevertheless aimed at a Jewish audience, and its message is that that Jesus was the Messiah; Jesus, not the Law, is now the focus of Jewish identity; and that Jew and gentile are to be brought into the one community.Senior (2001), pp.8-10"

I see that it has been sourced, (Luz and Senior), but the latter seems to contradict the former, and Luz's conclusions appear to be presented as mainstream. Is that the case? A Georgian (talk) 17:57, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

Unfortunately my google-books access to Luz has now fallen foul of the way pages are subtracted the more you visit, but perhaps you can look at that page for me and tell me if it's being quoted properly. As for Senior, I've still got access to that and our article does seem to reflect his views. Senior also says that Luz's view on the community of Mathew is that it had already made the break with Judaism. I have to say that personally I don't see a conflict/contradiction between these two passages - where do you see it? PiCo (talk) 23:05, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

The contradiction is that the first quote characterizes Jesus as having given up on the Jews, while the second indicates that it was directed to a Jewish audience. I wasn't questioning the source or the accuracy of the quote. Maybe if the quote leads with, "according to Luz" it would be more clearly an informed opinion than implied settled consensus. I also think his first parenthetical odd and the second lacks an antecedent. No big deal; I didn't delete it, I just wanted to bring it to your attention. If it passes your scrutiny, then maybe I'm just "seeing things". A Georgian (talk) 19:42, 20 May 2011 (UTC)

Bibliography Needs to be Completely Redone

Has anyone who edited here ever written or paper or gone to college? The current bibliography lists reference articles and texts that are not mentioned or cited at all in the Gospel of Matthew article. If they are not "referenced" for information they should not be in the references section. For unreferenced commentaries, possibly a section or subsection should be created separately. For all others, they should be listed as external links or for further reading... This bibliography is a mess and has virtually no application to the article that is written. Stevenmitchell (talk) 23:19, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

Feel free to take up the sword and edit. It's easy to point out all the things that are "wrong". Ckruschke (talk) 18:21, 21 July 2011 (UTC)Ckruschke

Author

On what basis, other than tradition, is the author "most likely St. Matthew"? If none can be offered, it should be removed from the lead or changed to possibly St. Matthew.--Jeffro77 (talk) 23:29, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

The section Gospel_of_Matthew#Authorship_and_sources says that most scholars doubt Matthew's authorship so I'd tend to agree. Elizium23 (talk) 23:38, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

error in article

The author stated that the apostles were eventually sent to the Gentiles. However, the only apostle that was sent to the Gentiles was Paul. This is stated many times and was clarified in Galatians 2:6-21, that Paul was to go to the Gentiles and Peter and the other 11 apostles were to go to the Jew only. This is the most glaring error that I see but if anyone cares, I would be happy to clarify a few others. thanks, bob Bror0060 (talk) 01:50, 26 December 2011 (UTC)

Are you referring to this sentence: "Matthew's gospel tells how Israel's Messiah is rejected by Israel, withdraws into the circle of his disciples, passes judgment on those who have rejected him so that "Israel" becomes the non-believing "Jews", and sends the disciples instead to the gentiles.", or another? carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 20:15, 28 December 2011 (UTC)

Matthew 28:16-20: 16 Then the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain where Jesus had told them to go. ... 18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.” PiCo (talk) 02:37, 9 January 2012 (UTC)