Talk:Algeria

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Former good article Algeria was one of the Geography and places good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
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GDP A JOKE?[edit]

GDP $659 billion? check the source given (IMF), it's $139 billion in 2009. please correct that —Preceding unsigned comment added by 136.227.197.191 (talk) 05:14, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

I agree! IP 68.147.201.79 has been vandalizing this article, I have corrected the GDP figures once for it to get vandalized again by the same person! A moderator needs to lock that data from being edited! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.209.34.22 (talk) 05:20, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

PLEASE SOMEONE BLOCK THAT TROLL! he did it again! GDP is wrong and he/she knows it! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 136.227.197.191 (talk) 00:30, 12 January 2011 (UTC)

Maps[edit]

LocationAlgeria.svg AFRICA Location Algeria.png
According with some European countries consensus, many countries discussed about these two maps, Algeria not yet, but it seems that european users think to have the right to change all maps of Africa because it. Obviously the orange one looks more professional and all the continent is separated with the world.--TownDown How's it going? 14:39, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

I must confess that it's difficult to understand your English, but I take it that you try to argue the case that your maps are better? Be that as it may, we follow consensus here on Wikipedia and your way forward should be to try to convince others about the quality of your maps, not to engage in an edit war against the established consensus. And please refrain from dragging in other contributors' nationalities, it is completely irrelevant and doesn't strengthen your argument one bit.JdeJ (talk) 19:20, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
Stop hand nuvola.svg Don't accuse me to convince others about quality of my maps or dragging in other contributors' nationalities. You can be reported. --TownDown How's it going? 21:23, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
So first you use other's ethnicity in your arguments, then you threaten with reporting me when I point that out. As I've said before, it's deplorable that you always resort to intimidation instead of trying to argue your case with factual arguments.JdeJ (talk) 09:52, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
The proponent has been temporarily blocked for edit warring and incivility, directly arising from the addition of maps of this style to a number of articles. Not only is the map (with a horrid Mercator projection) inconsistent with the locator maps in most country articles but has done so without substantial discussion and limited to no consensus. This map is not agreeable; consequently, I have restored the prior long-standing map. I believe a renewed consensus needs to be demonstrated before the map is changed again. Thoughts? Bosonic dressing (talk) 02:27, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

Climate[edit]

"The highest official temperature was 50.6 °C (123.1 °F) at In Salah."[41]

Official maybe, but given that El-Azizia in neighbouring Libya has apparently recorded 58^C (136.4^F), I think one of two things is true, Either Algeria's figure is too low, or El Azizia's is too high. A difference of 7.4^C between the two national records is simply not credible in my view. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Meltingpot (talkcontribs) 11:35, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Meltingpot (talk) 11:36, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

(Or of course both could be true; Algeria's record could be too low and Libya's too high.)

Meltingpot (talk) 08:11, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Language, again[edit]

"all Algerian dialects are in fact an arabic-berber mix, none is pure arabic or pure berber"

Can't we get this pseudo information out of here? See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mixed_language and ask for example the author of the blog http://lughat.blogspot.com/ 91.152.248.219 (talk) 20:15, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

I agree with the above. While it is true that Algerian Arabic has a Berber substratum and it is equally true that the Berber languages have been influence by Arabic, that statement makes it seem as if Berber and Arabic are dialects of the same language or at least very closely related. As that is not the case, the statement is misleading.JdeJ (talk) 20:30, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

Berber World[edit]

Algeria is considered by Berbers to be a part of the Berber World.

This affirmation is not clear. It came after mentioning Algeria's affiliation to known international entities (to my knowledge there is no international organization named Berber World). The problem lies in "What is the Berber World?". After clicking the wiki-link, it redirected me to Berber People article. A google test gave only 1,420 hits. This misleading part will be removed unless verifiable information are provided. --Bestofmed™msg↵〉 14:36, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

I've removed it. carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 20:55, 8 July 2009 (UTC)


Inconsistency[edit]

TENOR COMPTE D E S FUSEAUX HORAIRES DIFFERENTS EUROPE AFRICA

ALGERIA PAYS D AFRIQUE VOIR CI DESSOUS http://www.fuseau-horaire.com/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.222.112.219 (talk) 15:08, 18 August 2013 (UTC)

The information box lists Algeria as a single-party state but the politics segment says it has 40 parties. I take it the latter is true.

Plagiarism[edit]

The information pertaining to the climate of Algeria under the geography section can also be found at this address: http://ancienthistory.about.com/od/atlas/qt/climateAlgeria.htm Climate information belongs in a separate subsection titled "Climate" and it should be original writing. Thoughts? TravisWichtendahl (talk) 07:20, 19 July 2009 (UTC)TravisWichtendahl

Economic role of women[edit]

The following paragraph is sourced to a reliable source, but has been removed twice [1] [2] by a new editor for no obvious reason. This material is clearly relevant to the Demographics section, and I am restoring it. The same editor is also blanket reverting other minor edits, e.g. grammar corrections. Please keep an eye on this.

Women make up 70 percent of Algeria's lawyers and 60 percent of its judges. Women dominate medicine. Increasingly, women are contributing more to household income than men. Sixty percent of university students are women, according to university researchers.<ref>{{cite news|last=Slackman |first=Michael |url=http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/26/world/africa/26algeria.html |title=A Quiet Revolution in Algeria: Gains by Women - New York Times |doi=Algeria |publisher=Nytimes.com |date=May 26, 2007 |accessdate=2008-11-24}}</ref>

85.94.186.91 (talk) 00:25, 1 September 2009 (UTC) [3] see the links —Preceding unsigned comment added by Satheezmbs (talkcontribs) 10:17, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

Relationship to the world[edit]

For the ones interested in using an icon for the relationship between Algeria and the world at large I would like to contribute with an image should it be needed. Thanks--Camilo Sanchez (talk) 05:48, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

File:Coat of arms of planet earth algeria.svg
Coat of arms of Planet Earth with the nae of Algeria

Most Algerians consider themselves Arabs[edit]

Why is there no mention of Arabs in the Demographics section.

Who ever wrote it should be ashamed of themselves for being so blatantly biased.

Writing what you wish does not mean it will ever happen. dfssdf Shame on you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.229.205.120 (talk) 01:55, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

It's not a question of bias, but of simple omission. I've added a stat from the child article. --NeilN talk to me 02:01, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

Sorry for seeming to be harsh in my comments but I have always known that the overwhelming majority of Algerians to be proud of their combined Arab and Berber heritage, yes both Arab and Berber and not Berber alone. Reading the Demographics section there was not one mention of the Arab aspect of Algeria. This to me appears intentional. There is, without a doubt, a massive bias towards Arabs on Wikipedia articles related to ethnicity, history, religion, etc. The Article about Algeria feeds into this phenomenon. Just as an interesting side note, even when listening to Algerian music, there are countless songs where the singer highlights his/her pride in their Arab origin. Just listen to Cheb Khaled's music! Arabs also have a deep fondness for Algeria and consider it as a role model for sacrafice against foreign occupation and colonialism. I know for certian that Arabs everywhere will cheer for their sole representitive in the world cup.

~~There are no Arabs in Algeria and whole of North Africa, that stupid fairy tale of thousand and one night is not considerd as a reliable history among people with brains. North Aricans like those living in Morocco, Algeria, Tunis an Libya are Imazighen(berbers, this countries have also a small minority of people with different origins who came to North Africa of a living. Arabians live in the Middle East not in North Africa ~~

Really? So why does the Algerian constitution indicate that Algeria as an Arab land. Please refer to the Preamble of the constitution if you don't believe me. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.229.67.184 (talk) 18:42, 19 September 2013 (UTC)

Since when did the Algerian wrote any the Algerian constitution, the first time they won a free election and wanted to control their own state, they got murderd by the Algerian regime which is 100% a French puppet Regime. More than 200.000 Algerians were brutally murderd. So please get lost with your so called fake the Algerian constitution of yours. Algeria is a North African country which is populated by Imazighen(Berbers'. The Algerians who speak an Arabic DIALECT and not Arabic were brutally forced to Arabise since the French colinsation. The French wanted to divide the cou8ntry so that they can control the resources. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zanati (talkcontribs) 15:46, 21 November 2013 (UTC)


The demographics section was inaccurate because of back and forth POV pushing and exaggerations, just before the protection of the article on an arbitrary version (due to massive vandalism after the world-cup match, which made meaningful edits impossible), so nothing really intentional here: just some unreverted vandalism.
It still seems though that the languages subsection does not reflect the cited sources correctly. Antipastor (talk) 10:21, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
I changed it now to what is stated in the reference (in french): there were gross exaggerations of both Arabic and Berber dialects percentages. However, it could be helpful to corroborate the data with more sources. Antipastor (talk) 10:40, 7 December 2009 (UTC)

French rule -- Denoeux[edit]

Between 1830 and 1847 50,000 French people emigrated to Algeria,[31] but the conquest was slow because of intense resistance from such people as Emir Abdelkader, Ahmed Bey and Fatma N'Soumer. Indeed, the conquest was not technically complete until the early 1900s when the last Tuareg were conquered by General Guilain P. Denoeux. -- This is wrong.

Guilain Denoeux is a professor at Colby College who teaches Middle eastern politics and not a French general.

Removed. Antipastor (talk) 16:29, 10 December 2009 (UTC)


Genocide[edit]

The French invaded Algiers in 1830. The conquest of Algeria by the French was long and particularly violent, and it resulted in the disappearance of about a third of the Algerian population. France was responsible for the extermination of 1.5 million Algerians. According to Olivier Le Cour Grandmaison, the French pursued a policy of extermination against the Algerians.


1.5 million Algerians died during the Algerian War of Independence. Genocide which was committed by the French.

Algerians argue that the massacres should be named as genocide and France must apologise to the Algerians[1] [2] However the French do not accept the claims. Algeria's President Abdelaziz Bouteflika says that French colonization of his country Algeria was a form of genocide link title. In memoirs, some French officers have described torture of Algerians during the war. Edouard Sablier, for instance, one of the soldiers who took part in the repression, later described the situation: “Everywhere in the towns there were camps surrounded by barbed wire containing hundreds of suspects who had been arrested… Often, when we set out to inspect an isolated hamlet in the mountains, I heard people say, ‘We should punish them by taking away their crops’.” [3] A paper called Ohé Partisans, published by the French Trotskyists, described Sétif as an “Algerian Oradour”. Oradour was a French town where the Nazi occupiers had murdered over 600 people, including children. [4]

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.208.180.240 (talk) 19:28, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

stop Vandalism[edit]

Egyptian from Cairo sabotage the content of Algerian pages here , see [[4]]Please...?. ترجمان05 (talk)

Islamists loot and burn protestant church in Algeria[edit]

This Israeli site: [JP] writes:"Islamists loot and burn protestant church in Algeria".Agre22 (talk) 23:03, 11 January 2010 (UTC)agre22

Languages[edit]

Algeria is a trilingual country - we speak Arabic, Berber (Tamazight), and French. However, the latter two are rather underrepresented on the page. Should French not be mentioned as a "Second Language" on the page, as it is on the Tunisia entry ? Or the name of the country be listed in the body text of the page in Algerian (colloquial) Arabic and French ? Arabic is spoken by well over ninety-five percent of all Algerians, French is spoken by nearly two-thirds of the country, according to the OIF, and Tamazight is spoken by a significant population, as well. Why not, then, recognize all three as equally valuable, historically, culturally, and practically ?—Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.169.62.105 (talk) 05:48, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Wikipedia has a tendency to follow the countries official policies. Thus you can see "English" in Madagascar's infofox but not in Sweden's (the fact that most Swedes know English and that most Malagasies don't, is apparently irrelevant), similarly Madagascar is shown on the map of the English-speaking world but Sweden is not. The same goes for Algeria, where French is the second language, but the government's attitude towards it is schizophrenic because on one hand it detests the French language, and on the other they continue to use it. Aaker (talk) 23:41, 15 February 2010 (UTC)
That's not necessarily true. It follows what reliable sources say about the prevalence of a language in a country and how influential it is. Remember that there is no official language of the USA, but articles in non-English Wikipedias about US government agencies still put the English names in, because English is the de facto language of the USA. WhisperToMe (talk) 08:51, 13 October 2012 (UTC)
I have algerian origines and I don't know why you put english as part of the spoken languages, it's ridiculous ! And the french language is largely used in secondary school, they do not hate french language ! Please remove emglish. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.137.171.31 (talk) 17:18, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

Presidential Terms[edit]

I am going to have a go at re-writing the first two sentences of the Poitics section as at the moment they are a bit confusing Tigerboy1966 (talk) 11:50, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

Inconsistent spelling: Bugia/Bujia[edit]

Under Spanish Enclaved, the first paragraph says "Bugia" and the second "Bujia".

Pre-History[edit]

"Author Terrence McKenna has hypothesised Algeria as the source of the myth of the Garden of Eden and the birth of humanity. Before the warming brought on by the Holocene Climatic Optimum around 7,000 years ago, the region contained vast grasslands which, along with the representations of cattle in the Tassili Plateau art, suggests the existence of early forms of pastoral agriculture. This would seem to be a logical precursor to the crop-based agriculture that developed in the Middle East in the agricultural revolution thousands of years later.

The ancient paintings are also a clear indication of a form of shamanism or religion based on the use of psychedelic mushrooms. This is another reason why the region was proposed by McKenna as the cradle of culture and civilization, as the visions induced by these mushrooms give a powerful impulse towards art, painting and the sense of contact with the supernatural that is the basis of religious belief. McKenna, T. (1992). Food of the Gods, The Search for the Original Tree of Knowledge: A Radical History of Plants, Drugs and Human Evolution. Bantam Books. p. 70. "

I added the following earlier today and it was removed arbitrarily by an editor who was not signed it, with no reason given whatsoever. Perhaps if this addition seems too definitive it could be altered. No-one, not even Terrence McKenna himself, claims that his theories are definitely true, but at the same time given the archaeological evidence they are certainly plausible. I believe my addition is thought-provoking and that there is no reason to leave it out.

I'd have to do some investigating but the Arabs arrived in Algeria later than 642...about 20 years later..

"Author Terrence McKenna has hypothesised Algeria as the source of the myth of the Garden of Eden and the birth of humanity."... "This is another reason why the region was proposed by McKenna as the cradle of culture and civilization"
I don't think the piece of text that you added is clear on what it proposes. Does it mean that the myth of "paradise" (as told in the bible/quran/whatever) originated in ancient algeria, or does the cited author propose that civilization or/and the human race itself originated in ancient algeria? Either of these theories must be regarded as very controversial and the whole question of where these phenomena arose is extremely strange because they most likely originate in various palces independently. There is actually considerable consensus on where the first instances of "civilization" are to be located (Egypt, Mesopotamia). Regardless of that isn't this rather speculative material more apropriate for the separate article on Algeria's history? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.234.185.68 (talk) 14:54, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

[I edited the first comment above to remove the <ref> tags and show the citation.] Terence McKenna's theories are at least controversial; at best far out of the scientific mainstream. I don't think he's in any way a reliable source. His idea about the Garden of Eden might be acceptable if it's identified as very speculative. The part about the mushrooms can (in my opinion) only be wishful thinking on the part of a long-time apologist, and should be removed from the article. -- BPMullins | Talk 16:30, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

This section was removed from the article due to being speculative and unhistorical. Terrence McKenna is not a historian and his word should not be taken as such. I have had to remove this from the article over eight times now, and it keeps getting added back in. While I appreciate that someone out there clearly has a love for Terrence McKenna, and while I will say that some of his theories are interesting, they are just that. Theories. He is making an unfounded theory about the "Garden of Eden" which may or may not have existed and as such it has no place in the history of Algeria. If you absolutely must discuss this, you may do so on Terrence McKenna's page, or the Garden of Eden page. This is not the place for it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.158.142.187 (talk) 15:27, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

literacy plummeted,[36] while land development uprooted much of the population.[edit]

You will need to find another source. The source doesn't state that literacy plummeted. It states that the use of advanced Arabic plummeted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.234.222.35 (talk) 10:14, 30 December 2010 (UTC)

IP 68.147.201.79 a TROLL[edit]

please someone block him/her. keeps changing the GDP —Preceding unsigned comment added by 136.227.197.191 (talk) 00:39, 12 January 2011 (UTC)

Please edit reference #44[edit]

Please edit the reference number 44 from: "http://graphics.eiu.com/PDF/Democracy_Index_2010_web.pd" to "http://graphics.eiu.com/PDF/Democracy_Index_2010_web.pdf". I can't edit because the article is blocked. --KJEFRNNF (talk) 02:51, 10 May 2011 (UTC)

History section a bit long?[edit]

Doesn't the history section seem a bit long for a country's main article? Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie | Say Shalom! 04:56, 25 June 2011 (UTC)

Ottoman History[edit]

I was reading over the article just now and the section on "Ottoman rule" seems to be primarily about the Barbary Corsairs and not the overall history of Algeria under Ottoman rule. Some of the text is also redundant (most of the paragraph regarding the Barbarossa brothers). I was wondering if the information about the Barbary Corsairs should either be deleted or put under a new heading? Cheywoodward2 (talk) 22:33, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

Origin of the name[edit]

The fact that "Jazair" means "the islands" in Arabic isn't a plausible etymology, as there are no islands there. The name of the country comes from the city of Algiers which is called natively "Dzayr"; Ziri ibn Manad founded the city and that name is likely derived from his name. Then it was Arabized when reported in Arabic. Does anyone have more info on this? Tachfin (talk) 09:30, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

I understand that there were islands offshore Algiers, but there was a landfill in the past few centuries.

Enc. of Islam II "Djazair"


"The Arabs applied the name of the islets to the town, which was founded in the 4th/10th century on the mainland opposite them."


Deriving the name from the Zirids is folk etymology. I prefer that this be indicated.

Mazghanna was not spelled correctly in Classical Arabic. I corrected it, according to Enc. of Islam II and Arabic Wikipedia.

Also I would like to see the Berber name spelled out in Tifinagh Ybgursey (talk) 09:22, 21 October 2011 (UTC)

You're right this seems to be nothing more than a folk etymology. The name is spelled in Tifinagh in an end note since there has been opposition to include it in the main text. Tachfin (talk) 06:01, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

Algeria's Arab Ethnicity[edit]

Algeria's ethnic groups is well known to it's inhabitants and to historians. The bulk and overwhelming majority of it's inhabitants are of Arab origin. Let's be mature and stop ignoring stark reality here folks. Thank you. (~Canadian2000)

What matters here is that information is supported by reliable sources, which is the case.
Wikipedia is not a place to right great wrongs; that is we only add material that has been published in reliable sources, it is not our job to decide on what is "reality".
In addition to The World Factbook, I've found a list of other reliable sources that directly support what you've been trying to delete. There is no justification in Wikipedia to remove reliably-cited verifiable material:
  1. 'Historical records of the Arab conquest, however, suggest that its demographic impact must have been limited (McEvedy 1980). In addition, genetic evidence shows that E3b2 is rare in the Middle East (Semino et al. 2004), making the Arabs an unlikely source for this frequent North African lineage' [5], PubMed, United States National Library of Medicine
  2. 'The overwhelming majority of the population is Berber but only about 20% actually identify themselves as Berber pp21, Encyclopedia of the Peoples of Africa and the Middle East: L to Z (2009)
  3. 'Even today it is estimated that the majority of the Algerian and Moroccan population is of Berber origin' pp263, Case studies on human rights and fundamental freedoms: a world survey, Volume 1
  4. 'In reality almost all Algerians are Berber in origin' pp10, The Report: Algeria 2008
  5. 'almost all Algerians are Berber in origin' pp9, The Report: Algeria 2011
Furthermore, respectable historians support this view (Ibn Khaldun, Gabriel Camps, Charles-André Julien) Tachfin (talk) 09:25, 30 October 2011 (UTC)

So the bulk of your sources are Western. Why don't you ask what the majority of Algerians identify themselves as. The answer is simply Arab. There is no denying that the Berbers are an integral part of that identity too.If you wish something it doesn't mean it is going to become a reality. Please be fair and unbiased — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.229.67.184 (talk) 18:38, 19 September 2013 (UTC)

Omitted province in the picture[edit]

In the Provinces and districts section, the picture representing each province is missing #43 (Mila). Can someone please edit the picture?Terrorist96 (talk) 03:47, 7 January 2012 (UTC)

Can you be more clear about the missing ones please? --Dzlinker (talk) 20:30, 14 February 2012 (UTC)

He means can someone please put Mila Province in the picture of all the provinces.Oakley77 (talk) 02:20, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

GA Review[edit]

This review is transcluded from Talk:Algeria/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: WhatamIdoing (talk · contribs) 21:08, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

This article does not meet the Good article criteria. Among other problems, it fails criterion 2b for having zero inline citations in multiple entire sections, including "Classical period" "Boumediene Era", "Post war", "Geography", etc. It also has multiple {{citation needed}} tags. These constitute a WP:CHALLENGE to the material and must be resolved before an article can meet the GA criteria.

I would encourage the nominator to more carefully consider the state of articles like this before nominating any others. WhatamIdoing (talk) 21:08, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Independence recognized before declared?[edit]

Really? seems unusual... Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 > haneʼ 18:40, 5 July 2012 (UTC)

600,000 to 2 million Turks[edit]

http://books.google.com/books?id=NcYrAQAAIAAJ&q=%22Turks+in+Algeria%22&dq=%22Turks+in+Algeria%22&hl=en&sa=X&ei=HjYDUIezK4iF4gTu1O3zBw&ved=0CDsQ6AEwAg

"Thus there are no longer any Turks in Algeria, Tunis, or Egypt. In Algeria even the Kulugls, sons of Turks, have disappeared." - Smithsonian report, 1908. Saint-Michel-de-Montaigne (talk) 21:31, 15 July 2012 (UTC)

Valid, but single and old source. Multiple other sources disagree. "Disappeared" is a suspiciously strong claim. Turks in Algeria is the article to start with. Materialscientist (talk) 23:16, 15 July 2012 (UTC)
Yep, see that article then. Saint-Michel-de-Montaigne (talk) 00:31, 16 July 2012 (UTC)
After the french invasion, almost every turk run away to his homeland. No turks in Algeria. - Dzlinker (talk) 14:11, 16 July 2012 (UTC)

Dzlinker is correct. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.218.67.253 (talk) 20:10, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

Many Algerian Turks went to France, not Turkey. There are still many Turks in Algeria, albeit most have been Arabized. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.145.47.207 (talk) 16:49, 15 February 2014 (UTC)

Delete[edit]

Wikipedia was supposed to need sources, why do feel the need to revert my edits.--UnsourcedBlanker222 (talk) 12:56, 18 July 2012 (UTC)

As I explained to you in your talk, it is better to find sources than to remove material. --John (talk) 12:59, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
Because your edits are pointy [6] --NeilN talk to me 13:00, 18 July 2012 (UTC)

Slaves unreferenced[edit]

This passage remains unsourced from August 2011: "According to Robert Davis, from the 16th to 19th century, pirates captured 1 million to 1.25 million Europeans as slaves. These slaves were captured mainly from seaside villages in Italy, Spain and Portugal, and from farther places like France, England, Ireland, the Netherlands, Germany, Poland, Russia, Scandinavia and even Iceland, India, Southeast Asia and North America."

I propose removing these statements forthwith (pending your comments). Nickrz (talk) 17:58, 1 September 2012 (UTC)

Hi
You may want to read this: [7].
Regards. - Dzlinker (talk) 21:53, 2 November 2012 (UTC)
Direct quote from your source: "(Yet) it is striking that we have only the vaguest idea of the overall magnitude of the slave traffic in white Europeans.." I might suggest a "vaguest idea" does not constitute referent fact. Nickrz (talk) 16:27, 3 November 2012 (UTC)

French in lede[edit]

I think the French name should be in the infobox, along with the Arabic and Tifinagh name. The French name should be in the lede too. I tried to search for previous discussions, but the search engine didn't seem to find any. Even though French is not an official language, it is clearly a de facto working language of the government WhisperToMe (talk) 21:10, 13 September 2012 (UTC)

I agree, but someone already added it anyway. I think something similar should be added to the Morocco and Algeria pages too.--Cymru123 (talk) 15:19, 28 September 2012 (UTC)
I disagree. I think you're mistaking Algeria, Morocco and Tunisia with sub-saharan countries. In the administration, arabic is the only accepted and official language. In court for instance, french is not tolerated and lawyers as well as judges etc... only write/speak in arabic. French is the first foreign language due to the colonization of the Maghreb. However there is a STRONG and HUGE difference between sub-saharan countries, where french is the only lingua franca, and the Maghreb, where french is only used as a second language, in parallel to arabic. In fact, with the new generations, french tends to be less attractive and english is more and more studied and learned. French is NOT a de facto national language. --Strongful (talk) 17:39, 29 September 2012 (UTC)
Don't worry, I'm not mistaking the situation of French in Algeria, Morocco, and Tunisia for those of sub-Saharan countries. I've read through various Algerian government ministry websites. Some are only available in French. I did some research and wrote new content for Languages_of_Algeria#French - The thing is, Maghreb Arabic is not intelligible with MSA Arabic. The mother tongue isn't used in government in the Maghreb any more than it is used in sub-Saharan Africa. MSA Arabic was introduced in the post-colonial era to try to replace French. Some ministries were "Arabized" but not all of them were. While the Justice Department was Arabized, the Ministry of Transport's website is only available in French: http://www.ministere-transports.gov.dz/ - The sourced material from "Languages_of_Algeria#French" should explain everything. The sourced material also says that French is becoming more popular in Algeria, not less, so that contradicts the assertion that, in Algeria, "with the new generations, french tends to be less attractive and english is more and more studied and learned." WhisperToMe (talk) 05:24, 13 October 2012 (UTC)

Well, the CIA World Factbook says https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/ag.html that French is a "lingua franca." I think that wraps it up :) WhisperToMe (talk) 05:29, 13 October 2012 (UTC)

  • As a note, with Lebanon, the CIA factbook only states "French" is a language, along with English and Armenian, spoken in Lebanon. It isn't labeled as a lingua franca or a language of commerce, business, government, and/or diplomacy. Looking at Morocco and Tunisia, French for Morocco is "often the language of business, government, and diplomacy" and French for Tunisia is a language of commerce, with Arabic being the other language of commerce WhisperToMe (talk) 05:45, 13 October 2012 (UTC)

Image in the demo section[edit]

Algerian students cramming before an exam
rural Algerian girl after the Independance in 1962.

An anonymous editor opposes the inclusion of the image to the right in the article because it's supposedly "Arabist propaganda". He insists on including an anachronistic picture of a girl from the 1960s instead (to the left). I think that using contemporary images (not necessarily this one) is always preferable. Any comment on the issue is most welcome.--eh bien mon prince (talk) 23:15, 14 January 2013 (UTC)

contemporary, definitely; I don't see Arabist propaganda, but if it makes people happy, just pick a different one... Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 > haneʼ 23:22, 14 January 2013 (UTC)
I looked around on Flickr for another image that might be suitable to illustrate this section, but I didn't find any of similar quality. Perhaps our anonymous friend can provide us with an image that he finds acceptable.--eh bien mon prince (talk) 20:12, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
Y'know, I'll give it another 2 hours or so, then I'll just put back the schoolgirls; just let me do it. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 > haneʼ 22:13, 15 January 2013 (UTC)


First the quality of the picture is poor, the subject is silly, 3 girls looking at a piece of paper is not very representative of Algerian girls. The picture on the left is more representative as it shows the normal dressing of an Algerian farmer girl.
This without signaling the islamist-arabist propaganda as if algerian girls were all head scarfed, the left picture shows the real traditional clothing of an Algerian girl.
This is innacceptable, and User:Underlying lk please sign with your real login. -- [ Chanqariḥa (el εajeeb) ] 20:38, 17 January 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Chanqariḥa (talkcontribs)
(Maybe you could sign at all before you complain about others) It's inappropriate to show a 1960s image of a nostalgic bygone era when that doesn't show contemporary reality; whether you like it or not, there are girls who wear hijabs these days. You are free to provide a contemporary picture that might suit your agenda, but a throwback to what used to be half a century ago is not it. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 > haneʼ 20:47, 17 January 2013 (UTC)


Algerians in traditional costumes.jpg
This is a good picture that features the traditional dress of Algerian women -- Chanqariḥa (el εajeeb) 22:20, 17 January 2013 (UTC)
Note that Chanqariḥa has requested the deletion of the 'schoolgirls' picture here.--eh bien mon prince (talk) 02:11, 18 January 2013 (UTC)

Cinema & Arabization sections deleted!![edit]

I've been browsing the history of that sadly poor article, and a subsection about cinema have been deleted. Another one about arabization had the same issue. Those are important cultural elements concerning Algeria. No explanation were given on the actual tp. I propose to bring them back. -- Chanqariḥa (el εajeeb) 22:36, 17 January 2013 (UTC)

Not every edit has to be explained on the talk page. The edit summaries exist for a reason. If you had bothered to read them, you would have known that the cinema section can now be found in Algerian cinema, while much of the Arabization section was deleted because it was unsourced. Hence, I reject your proposal.--eh bien mon prince (talk) 02:17, 18 January 2013 (UTC)
The copy isn't a complete one, content has been omitted. I'll add it back later. For the arabization section, i'm going to search for ressources. Arabization is a fact, algerians were subject to a brutal holocaust as well as an apartheid called Indigénat. arabization purpose was to reverse the consequences of that coloniale policies. So its important to the country's history. cheers -- Chanqariḥa (el εajeeb) 07:41, 18 January 2013 (UTC)
Just make sure that you add them to the proper article, and that they're adequately sourced.--eh bien mon prince (talk) 09:25, 18 January 2013 (UTC)



So i guess we've got a consensus with the picture i gave. -- Chanqariḥa (el εajeeb) 07:42, 18 January 2013 (UTC)

I actually still prefer the schoolgirls, I seriously doubt that the picture you propose is representative of modern Algerian women.--eh bien mon prince (talk) 09:25, 18 January 2013 (UTC)

Page notice about the use of French[edit]

Is it really necessary? These page notices are rather annoying, they should be used only as last resort--eh bien mon prince (talk) 06:14, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

I placed the notice because there had been a discussion in which I explained on the talk page (Talk:Algeria#French_in_lede) that French needed to be used, and that seemed to be resolved (I engaged in a similar discussion related to Morocco), and yet drive-by editors keep removing it. However there has been an inquiry about my use of page notices at Talk:Emory_University#Location_of_Emory_university.2C_confirming as there is a need to allow anonymous users to be involved in the process, so you may wish to read it. WhisperToMe (talk) 21:36, 18 February 2013 (UTC)
Before using something as visible as that we could try with a hidden comment in the wikicode, like <!--don't remove the French names of the country without discussion-->! Perhaps that will be enough.--eh bien mon prince (talk) 12:13, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
We could try that out. Unfortunately I've had cases where anonymous users ignored hidden comment codes alone. We could see if the comment alone does the trick, and see what happens... WhisperToMe (talk) 18:40, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
I think we should try that. Besides, if someone is determined to disregard comments in the code, the page notice won't make much of a difference.--eh bien mon prince (talk) 13:59, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
From my understanding page notices tend to jump out more than comments (which is why I used them), but I'll try the code thing and see how it goes WhisperToMe (talk) 05:56, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Petroleum topic is badly neglected[edit]

I'm surprised that this article says virtually nothing about petroleum-industry developments in the modern history of Algeria. "Hydrocarbons" are given the briefest passing nod, though it's stated that "[Algeria's] economy is oil based" in the article's inroductory paragraphs. Algeria became independent in 1962, and one would imagine prior to that point that the French would have been extremely interested in the country's oil reserves and probably would have been building infrastructure of some sort (exploration, drilling installations, refinement... what??). How did this industry develop to be key to the modern economy of the country?

Here's a clue I found in a very quick Google search: http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/211669?uid=3739392&uid=2129&uid=2&uid=70&uid=3737720&uid=4&sid=21101735439911

By the way even the article on French Algeria says nothing about the oil-industry topic, either.

I'm not posting this because I know the story on this subject. It's just that the article leaves the reader uninformed. There's a big deficiency.Joel Russ (talk) 16:03, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Etymology[edit]

The theory of Berber origin is a brand-new hypothesis proposed and self-published online by a person who, apparently only has credentials as a journalist. Not a WP:Reliable Source by Wikipedia standards. The theory may well be true for all I know, and I very much sympathise with the Berbers and dislike Arabisation, but it is still a fringe theory and the author has an obvious nationalist axe to grind, so it shouldn't be on Wikipedia until it becomes more widely accepted. I'm not deleting it personally, because I'm not in the mood for having an edit war with angry nationalists, but somebody should.--91.148.130.233 (talk) 15:05, 9 May 2013 (UTC)

The theory of Berber origin must write in Berber people no in Algeria --Great11 (talk) 04:37, 29 August 2013 (UTC)

Introduction[edit]

The territory of today's Algeria was the home of many ancient prehistoric cultures, including Aterian and Capsian cultures. Its area has known many empires and dynasties, including ancient Berber Numidians, Carthaginians, Romans, Vandals, Byzantines, Arab Umayyads, Berber Fatimids, Berber Almoravids, Berber Almohads and later Turkish Ottomans. No French and no Zianides ???? WHAT IS THE PROBLEM HERE ?

Tunisia


Tunisia (US i/tuːˈniːʒə/ too-nee-zhə or UK /tjuːˈnɪziə/ tew-niz-i-ə; Arabic: تونس‎ Tūnis pronounced [ˈtuːnɪs], officially the Republic of Tunisia[9] (Arabic: الجمهورية التونسية‎ al-Jumhūriyyah at-Tūnisiyyah; French: République tunisienne), is the smallest country in North Africa. It is a Maghreb country bordered by Algeria to the west, Libya to the southeast and the Mediterranean Sea to the north and east. Tunisia is almost 165,000 square kilometres (64,000 sq mi) in area, with an estimated population of just under 10.7 million. Its name is derived from the capital Tunis located in the northeast. The south of the country is composed of the Sahara desert, with much of the remainder consisting of particularly fertile soil and 1,300 kilometres (810 mi) of coastline. Tunisia has an association agreement with the European Union and is a member of the Arab Maghreb Union, the Arab League, and the African Union. Tunisia has established close relations with France in particular, through economic cooperation, industrial modernization, and privatisation programs. In 2011, a revolution resulted in the overthrow of autocratic President Zine El Abidine Ben Ali and the first free elections in the country were held. Since then, Tunisia has been consolidating its young democracy. I just compare between two version, i see a big difference . Seriously, we can make best of that!!!!!--Great11 (talk) 04:31, 29 August 2013 (UTC)

section middle age[edit]

Not truth that paragraph During the Middle Ages the Berber or Imazighen controlled varying parts of the Maghreb at times even unifying it, as well as overseas conquests of Portugal, Senegal, Spain, Sicily, Egypt, Sudan, Syria, Saudi Arabia, Israel, Palestine, Jordan, Iraq, and Yemen[1][2][3]. Great11 (talk) 17:21, 29 August 2013 (UTC)--Great11 (talk) 18:08, 29 August 2013 (UTC)


Wikipedia is not reference https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Almoravid — Preceding unsigned comment added by Great11 (talkcontribs) 18:14, 29 August 2013 (UTC)

References[edit]

  1. ^ http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/202580/Fatimid-Dynasty/2238/Conquest-of-Egypt.  Missing or empty |title= (help)
  2. ^ L'Atlas Historique Mondial, Ed. Larousse 1987, G. Duby. L'Atlas Historique Mondial, Ed. Larousse 1987. ISBN 2-7028-2865-5. 
  3. ^ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Almoravid.  Missing or empty |title= (help)

Darija?[edit]

"Algerian Arabic and Darija:Dzayer, ⴷⵣⴰⵢⴻⵔ" I'm sorry, but "Darija" isn't written in Tifinagh, that name (ⴷⵣⴰⵢⴻⵔ) corresponds to Berber. Algerian Arabic and Darija are synonyms. Please, correct.--Il Qathar (talk) 08:14, 11 March 2014 (UTC)

POV edits [8][edit]

Copied from IP's talk page: "We don't cherry pick news items to "tragically highlight" social issues. See WP:SYNTH. You're free to add content about social issues but please remember you are writing for an encyclopedia, not a newspaper op-ed." --NeilN talk to me 22:04, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

articlesbit[edit]

articlesbit is a free article submision and free republish content for who want to publish to any website or blog.

Please visit http://www.articlesbit.com/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jhayeleydo (talkcontribs) 17:57, 22 September 2014 (UTC)