Talk:Zoroastrianism

It was not found in Persia

Can someone edit that it wasn't found in Persia? Persia was much smaller and it was in modern South Western Iran which is quite small. And can also add that the Prophet Zoroaster was from Medya or Modern Kurdistan? There is evidence he was born In Medya / Modern Kurdistan. Also can someone add that the oldest and biggest temple is The Fire Temple? Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.7.106.197 (talk) 17:45, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

What was not found in Persia? As for the birthplace of Z, that's not known. Can you identify "the fire temple" and explain what you mean by 'oldest and biggest'? Paul B (talk) 18:27, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

As for the birth of Zoroaster, I said the same thing as you but when I did some research about it I did find that he was born in the Kurdish part of Iran. Its a recent discovery that not many know about yet. Also this is the website for the Fire Temple. http://zoroastrians.net/2010/03/05/largest-oldest-zoroasterian-fire-temple-of-kurdistan/ There is many more websites. Just write in google the Biggest Zoroastronism Fire Temple. It will give you a list of websites with the same answers.

I also meant Zoroastronism was not found in Persia. It was found in Modern Iran but definitely not in Persia. During the Median empire Persia was a vassal state and that was what the shape of Ancient Persia was.

I also do not want you to think that I am from Kurdistan. I am actually from the Netherlands and I know a lot about Zoroastronism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.7.106.197 (talk) 09:53, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

Zoroaster was either born in North Western Iran or North Eastern Iran. Can someone add that aswell? http://books.google.com/books?id=Uspf6eDDvjAC&pg=PA17&lpg=PA17&dq=Zoroaster+was+born+in+North+west+iran&source=bl&ots=OMynfA4kXb&sig=OSbQlXuGz-Ws1UKbTdkTBBFFejM&hl=en&ei=WHNzTsXhLIyEhQeMqdHTDA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CCIQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=Zoroaster%20was%20born%20in%20North%20west%20iran&f=false — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.7.106.197 (talk) 16:06, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

Fascinating !!! Most scholars, even Western scholars, believe that Zoroaster was born in Afghanistan. This is also the view of the sources in Wikipedia, just see under Zoroaster page for his place of birth. These things cannot be decided based on political allegiance and nationalism. You need proof. The most important thing to consider is the geography covered in Avesta, the holy book of Zoroastrianism. In that book, there are NO MENTION of either Medians nor Persians. All the lands described are in today's Afghanistan or its immediate surroundings. The greatest scholar from Harvard University actually places him in MIDDLE of Afghanistan, where you have the Buddhist statues (just read the page about Zoroaster, this debate was already settelled). His place of death is also known as Balkh, as also mentionned in Ferdowsi's Shanameh.--Kasparov49acer 08:41, 26 October 2011 (UTC)

Also, Avestan was an Eastern Aryan language, spoken in Bactria and Eastern Afghanistan, it was not spoken in Media or Persia, which actually didn't even exist at that time. It was centuries after that Zoroastrianism spread to Media and Persia.--Kasparov49acer 08:47, 26 October 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Yamaweiss (talk • contribs)

If you are going to change my edits, please have the curtosy of providing an explanation. I did explain a great deal above, and provided you with enough proof as well.--Kasparov49acer 08:50, 26 October 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Yamaweiss (talk • contribs)

By the late 20th century, some scholars had settled on an origin in Eastern Iran and/or Central Asia (to include present-day Afghanistan): Gnoli proposed Sistan (though in a much wider scope than the present-day province) as the homeland of Zoroastrianism; Frye voted for Bactria and Chorasmia;[15] Khlopin suggests the Tedzen Delta in present-day Turkmenistan.[16] Sarianidi considered the BMAC region as "the native land of the Zoroastrians and, probably, of Zoroaster himself."[17] Boyce includes the steppes of the former Soviet republics.[18] The medieval "from Media" hypothesis is no longer taken seriously, and Zaehner has even suggested that this was a Magi-mediated issue to garner legitimacy, but this has been likewise rejected by Gershevitch and others.--Kasparov49acer 08:53, 26 October 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Yamaweiss (talk • contribs)

How can Zoroaster be born in North East Iran, if there is no mention of Parthians in Avest ??? Also, Parthians were Western Iranians, while Zoroaster spoke Avestan.--Kasparov49acer 08:58, 26 October 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Yamaweiss (talk • contribs)

Please avoid WP:SYNTH (Using Avesta/shahnameh as source by Wikipedian editors is unacceptable per all. Also scholars do not use Avesta as source anymore: Myth). 1. Where(/when/how/if any) Zarathustra was born is unknown, (Read the article: most probable is Chorasmia or Inner Asian steppes of today Kazakhstan) or Sistan in between Iran- and today's Pakistan-Afghanistan. Later sources of Pahlavi era puts him In Media (Western Iran). There is a mention of magi in Zorostrian traditions which make the eastern-Western question more dificult. 2. Beginning of Zorostrianism is not birth date of Zarathustra. The religion (Mazdaism really) was truly founded as an "official" religion by "Achaemenid kings" (probably "people" were not involved here!). Though most up to date sources take Parthian (and Sasanid) as first confessed Zardostis and not "Mazdazadism". Note if we put specific pace/date of Zarathustra/Zorosterianism in the lead we make the article full of contradictory claims. If you have problem with "Iran" in the lead: just change to "Greater Iran" or delete that but do not make edits not suitable for lead per wp:lead. Thanks. Xashaiar (talk) 09:10, 26 October 2011 (UTC)

I am fine with Greater Iran. Take care.--Kasparov49acer 09:23, 26 October 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Yamaweiss (talk • contribs)

bad reference

"^ Foltz 2004, pp. 4–16" Nobody named Foltz is listed as an author in the references at the end of the article. Please provide the complete citation here. 4.248.220.248 (talk) 19:16, 17 November 2011 (UTC)

See reference 41. There is a complete citation, it just needs to be rearranged so the full one comes first. Ian.thomson (talk) 19:19, 17 November 2011 (UTC)

unattributed info

This entire article has serious issues with citations. The author needs to do a search on every "is believed", "is thought", and find a source that matches what the article says about whatever subject is under discussions. If "Whether Cyrus II was a Zoroastrian is subject to debate." tell who is debating it. Patrij (talk) 19:58, 17 November 2011 (UTC)

images from greatestbattles.iblogger.org

iblogger.org is on the blacklist[1] so images from it should not be used. See also the whitelist discussion|[2]

Graeme374 (talk) 04:08, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

What about images from the David Collection museum in Denmark? Ian.thomson (talk) 15:20, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Branches

It should be made clear in the intro or historical develppment that Zoroastrianism they are talking about is synonmous with Mazdeans. Mention should be give to Zurvanism and other extinct branches. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.4.158.160 (talk) 15:12, 23 December 2011 (UTC)

"The first surviving reference..."

"The first surviving reference to Zoroaster in Western scholarship is attributed to Thomas Browne (1605–1682)"

That's wrong. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroaster#Western_perceptions

As far back as Ancient Roman literature, we have references to him. Someone please correct this.

216.54.22.188 (talk) 17:23, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

Another biased wiki article

"he religion first dwindled when the Achaemenid Empire was invaded by Alexander III of Macedon, after which it collapsed and disintegrated[2] and it was further gradually marginalized by Islam from the 7th century onwards with the decline of the Sassanid Empire.[3]"

The statement above is simply a lie. Zoaroastranism was erracated by the arabs and Islam by the use of sword. Persians were forced to become Muslim, even though the article of course says they were not.

Won't bother changing the article, even though many sources back up this clear statement i just did. Why won't i? cause it wouldn't do any good, wikipedia is biased because of a corrupt leadership and will remain so.

81.170.132.28 (talk) 01:18, 3 December 2011 (UTC)

If you have reliable sources, as per our guidelines, they will be accepted. Try assuming good faith or you'll just come off as a troll that doesn't want to help.

However, I have to say that "eradicated" is a bit off as there are still Zoroastrians. Not some sort of Neo-Zoroastrians, but descended from the old ones and continuing their religion throughout the centuries.

Also, this article is more about the history of the religion, which existed outside of Iran. We do have a Muslim conquest of Persia article, which discusses the various scholarly views.

Again, try assuming good faith and it'll be more apparent that you want to help instead of complain. Ian.thomson (talk) 02:44, 3 December 2011 (UTC)

References in Western culture?

I was wondering if there should be a section to references in popular Western culture. I'm thinking along the lines of Nietzsche's Also sprach Zarathustra, Strauss's work of the same name, it's use in 2001: A Space Odyssey, and the reference in Heinlein's Tunnel in the Sky (Rod Walker's family are Zoroastrian). It might also include the use of Ahura Mazda's name for a car company and a brand of electric light bulbs.

this should be on one line not two?

Zoroastrianism at the Open Directory Project

(includes a list of Zoroastrian organizations)

99.19.43.221 (talk) 02:17, 3 January 2012 (UTC)

proselytizing

Plese link proselytizing to Proselytism under chapter Other characteristics? That bit doesn't have many wikilinks and I feel that word falls under techinical term / jargon. -195.148.29.73 (talk) 08:28, 4 January 2012 (UTC)