Talk:Rio de Janeiro school shooting

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Article name[edit]

I created a separate article a short time ago, Tasso da Silveira school shooting - because I hadn't managed to find this one.

I've now redirected it here.

The old version is here.

I suggest that, possibly, that title is a better name for the article?  Chzz  ►  15:25, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

Yeah the way it seems we name articles on school shootings is by the actual location and not the city. hbdragon88 (talk) 21:48, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
agreed, it needs to be the name of the school, not the city Skiendog (talk) 00:26, 8 April 2011 (UTC)
Most people have never heard of Realengo, but know of Rio de Janeiro. If this is the only shooting that has happened at a school in Rio, then the current title is best. Paul Smith 132 (talk) 11:39, 8 April 2011 (UTC)
Brazilian media and the portuguese wikipedia article name the shooting "Massacre do Realengo" maybe the english article should follow it?189.21.133.237 (talk) 10:18, 9 April 2011 (UTC)

Name of perpetrator[edit]

Is there some reason why the de has been taken out of his name? Sources say Wellington Menezes de Oliveira 74.231.46.68 (talk) 16:53, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

The BBC report currently has no "de" and we rely on reliable sources. It may be wrong, so let's hope we can find other sources to "fix" it. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:26, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
"Wellington Menezes de Oliveira" guardian.co.uk Brazil shooting: 12 children killed in school rampage ({Heroeswithmetaphors talk} 22:57, 7 April 2011 (UTC))
Brazilian Media also use "Wellington Menezes de Oliveira" g1.globo.com [1] RodrigoCruzatti (talk) 22:27, 11 April 2011 (UTC)
Both "Oliveira" and "de Oliveira" variants exist in Brazil, and both are fairly common family names. In this case he was "de Oliveira". By the way, in Brazil rules for family names are not so fixed as in other parts of the world, so people tend to laid more emphasis on given names than on family names, i.e, in lists, they invariably sort names alphabetically by the first letter of the given name, not the first letter of the last or family name. So, for example, in school archives the perpetrator would be listed under "W", for "Wellington". Outside Brazil, he should be listed under "D", the first letter of "de Oliveira" being "d", in minuscule, a in "de Havilland", not under "O" as in the Hispanic custom. Aldo L (talk) 17:14, 13 April 2011 (UTC)

Remove picture?[edit]

I know this is a controversial issue, but I think we should consider not displaying a picture of the perpetrator. Showing pictures like these to the world is attractive to others who are considering doing a murder-suicide as a way to get attention. Moreover, I don't think his picture really adds anything of worth to the article. Thoughts?Aaron (talk) 13:15, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

It is not Wikipedia's role to engineer society by constraining images of mass murderers. Provided the image is copyright-appropriate, then it is relevant to display the photograph as illustrative of the event. WWGB (talk) 13:25, 8 April 2011 (UTC)
We can't censor any information for whatever sake. The picture is relevant in that it portrays the kind of person that would commit such a crime, giving a certain glimpse of the mental susceptibilities behind it. 178.116.231.18 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 14:31, 8 April 2011 (UTC).
Are you saying the picture gives a mental disorder hit just looking at it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.79.143.244 (talk) 14:49, 9 April 2011 (UTC)

"It is not Wikipedia's role to engineer society" - but displaying the image may influence society. NuclearEnergy (talk) 02:00, 10 April 2011 (UTC)

Islamic or Christian?[edit]

While Police Colonel Djalma Beltrami alleged the perpetrator of being Islamic, it would seem that he was at least as much Christian from his suicide letter. The Old Testament contains similar prescriptions about "impurity," including adultery etc. It would be interesting if someone could find a source pointing this out to avoid misconceptions. A quick Google search revealed nothing so far. 178.116.231.18 (talk) 14:35, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

See below my corresponding edit in the perpetrator seciton. Createangelos (talk) 17:43, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

The man was crazy. Indeed, so crazy he believed to be an Islamic terrorist. That's the official police position at this time. However, the police is still investigating if he was encouraged by someone else. Aldo L (talk) 07:01, 13 April 2011 (UTC)

Perpetrator[edit]

Hi, I removed the speculation in the perpetrator section of whether the letter is muslim fundamentalist or Christian. This is not central to who the perpetrator is (ie the speculation is not central). If someone wants to start a section on religous speculation about the motive that is fine but not in the section about the perpetrator. Createangelos (talk) 17:42, 8 April 2011 (UTC) There is absolutely no references to Islamic Fundamentalism in the letter. A policeman refered to him as "Taleban like", but that means "as violent, radical and religious as a Taleban". The reference of Islamic Fundamentalism should be removed, lest english readers, which already may have a strong bias against Islamic Religion, be confused. The references in the letter are all about the Christian Bible. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.55.161.38 (talk) 14:02, 9 April 2011 (UTC)

I think that the removal is not warranted. He was both a Muslim and a Jehovah Witness. Of course, psychologists down here are pointing to this fact as a proof that he had some sort of split personality, schizophrenic or whatever. The point is that he was no longer a rational man. By the way, it is funny to see both religions denying that he was an adept of them. So, was he an atheist or what? That's the same as denying that the folks who built the Atom Bomb were scientists. Ha! Aldo L (talk) 07:14, 13 April 2011 (UTC)

Third incident like this[edit]

http://g1.globo.com/bom-dia-brasil/noticia/2011/04/psiquiatra-diz-que-atirador-era-psicotico-e-vivia-realidade-paralela.html

"Bom Dia Brasil talked to psychiatrist Ana Beatriz Barbosa Silva for commenting about the shooter's mind. She remembered that, contrarily to what is said, it is not the first time a disaster like this happens in Brazil. There was a case in 2003, in Taiuva, São Paulo countryside, and in 2004, in Remanso, Bahia countryside. 'Youths that studied in the schools came back and shooted. There were deaths, but not so seriously and with this dimention', she said, refering to the attack in Realengo." Denis Rizzoli (talk) 13:38, 9 April 2011 (UTC)

About the Perpetrator section[edit]

This section is filled with POV statements, he is not muslin, and in his letters he clearly states he was Christian and citing the bible in his suicidal notes. And in the source cited in this section does not say that he was Muslim, but that he visited a mosque in an attempt to find forgiveness from his parents. Eduemoni↑talk↓ 19:48, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

His suicide letter states that he studied the Koran 4 hours a day and went to the downtown Rio De Janeiro Mosque and that he considered Islam to be the only correct religion and that he befriended a foreigner from overseas called Abdul who boasted to have been involved in the sept 11 events. He also stated that he wanted to move to Egypt or Malaysia. So clearly, you are absolutely correct, there is absolutely no evidence that he was a Muslim convert and it would be a far fetched idea to think so. Thank you for pointing that out Demonsanto (talk) 04:17, 12 April 2011 (UTC)

File:Wellington Menezes de Oliveira.jpg Nominated for Deletion[edit]

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