Talk:Wuxia

jianghu section move or merge?

The section on jianghu seems fairly redundant since there is an article on jianghu. However, there appears to be some information here that is not on that page. I don't think that page should be merged w/ this one, but perhaps the information in this one could be merged into that article and then linked from here? -Jaardon (talk) 10:27, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

I think we can move the information here to Jianghu. However, please note that it is unreferenced and may contain original research. If possible, we can summarize the Jianghu section here, because I think it's still quite essential in helping readers understand Wuxia culture better. 暗無天日 _{contact me (聯絡)} 13:31, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

section "The Code of Xia"

This should at least include 仁 if it is not removed entirely because of OR. —Preceding signed comment added by MythSearcher^talk 06:13, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

Teo source

I removed it due to it being restored after an IP removed it. It seems to be WP:UNDUE as no Japanese or Chinese sources support that claim, not even found in Japanese dictionaries. I found no Japanese sources stating 武俠 or 武侠 as a Bushido genre, nor the word Bukyo used as this Bushido genre but it was used by 1 webpage for the Chinese Wuxia genre(it was used for Bukkyo 仏教 instead). Ironically, the first Bukyo used as the kanji 武侠 in google results actually comes from the anime Seiho Bukyo, which further made the possibility of Bukyo being used in Japan as a genre less sounding. —Preceding signed comment added by MythSearcher^talk 01:19, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

Stephen Teo is a respected and much-published academic; Chinese Martial Arts Cinema is published by a well-known academic press; the citations for his claims include Ikuo Abe, a Japanese academic who has published a number of articles on the relationship between Japanese sport/athletics, adventure fiction, and militarism. He certainly qualifies as a reliable source. Bukyō appears in dictionaries and other sources (including the online tangorin.com) as "chivalry" (wuxia fails to appear in any form in some Chinese dictionaries). It was used for adventure fiction and magazines and publishing houses specializing in same in the early 20th century; the works of Shunro Oshikawa are important here. The term had also been used in the Tokugawa era in the context of bushido. A cite from another RS criticizing or contradicting Teo would be enough to modify or remove the claim; in the meantime I'm putting it back in. Ergative rlt (talk) 04:27, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

I really wonder. The so called Tongorin.com is the first google result march of a Japanese dict(with the search of "Bukyō" minus the anime name returned an overwhelmingly low result of 1390), it is in fact an online dictionary, and it started rather late compared to the Wuxia genre. I actually checked 3 printed paper Japanese dictionaries and got no results. And in fact, the entry in tangorin: 武侠小説 [ぶきょうしょうせつ] /(n) swashbuckling stories/martial arts fiction/chivalric knight novels/wuxia xiaoshuo/ actually gives credit to wuxia as well instead of stating wuxia as a calque. I am not saying it as not WP:RS, I am saying it as undue. Chinese and Japanese had a lot of words in common, because the current Japanese language basically originates from China. (At least the kanji and kana systems are). The fun fact is, quoting Japanese people claiming a Chinese word as a calque of Japanese sounded really biased. If you want another RS, This site quotes Japanese academic published information and have a thorough history of wuxia dating back to early/before Qin dynasty and said nothing about wuxia being a calque. If the information is of due weight, such a thorough research should include such information. —Preceding signed comment added by MythSearcher^talk 17:06, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

I removed it on the same basis. It is undue, and it is logically impossible to prove something's nonexistence, so proving it is not a calque is impossible. Yet the source claiming it to a calque is only a simgle one off appearance source, thus WP:UNDUE. The source, although is RS, does not state in itself where this information came from, by research or simple wild guess. —Preceding signed comment added by MythSearcher^talk 08:35, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

terminology and etymology

武侠 literally means martial/armed hero(es), or martial heroics, not martial artists as mentioned under the Wu Xia article.

游侠 literally reads wandering hero(es). In most, not all, wuxia stories, the protagonists are wandering martial artists who, voluntarily or not, right injustices.

江湖 literally means rivers and lakes. In wuxia, it is used in the stead of 社会, the modern Chinese words for "society".

There is no Japanese equivalent of the term 武侠. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Darkmax1974 (talk • contribs) 16:51, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

Two academic sources, cited in the article, disagree with you. Ergative rlt (talk) 20:38, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

The fun thing is, none of these are Chinese sources, in which, should be more knowledgeable about these terms and culture. I am pretty sure that most Chinese people, even those with thorough expertise in this particular topic, will not agree with the sources, which is pretty much speculative and ignored earlier culture, tradition and stories in China. In fact, as I posted above, even Japanese people gave different views. Anyway, WP:V states that wikipedia required verifiability, not truth, and [WP:NPOV]] states we present all notable views, so I guess if you can get two sources, you are welcome to do so here. —Preceding signed comment added by MythSearcher^talk 02:37, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

Films section omissions

In the Films section legendary wuxia movie director Tsui Hark and John Carpenter's spirited wuxia tribute film, Big Trouble in Little China, should probably be mentioned and linked. 50.54.228.188 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 16:22, 18 August 2011 (UTC).