Talk:Joker (comics)

The Joker’s initial personality.

In his earliest appearance the Joker’s so-called smiling face is the antithesis of “comic” - it is completely immobile, a rictus grin, as it were, and his voice is a monotone. This makes for an interesting contrast with later versions where he is a laughing, animated figure, with an emotional delivery, and a flexible face (although sometimes so stylized and elongated that it is impossible to work out the physiology of how his jaw would provide such movement!). I think that as the monotonous voice and frozen face were the original concept of the character, and play a part worth mentioning in the story itself (the voice from the radio is quite chilling) it should be incorporated into the article, However, as the writers appear to be exceptionally possessive and politically charged, I won’t venture to upset anybody’s bat-applecart by inserting anything myself! Jock123 (talk) 13:09, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

How do you intuit a monotone voice from a comic book? Syrthiss (talk) 13:13, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

Well, the way they did it in Watchmen (with the character of Rorschach) was that they rendered all of his speech in a slightly different font (as well as a frayed-edge bubble) and putting no bold emphasis on specific words in his dialogue (a common staple of comics) but I don't know whether or that's the case for early Joker stuff. --Kaizer13 (talk) 03:45, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

Not for the early Joker stuff, but his laughter was often rendered outside of speech bubbles as a sound effect and not an actual thing he's saying. There's a very memorable image in "The Laughing Fish" of Joker walking through a door with his laughter twirling around his body in a long ribbon of "Ha"s. On the more recent end of things, his speech in "Arkham Asylum: A Serious House on Serious Earth" was rendered in splattered, messy red lettering with no speech balloon at all, merely a red line pointing to what he was saying. In "Batman: R.I.P.", Joker's speech is shown in green inside a green-ringed speech balloon, and is additionally rendered all in lowercase lettering (though this was due to him not having lips and having a split tongue; I think this tactic was used to make it a bit more confusing for the reader to read since lowercase letters in the Comic Sans font can run together and look very strange). There have been other times when his speech has been rendered in weird, wiggly, or otherwise odd-looking lettering (sort of like how Delirium of the Endless' speech in the Sandman comic series is done), and points when his laughter has started in and then burst out of his speech bubble as a sound effect.

76.235.173.12 (talk) 03:40, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Batman: Lovers & Madmen Canonicity

I was just reading it and it seemed to tell the origin of the Joker. I was wondering how canoncal it is and if the story should be added since the article says how no one knows his origin. --Ryu (Talk | Contributions) 17:07, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

We'd need to find some citations about that, we're not supposed to edit in our judgments on the matter. Please look some up, and let us know what you find by including links in your response. Thanks, it's a good question to ask. ThuranX (talk) 21:58, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Okay. The official name for it is Batman Confidential: Lovers and Madmen. In the article has the plot and everything. I honestly don't know if this is canon or not. I think it might be though. --Ryu (Talk | Contributions) 17:34, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

Okay. Apparently, it's the Joker's origin after the Infinite Crisis cleaned the slate. Though the Joker himself does not remember his origin, this story isn't told through his perspective. So should we add it? --Ryu (Talk | Contributions) 18:45, 20 September 2009 (UTC)

The writter for that comic was the guy who created "Heroes" I dont think it is canon, it seemed like a one time comic. The guy who wrote it (I just cant remember his name right now) said he always wanted to write a joker story so again I think it was just a one of. The story contained nothing of the red hud element and has the joker's insanity as being caused by chemicals which although possible doesnt seem to correspond to other joker stories. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.44.79.62 (talk) 18:55, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

Batman Forever (yet again)

This was already discussed at Talk:Joker (comics)/Archive 3#Jack Napier in Batman Forever and Talk:Joker (comics)/Archive 3#Batman Forever., as well as being discussed at User talk:Krlzh. Now the same material is being added by Paulita1292 (talk · contribs) (example).

It has pretty strong consensus that the material has no business being in the article unless a reliable source can be found that supports the statement. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 04:07, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

I'd go one further, and suggest a Checkuser be requested. ThuranX (talk) 14:21, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

Motherfuckers Thuranx, barek, JGreb and doczilla; this man in Batman forever is Jack Napier, if you say that this man isn't him, who is the shooter? Joe Chill?. Batman Forever is the continuation of Batman and Batman returns because Dr Chase Meridian speak a phrase reference to Catwoman, too when says to Bruce don't work late, when Dick discusses with Bruce when says "You parents weren't killed by a maniac." Bruce replied, "Yes they were.". Do you know is going to want to deny the truth pc and want to be lynched by Batman fans and the fact that the actor Jack Nicholson is one less does not mean the character has changed. That's whim of you and especially ThuranX and Barek.

JACK NAPIER IS PLAYED BY DAVID U HODGES IN A FLASHBACK IN BATMAN FOREVER —Preceding unsigned comment added by Paulita1292 (talk • contribs) 16:48, 6 November 2009

As has been explained repeatedly - that material is original research. You need a reliable source for that material. None of the sources provided thus far have been reliable. Remember: The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 17:18, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

the "New" IP's singling out of editors who reverted Krlzh's edits shows this to be a sock puppet in use. I'm not sure if it violates policy, Krlzh is not blocked or banned, so it's not block avoidance, but might be socking in that it's a SPA meant to increase the appearance of support. I'll let SPI look it over. ThuranX (talk) 19:41, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

WHo the fuck deleted the bibliography?...

I assume it could be Chill but we don't have anything but assumptions to go by. So no this does not belong in the article.74.108.143.82 (talk) 23:33, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

Admin action

It seems that we do have a problem here. I've reviewed the previous discussion, and consensus does appear to me to be that the material should not be added. I have reverted the edit added by the anon and I have semi-protected this page. I do suspect that the anon is a regular editor here, so I encourage them to log into their account to make these sort of changes. - Tbsdy (formerly Ta bu shi da yu) ^talk 07:30, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

All things considered, I doubt they can. The likely editor has had their accounts blocked for socking. - J Greb (talk) 07:47, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

Then semi-protection it is. - Tbsdy (formerly Ta bu shi da yu) ^talk 07:57, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

Continued Disruption

The IP continues to add the material. I've reverted him again, since the addition came with a lovely [1] personal attack on my talk page. Looking over the discussion above, I think it's still pretty clear there's no consensus to add the material. I'll go a step farther, even if there was a reliable source, it's still trivial. When you have a character who's been portrayed as many times as the Joker, there's no need to mention every single appearance of him, especially if it's a passing mention by a non-notable (in Wikipedia terms) actor. Any thoughts? Dayewalker (talk) 17:51, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

New addition to Joker biography

More recently, the story "Small Problems" written by J. Michael Straczynski and published in The Brave and the Bold showed the Atom recruited by the doctors of Arkham Asylum in an attempt to save the Joker's brain succumbing to a rare neurologic condition without resorting to any potentially fatal brain surgery. As the shrunken Atom attempts to release an experimental compound directly inside the Joker's neural system, he witnesses first-hand various memories from the Joker's childhood which imply the character has been mentally unstable since a young age. The young, anonymous Joker is shown to be introverted until he 'comes alive' during moments of violence, such as brutally assaulting a bully with a lunch box. He later kills his parents in an act of arson as they debate his mental state in an argument that depicts his father as an unsympathetic parent who disowns the young Joker for his violent tendencies, namely killing local pets. Their argument also suggests the Joker's mother was an unfaithful partner, causing doubts on his father's side regarding their son's true parentage.

The Joker's burgeoning career as a criminal shows him as the leader of a small gang of armed robbers, before a memory montage of stabbings, shootings and explosions feature him ageing in and out of his trademark 'look', with no explanation shown for his eventual physical transformation into the Joker.

Reference:

Straczynski, J. Michael (w), "The Brave and the Bold (#31), (January 20, 2010), DC Comics

[2]

--Glockenspell (talk) 21:20, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

Two problems - 1) your link doesn't back up any of what you've said, it's not a valid reference. 2) It's been said before that everyone who 'sees' Joker's mind sees it differently, there have been stories in which the Joker appears to be aware of the intrusion and manipulating the experience, so any good addition regarding his origin would need out-of-universe citation from writers about an 'official' explanation. As for the importance of yet another Joker story, I don't see it. Our articles do not need to be holistic, indeed, that would trend toward cruft, and B&B is a series designed for low impact stand-alone tales, not for continuity defining moments. ThuranX (talk) 00:49, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Emperor Joker

Didn't emperor joker first appear in DC showcase 95' or watever? Him and Batdemon were already inlodged in his deepest consciousness at one time or another before the mxyplx storyline. I propose to add the first appearance of emperor joker as an actual character. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.255.42.105 (talk) 00:17, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

Both Black Mask and Ra's Al Ghul are listed with their appearances in Under the Red Hood

The Joker will be in the movie as well, voiced in fact by John DiMaggio, but you don't care about that and remove all information, wonder why. (190.12.153.187 (talk) 22:59, 20 March 2010 (UTC))

Thanks for poiniting to those... Black Mask has been removed as unsourced rumor. And frankly, hosted by the LA Times or not, the Ra's item is sourced by a blog - a no-no. - J Greb (talk) 23:37, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

The "Jack Napier" issue

While I know the Joker has no official name, Has anyone else noticed how the name from the Batman film has become accepted by quite a number of people? Ztyran (talk) 04:51, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Perhaps we could use a scan from the Secret Origin's piece that ran a couple of years back? It had Joker choosing an origin to relate, and he mentions the Napier one. I dunno if that means the origin's been adapted as a possible comic one, but even just for the character's origin it visually represents how he prefers to have multiple choice I think. Regardless, that scan suggests how closely linked that name has become with the Joker; even the comics have picked up on it (even just in brief, perhaps even humorous, mention) Comics (talk) 00:26, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

There was a comic adaptation of the Batman film, so technically the name Jack Napier has been used in a comic. 110.174.166.224 (talk) 03:45, 28 December 2010 (UTC)

And that's a non-starter. The comic adaptation of the film doesn't incorperate anything into the material used for the fiction character biography. - J Greb (talk) 04:06, 28 December 2010 (UTC)

I'd personally consider it another alias/name for some versions of him and have it put under Aliases since he was named "Jack Napier" a few times, or has at least had his name stated as Jack. If you guys disagree though feel free to ignore my opinion. :) 76.235.173.12 (talk) 03:49, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Seriously? A fan film listed alongside Batman and the Dark Knight?

I am not generally one of those people who gets annoyed enough at Wikipedia to say something about it, but it seems fair to say that "a movie some talented fanboy made" is not a useful thing to cite in reference to the Joker's portrayals in pop culture, lest you also mention every time he appeared, for example, when lampooned on a sketch comedy show as "a portrayal." If the owners of the intellectual property are not involved, it seems like an illegitimate example. 71.185.13.198 (talk) 20:48, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

I would argue that if the fan-film's influential enough in the fandom, it belongs there... But the info's apparently been moved to a spin-off page, so this really should continue over there, right? 76.235.173.12 (talk) 03:01, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Irrelavant to "Powers and Abilities"

I feel that this portion of the powers and abilities should be moved, or deleted:

The Joker has cheated death numerous times, even in seemingly inescapable and lethal situations. He has been seen caught in explosions, been shot repeatedly, dropped from lethal heights, electrocuted, and so on, but he always returns once again to wreak havoc.[44][45]

Over several decades there have been a variety of depictions and possibilities regarding the Joker's apparent insanity. Grant Morrison's graphic novel Arkham Asylum: A Serious House on Serious Earth suggests that the Joker's mental state is in fact a previously unprecedented form of "super-sanity," a form of ultra-sensory perception. It also suggests that he has no true personality of his own, that on any given day he can be a harmless clown or a vicious killer, depending on which would benefit him the most. Later, during the Knightfall saga, after Scarecrow and the Joker team up and kidnap the mayor of Gotham City, Scarecrow turns on the Joker and uses his fear gas to see what Joker is afraid of. To Scarecrow's surprise, the gas has no effect on Joker, who in turn beats him with a chair. In Morrison's JLA, the Martian Manhunter, trapped in a surreal maze created by the Joker, used his shape-shifting abilities to reconfigure his own brain to emulate the Joker's chaotic thought patterns. Later in the same storyline, Martian Manhunter uses his telepathic powers to reorganize the Joker's mind and create momentary sanity, albeit with great effort and only temporarily. In those few moments, the Joker expresses regret for his many crimes and pleads for a chance at redemption.

In Elseworlds: Distant Fires, the Joker is rendered sane by a nuclear war that deprives all super beings of their powers. In Batman: Legends of the Dark Knight #145, the Joker became sane when Batman put him in one of Ra's al Ghul's Lazarus Pits after being shot, a reversal of the insanity which may come after experiencing such rejuvenation. However, the sanity is only temporary, and soon the Joker is back to his "normal" self.[46]

The character is sometimes portrayed as having a fourth wall awareness. In Batman: The Animated Series,[47] the Joker is the only character to talk directly into the "camera"[47] and can be heard whistling his own theme music in the episode adaptation of the comic Mad Love. Also, in the episode "Joker's Wild", he says into the camera, "Don't try this at home, kids!"[48] In the Marvel vs DC crossover, he also demonstrates knowledge of the first Batman/Spider-Man crossover even though that story's events did not occur in the canonical history of either the Marvel or DC universe. On page five of "Sign of The Joker", the second half of the "Laughing Fish" storyline, the Joker turns the page for the reader, bowing and tipping his hat in mock politeness. On the official websites and associated promotional material for The Dark Knight, graffiti characteristic of the Joker can be found.[49] On the website IBelieveinHarveyDentToo.com, hidden among laughter is the message "See you in December", referring to the release of the film's trailer.[50]

This is a series of him cheating death and an instance or two of him breaking the 4th wall in the TV series which was used purely as a comical moment each time. He (to my knowledge) does not have knowledge of the 4th wall in the comics. Also I do not believe listing his insanity is a power or ability. Please provide input. --  Grimbear13 ►Talk  16:07, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

This really differs for every comic fan and every author, to be honest. I believe that "Cheating Death" became an ability of his just because DC Comics used it so often for him! I think the profile for him on DC's website even mentions that. Since that hastily drawn in panel in his second appearance, the Joker has indeed usually survived his brushes with death, from falling off of heights to being knifed and beyond. In fact, when he was killed in Batman Beyond: Return of the Joker, it was made out as a huge deal, because he does so often escape death's clutches!

The Joker's fourth wall awareness is played with in the comics quite a bit, actually. As pointed out, in "Sign of the Joker" he turns the page for the reader. He's also handled his own speech balloons, and there have been a few other comics where he's addressed the reader directly. In one I can't recall the title of offhand, he discusses the nature of reality with a doctor at Arkham, and at the end turns to the reader and asks, "You are real, aren't you?" So yes, depending on the author, the Joker does have fourth wall awareness.

I would say in some cases, his insanity is and has been used as a "defensive" tactic, in the sense of him being so crazy that he can't go any crazier, only saner. And that's precisely how the comics have treated it for the most part - there have been numerous incidents of him being affected by depowering events and being rendered sane. There's one case of, I think, Martian Manhunter (might be the wrong character) forcing his mind into cohesion and the Joker feeling horribly guilty about the things he's done. There's one A/U, as pointed out, where a bunch of heroes get depowered because of a nuclear bomb blast (?) and the Joker goes sane. There's been a case of him going straight and becoming sane after thinking he's killed Batman (in "Going Sane"). So I'd say yes and no on insanity as an ability.

I would say the only thing maybe needing change is a little more info about his sleight of hand ability. It isn't outright stated by DC that he is dexterous, but it's an attribute often given to him. I wish I could find more examples of this, but the only one I can think of offhand is from one episode of Batman: The Animated Series (I believe the title was "Joker's Wild"), wherein he's at a Joker-themed casino and we see him playing around with the cards - shuffling the deck in quick, interesting ways, sending the deck across and down his arms, etc. I seem to recall him also used this sleight of hand ability to perform "magic tricks" which usually involve some nasty "joke's on you" effect or another... Someone back me up on this, please, because I'm sure I've seen the Joker do it! 76.235.173.12 (talk) 03:18, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from Jeffgetslastlaugh, 12 June 2010

{{editsemiprotected}} I request you put 'Aaron Schoeke 2005 Patient J staring Paul Molnar as the joker and todays City of scars" Patient J is huge and one of my favorite jokers besides Andrew Koening was buddies with Paul Molnar and Sandy Collora is friend with the Aaron Schoeke.

The film is known world wide with a HUGE fan base, Please consider.

thank you,

Jeff

Take a look Jeffgetslastlaugh (talk) 02:03, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. —fetch·comms 02:48, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from 201.68.50.235, 22 August 2010

{{editsemiprotected}} I sugggest the category:Fictional terrorists to be added. 201.68.50.235 (talk) 01:58, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

201.68.50.235 (talk) 01:58, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

Not done: That category does not exist (Category:Fictional terrorists). Dabomb87 (talk) 02:22, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

Spring is not a month

Joker's first appearance is currently listed as Spring 1940. Spring is not a month. Does anyone know the exact month it was published in? I've tried to find a reliable source but every book I've looked in says Spring 1940. 110.174.166.224 (talk) 03:41, 28 December 2010 (UTC)

The cover date is "Spring", which isn't an odd practice - some magazines have, and still do, run on a quarterly publication schedule.

In general the cover date is used in identifying the particular issue. "Month" is use for conveniance since the vast majority of comics have either been produced monthly or specify a single month on the cover. The same fields are used for cases where the cover lists multiple months (bi-monthly), partial months (bi-weekly), month and day (weekly), season (quartely), or "Holiday" (a rare occurance).

And since all the sources you are likely to try agree with this, please don't try to fix something that isn't broken.

- J Greb (talk) 04:03, 28 December 2010 (UTC)

Jack White?

When did the Joker use the alias Jack White? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ztyran (talk • contribs) 19:45, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

Request to unblock

Blocked indefinitely? that's seems a bit harsh. This page should be unblocked, because I see that there's a lot of information to update, for example the Joker's latest appearance in Batman: The Brave and the Bold is in the "The Knights of Tomorrow!" episode, and he is in DC Universe Online, you know. (200.106.220.170 (talk) 18:09, 31 January 2011 (UTC))

You can register an account, and once you are autoconfirmed you can make any edit to the article that you wish (within Wikipedia guidelines). Since we still likely have a problem with a vandal account, the indefinite semiprotection (which doesn't' mean forever) will stay in place. Syrthiss (talk) 18:20, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

But do NOT go adding every appearance the Joker makes! Doczilla _STOMP! 08:20, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

Suggestion

Change the line in the "Character" Section from "The Joker's victims have included men, women, children, and even his own henchmen and other villains" to "... and even his own henchmen (frequently) and other villains" I remember that one of the main subplots of his short-lived series in the 70's was his two henchmen desperately trying to escape his employment before they were killed but they were continually foiled by their terror of him coming after them. Just add one word? Sincerely, Ford Prefect — Preceding unsigned comment added by PIlPxP14TB50M0ln4Kzy (talk • contribs) 16:26, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Not to be picky, but "and even his own henchmen (frequently) and other villains" seems semantically wrong; it just sounds odd. I do agree with adding the word "frequently" in there, though. Maybe change the whole sentence to, "The Joker's victims have included men, women, children, his own henchmen (frequently), and even other villains." Or just cut out the frequently entirely and leave it as, "... his own henchmen, and even other villains." The implication is that he already kills other people just as frequently as he kills his henchmen. Why add extraneous details?

76.235.173.12 (talk) 03:23, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Does the joker know batman's alter ego?

I'm getting mixed signals here does he know or is it like he might know but doesn't care? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Julian Grebe (talk • contribs) 07:14, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

The Joker does not know. It's not a matter of not caring. The Joker willfully resist noticing giveaways to Batman's identity (like his vague recollection that the Robin he killed was named Jason) because the Joker does not want to know. He wants the Dark Knight's only other layer to be even Darker Knight. Doczilla _STOMP! 08:18, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

Splitting Joker in other Media

This section is either too much plot regurgitation and needs to be cut down significantly or split off into a new section. I'm willing to believe there is enough of him in other media to warrant its own article but as it is now, its a mess, badly organised and almost exclusively plot.Darkwarriorblake (talk) 01:03, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

I'm not sure. I just went and read through it and most of it is describing the take on the character. The only parts I think that match with what you're saying might be the description of Nicholson's Joker, the DCAU Joker and the Batman: Brave and the Bold Joker. The rest describe the depiction of the Joker in that particular media, and use episodes as references (eg; The Batman version and the Romero version). Maybe links should be provided to the main articles in those cases, seeing as those would go into a bit of detail about the plot? Comics (talk) 03:53, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

Perhaps, its still pretty cluttered and long for a section and the article is missing a section describing any appearances he has in other media outside of Batman/DC stuff like merchandising so perhaps if this was split off, it could be more neatly presented and that kind of information could then also be added and to go into greater detail on areas where necessary.Darkwarriorblake (talk) 11:47, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

Notable Aliases

This is clearly set out in the infobox page for this character type that it is for NOTABLE aliases, ones that are long-term, iconic, that if you use them people may have an inclination about what you're talking about. Nomad for Captain America for instance, Matches Malone for Bruce Wayne. By at least my understanding it should not be applied to one-use names or ones used briefly. Oberon Sexton for instance is or was a 'living' person who Joker killed, he stole his identity but it is unlikely, short of further stories down the line, that Joker will ever be identifies as Oberon Sexton like he is The Red Hood.

The Red Hood is, at the moment, probably the only verifiable and notable alias of the Joker and so by definition the only one that should be on the list at this moment in time.

If you can add evidence for others, that is welcome.

Joseph "Joe" Kerr could be considered notable in that it was used in the animated series and then in Legends of the Dark Knight comic, though it was essentially the same plot. It's certainly cross-media but is it iconic? Questionable.

Jack White. I don't know anything about this identity, I know it was used in Arkham Asylum and there Batman claimed it was one of his oldest identities but I don't know of its use outside the game.

CLem Rusty as I'm aware is ONLY used in The Joker, that elseworld one shot. This one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joker_(graphic_novel) . So it isn't very notable or even applicable since its a different version of the Joker altogether.

The Domino Killer is just the fake killer Joker was hunting as Oberon Sexton, no more notablethan Oberon, especially since you never see him AS the Domino Killer, its just a name thrown out.

Mr Rekoj I cannot find a single thing on this except a tumblr account so not certain on its notability at all but it seems low since any other reference is referencing the tumblr account.

So at the minute, my personal view is that all but the Red Hood is removed, possible keep Joe Kerr with more discussion. If you have a reason the others should be kept, please discuss it.Darkwarriorblake (talk) 00:25, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

Could you make an argument for Jack Napier? I know that it was predominately used only in Burton's film, but DC has at least used it in a throw-away manner as an alias for the Joker: [3]. I'm just offering it as a suggestion, especially since the Joker in that scan is offering his multiple choice origin story. Technically, any one of them could be canon. Comics (talk) 02:32, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

Also; not sure if this counts, but Emperor Joker was used about 10 or 12 years back when he had Mxy's powers. Comics (talk) 03:06, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

Emperor Joker would be a title not an alias, I don't know anything about Jack Napiers use in comics but I don't think itd be applicable. Alias is essentially being someone else, as the Red Hood he was someone else, not the Joker, as Oberon Sexton, he was just the Joker using a disguise to move a plan forward. Darkwarriorblake (talk) 13:40, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

A bit more than 2¢...

As near as I can tell the intent for the aliases field has always been for notable aliases used by the character within the continuity that the article primarily covers. An extrapolation of that has been to limited to recurring aliases or those referenced in secondary sources. As for the list here... The Red Hood is the only one that fits all the criteria. as for the rest:

• Kerr - I believe this has been a recurring alias that has been used in the DC Comics continuity. I'd really like confirmation on that though.
• Rekoj - This sounds like something that could have been used in the comics, but I can't put a finger on where.
• White - If it was only used in the Arkham Asylum, this it doesn't belong in the aliases. Beyond that, it sounds like it was mentioned in passing. That would mean that it isn't notable, and not worth including in the IOM section.
• Rusty - If it's limited to the Elseworlds story, it doesn't belong.
• Sexton - A one off that isn't very notable... no, this doesn't belong.
• Domino Killer - Sexton, only more so.

- J Greb (talk) 23:42, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

I researched Joe Kerr more and I was misremembering, it was never an episode of Batman, just the Going Sane 'Legends of the Dark Knight' story. The alias WAS used in the show but for nothing major. So I concur that right now, the only one that should probably be up there is Red HoodDarkwarriorblake (talk) 00:32, 24 March 2011 (UTC)

Well, then where does that leave nicknames like "Harlequin of Hate", "Mogul of Mountebanks", etc.? And I believe "Jack White" was used in the older comics but I am not sure. 76.235.173.12 (talk) 03:27, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

They're nicknames not alias, an alias is a complete identity like Dick Grayson being Robin, Nightwing, and possibly Batman.Darkwarriorblake (talk) 18:49, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

Edit request from 24.154.191.216, 21 March 2011

{{edit semi-protected}} I would like to add the following page, because there is a similar "Intercompany crossover" page--regarding the very same story--for the supervillian Carnage.

Intercompany crossover

Carnage teams up with and later turns against the Joker during Spider-Man And Batman #1, the two's mutual psychosis leading them into a brief alliance before their differing methods of murder cause a clash, Carnage favouring numbers in his murder sprees while the Joker prefers the artistry of his usual traps and tricks. The Joker tries to kill Carnage with a bomb, only to miss Carnage, who drapes a copy of his symbiote over a victim to fake the Joker out. Instead, it's Batman and Spider-Man who notice the diversion, and Carnage siezes Batman, proposing to kill him. In retaliation, the Joker threatens to set off a bomb that will kill everybody in Gotham City--including himself and Carnage--rather than see Carnage kill Batman and "slice and dice" his way through Gotham--his town. While Batman handles a distracted Carnage, Spider-Man grabs the "bomb" with his webbing, then chases after the Joker--flagging him down with his "spider-signal" and threatening the worst. But when the Joker dares Spider-Man to kill him, Spider-Man is unable to stoop to his level, and simply captures him.

24.154.191.216 (talk) 22:59, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

Not done for now: could you provide more details on your source? Stuff that goes in {{cite comic}} would be helpful, like the full title, date of publication, volume/issue, publisher, artist, etc. Beyond that, I would also suggest paring down the info a little so it doesn't read so much like a plot summary. Thanks, — Bility (talk) 21:05, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

"Portrayed by" list in infobox

I was wondering if the list of actors who have played Joker on TV and in films would be appropriate in the infobox, considering that this aspect of the character is covered in the lead and article body.Shirtwaist (talk) 23:31, 9 April 2011 (UTC)

Question

Why don't we have the title of this page be The Joker, rather than Joker (comics). It honestly looks better.--Valkyrie Red (talk) 02:59, 8 July 2011 (UTC)

Among others: WP:DEFINITE, WP:NCC/THE, and WP:THE (which uses this article as an example). -J Greb (talk) 03:13, 8 July 2011 (UTC)

Breaking the 4th Wall example?

"The character is sometimes portrayed as having a fourth wall awareness. In Batman: The Animated Series,[47] the Joker is the only character to talk directly into the "camera"[47] and can be heard whistling his own theme music in the episode adaptation of the comic Mad Love. Also, in the episode "Joker's Wild", he says into the camera, "Don't try this at home, kids!"[48] In the Marvel vs DC crossover, he also demonstrates knowledge of the first Batman/Spider-Man crossover even though that story's events did not occur in the canonical history of either the Marvel or DC universe. On page five of "Sign of The Joker", the second half of the "Laughing Fish" storyline, the Joker turns the page for the reader, bowing and tipping his hat in mock politeness."

Does Joker's Asylum count as breaking the 4th wall? The book is told to the reader by the Joker face-to-face, rather than as a record. Particularly in the tale about Two-Face, the Joker refuses to tell the reader the factual end of the tale and instead instructs them to flip a coin to see whether the story had a happy (reunited with wife) or sad (suicide) ending. Joker's Asylum doesn't specifically state that Joker's speaking to a reporter, or inmate, or someone who works at Arkham, but works with him speaking out of the book to a reader. Raida7 (talk) 23:40, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

I'd say yes, "Batman: Joker's Asylum" does count, since he's basically narrating to the reader before each tale. There's been quite a few current age comics where he's broken the fourth wall, I just wish I could remember the titles off-hand...

76.235.173.12 (talk) 03:30, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Enh, I'm not inclined to count Joker's Asylum. It has a look as if he might be talking to someone unseen. Even if he is talking to the reader, it's akin to the old days when Batman would say, "Hey, kids," to the readers but not within the context of the actual story. In Joker's Asylum, the Joker is only introducing these stories. He's not doing anything within the context of any other action/story. Doczilla _STOMP! 16:35, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

Iran

The storyline "A death in the family" had the Joker appointed as Iran's UN representative (yes, exactly as it sounds). It was retconed later to the fictional country of Qurac. Was there some real-world reaction to the Iranian thing (which may be interesting to add), or was it just DC? Cambalachero (talk) 02:51, 5 October 2011 (UTC)

Source? When was it reconned to Qurac? Doczilla _STOMP! 08:55, 6 October 2011 (UTC)

New Reference

This reference may be of interest to anyone who wants to write it up, if not I will when I get more time. Info about Jerry Robinson's conception of Joker. http://io9.com/5866373/rip-jerry-robinson-creator-of-batmans-nemesis-the-joker Darkwarriorblake (talk) 22:46, 8 December 2011 (UTC)