Talk:Hindutva

The categorisation of Hindutva under religious fundamentalism is unfair

It is surely unfair and based on ignorance. Hindutva must not be confused with Hinduism, exactly like Zionism is not confused with Judaism. Some Zionists are relgious Jews, some others defend the identity and the culture of the Jewisih people, without accepting Judaism as a religion. Sharon is undoubtedly a Zionist, but he cannot be considered a Jewish fundamentalist, since he does not even believe in Judaism as a religion, but openly declares his atheism. The same applies to Veer Savarkar, too. He was the founder of the notion of Hindutva, but was not a believing Hindu, but an atheist.

The categorisation of Hindutva under religious fundamentalism is unfair. There might be people who have different opinions about this, but let us go by a neutral interpretation.

The Supreme Court of India has observed that "Ordinarily, Hindutva is understood as a way of life or a state of mind and is not to be equated with or understood as religious Hindu fundamentalism."

I suggest that this page not be categorised under religious fundamentalism. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Gabriel N (talk • contribs) 14:13, 20 January 2009 (UTC)

well, as it goes with fundamentalism, fundamentalists believe they are "only" doing it properly. "Hindutva" of course means "being a Hindu". But it won't do to just merge Hindutva into Hinduism. "Hindutva" is clearly a term for radical Hindu chauvinism or ethnic nationalism, not for the "state of mind" of being a Hindu. Similarly, adherents of Islamic fundamentalism of course believe they are "only" being good Muslims. It is outside observers who categorize Islamic fundamentalists as apart from normal, bona fide adherents of the religion, just as you need outside observers to classify Hindu chauvinism as apart from normal, bona fide practice of Hinduism. It's the way religions work, for some they are spiritual enrichment, for others, they are merely an excuse for switching off the neocortex and start hatemongering. It's the same with Christian fundamentalism vs. bona fide Christianity: meaning, it's human, and found in every religion, but not inherent in any particular religion. --dab (𒁳) 07:43, 12 February 2009 (UTC)

Agree with you on fundamentalism, but then you should have a page on Hindu Fundamentalism and not group Hindutva and Hindu Fundamentalism together. Although there are many who see an element of fundamentalism in Hindutva, academically speaking they are two different terms.Gabriel N (talk) 08:29, 12 February 2009 (UTC)

Hindu Extremism

need a separate page for hindu extremism and hindu terrorism --134.151.0.13 (talk) 19:57, 7 May 2011 (UTC)--134.151.0.13 (talk) 19:57, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

There is no such thing as "Hindu Terrorism" in a scholarly sense, and the page saffron terror already exists anyways. If you look at the talk page for "Christian Terrorism," (talk:Christian_terrorism) you will see that we've argued significantly regarding the definitions of "religious terrorism." The terrorism has to be motivated by religious scripture or ideology, and you won't find any Hindus (in the RSS, or anywhere else) advocating terrorism based specifically on Hindu religion. You'll certainly find "Hindus" who have engaged in "terrorism," but just as the Irish Republican Army is a Catholic Christian group that commits terrorism does not fit into the "Christian Terrorism" category, you'll never find any scholarly resources showing that these alleged groups could be considered under that banner. Trust me, I had to do a lot of research just to get the NLFT and NSCN added as "Christian Terrorist" groups, and those are flat-out, hardcore terrorists. Bryonmorrigan (talk) 20:16, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

This page needs serious restructuring

I believe this section needs restruturing. The section names hardly correspond to the content in the sections. The content in many sections lack continuity. Nihar S (talk) 05:37, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

it has been tagged for merging for ages. This article is simply a WP:CFORK of Hindu nationalism. We should finally sit down and do the merger properly. --dab (𒁳) 07:40, 12 February 2009 (UTC)

Well, when I said it needs restructuring, I did'nt mean it was a WP:CFORK. The Hindu Nationalism page too is equally poor in content. Comming to whether hindutva = Hindu nationalism? Hindu Nationalism is a generic term and will include lot of movements while Hindutva is very specific to some organisations. For the moment, I believe, both the pages (minus the rethoric that has been put by both supporters and opponents) are stubs and need more and better referenced content. Deciding whether to merge can be put off for some time, till we can clean up and restructure at least this page. I would try it over the next few days. Anybody there to help? Nihar S (talk) 12:03, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

I agree, I will try and add references to unreferenced content. Can we also divide the "Views on other faiths" section into subsections and try to bring in some continuity. That section looks very very messy. Gabriel N (talk) 03:35, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

Edit request from Atheist9, 4 August 2010

{{editsemiprotected}} The following is wrongly attributed without any reference.Hindutva seeks to eliminate caste system and bring a sense of unity among the Hindus which it can never accomplish if it accepts caste system. Therefore this is wrong.

"Protection of caste systems

Caste is embedded in Indian culture for the past 1,500 years, the caste system follows a basic precept: The ranks in Hindu society come from a legend in which the main groupings, or varnas, emerge from a primordial being. From the mouth come the Brahmans—the priests and teachers. From the arms come the Kshatriyas—the rulers and soldiers. From the thighs come the Vaisyas—merchants and traders. From the feet come the Sudras—laborers. Each varna in turn contains hundreds of hereditary castes and subcastes with their own pecking orders."

Atheist9 (talk) 07:36, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

Not done: There is no indication what change is suggested, nor any explanation as to why the existing version is contradicted by the above statement. JamesBWatson (talk) 12:23, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from 9atheist, 5 August 2010

{{editsemiprotected}} Hindutva wishes to remove caste system. http://www.savarkar.org/en/social-reforms/abolition-caste-0 9atheist (talk) 04:32, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

Not a reliable sources; please show e.g. newspaper. To appeal, use WP:RSN. N Not done  Chzz  ►  02:45, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from 9atheist, 5 August 2010

{{editsemiprotected}} The term 'Hindutva' has been coined by savarkar. He did express his wish to abolish caste system.

9atheist (talk) 04:41, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

Requests to edit semi-protected articles must be accompanied by reference(s) to reliable sources.

N Not done  Chzz  ►  02:43, 6 August 2010 (UTC)