Talk:Alkaline diet

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Some Scientific Studies on Alkalization[edit]

There are a few studies that need to be included in this article, in order to make the article more scientific. These studies provide evidence that there are observable and measurable effects and benefits that arise from dietary alkalization. Thus the general current tone of the article, which is that there is little evidence for any benefit in alkalizing diets, needs to be changed a little, in the light of these studies.

The first study that needs to be included in this article is:

The Alkaline Diet: Is There Evidence That an Alkaline pH Diet Benefits Health?

which concludes that:

"Alkaline diets may result in a number of health benefits as outlined below:
(1) Increased fruits and vegetables in an alkaline diet would improve the K/Na ratio and may benefit bone health, reduce muscle wasting, as well as mitigate other chronic diseases such as hypertension and strokes.
(2) The resultant increase in growth hormone with an alkaline diet may improve many outcomes from cardiovascular health to memory and cognition.
(3) An increase in intracellular magnesium, which is required for the function of many enzyme systems, is another added benefit of the alkaline diet. Available magnesium, which is required to activate vitamin D, would result in numerous added benefits in the vitamin D apocrine/exocrine systems.
(4) Alkalinity may result in added benefit for some chemotherapeutic agents that require a higher pH.
From the evidence outlined above, it would be prudent to consider an alkaline diet to reduce morbidity and mortality of chronic disease that are plaguing our aging population".


Note also that alkalization for health benefits is often performed not only by diet, but alternatively just by taking alkalizing supplements like sodium bicarbonate or potassium citrate (both the bicarbonate and citrate will alkalize — see here), which is in fact an easier approach to alkalization.

The article as it stands make no note of this alkalization performed via bicarbonate and citrate supplementation, and I suggest that it needs to.


The second study that needs to be quoted in this article is:

Partial neutralization of the acidogenic Western diet with potassium citrate increases bone mass in postmenopausal women with osteopenia

This study used of potassium citrate as an alkalizer, and found that "bone mass can be increased significantly in postmenopausal women with osteopenia by increasing their daily alkali intake as citrate".


A third study that needs to be included is this:

Effect of urine pH changed by dietary intervention on uric acid clearance mechanism of pH-dependent excretion of urinary uric acid

This study showed that an alkalizing diet is effective for removing uric acid from the body, which may explain why alkalizing diets are beneficial for gout.


Two other studies of note, that look at the use of various alkalizing supplements, are:

Brain pH responses to sodium bicarbonate and Carbicarb during systemic acidosis

which concludes that Carbicarb (a mixture of sodium carbonate and sodium bicarbonate) alkalizes both the body and the brain, whereas sodium bicarbonate alone alkalizes the body, but acidifies the brain.


And a very similar study found the same result:

Management of acidosis: the role of buffer agents
"The potential value of sodium bicarbonate was called into question when more recent studies demonstrated that it induced venous hypercarbia (high CO2 in the veins), and decreases in tissue and cerebrospinal fluid pH, as well as provoking tissue hypoxia, circulatory congestion, hypernatremia, and hyperosmolality, with consequent brain damage. Bicarbonate buffers may intensify rather than ameliorate cellular acidosis because sodium bicarbonate generates CO2 and thereby increases intracellular (hypercarbic) acidosis."

So clearly there is some scientific research behind alkalizing diets, and alkalizing the body, and this research needs to be included in this article. And I suggest the assertions made in this article that there is no evidence base for alkalizing diets really needs to be removed.

Drgao (talk) 14:09, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

Poor article quality[edit]

A huge portion of this article is improperly sourced and vague with one-sided claims and ad-hominem attacks made against credentialed professionals & their theories. Many of the statements preference the analysis of some experts arbitrarily over other experts of comparable credentials. The article is not even close to neutral.

I mirror Drgao's sentiments above. Wikipedia is not a place for people who think they have the right answer to systematically suppress principled alternative theories. Anyone who values the scientific method should be ashamed of the way this and many other articles distorts the validity of some research in preference of other research which supports a particular model.

I cannot help but suspect that some of the editors have an agenda, since these sorts of errors are difficult to make with the incredible frequency with which they appear here. Boleroinferno (talk) 03:57, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

WP:SOFIXIT.
Take care, however, not to remove material that is accurately sourced while claiming it isn't, as you did in this edit. The statement is conspicuously present in the source, 4th paragraph down in the Background section. ~Amatulić (talk) 09:58, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

The other interpretation[edit]

This article seems to only talk about the health food interpretation of alkaline diet, as in alkaline forming diet. What about true alkaline diets, where low pH foods are eschewed, no matter how alkaline "forming" alternative medicine say they are? 68.9.90.216 (talk) 01:11, 3 July 2013 (UTC)

Do you have any reliable sources to share about such diets, preferably scientific or medical studies? ~Amatulić (talk) 19:24, 3 July 2013 (UTC)

History[edit]

If this diet is still in use the history section should go at the end. The historical medical aspects should be moved to the history section IMO. Could use one image anyway. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) (if I write on your page reply on mine) 15:54, 6 February 2014 (UTC)

GA Review[edit]

This review is transcluded from Talk:Alkaline diet/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Adam Cuerden (talk · contribs) 15:13, 20 February 2014 (UTC) I worried a bit when I saw this on the Good article nominees, as there is, as I'm sure you know, a lot of quackery surrounding alkaline diets out there. You have, however, mostly struck a good balance. I think that a few more tweaks could be useful before promotion, but it's generally there.

First of all, the lead could probably stand to make a distinction between the more extreme quackery versions (claimed to affect the blood) and what diet could change. I'd also imagine there are a few, rare cases where changing the pH of urine could have some advantage - wasn't there a kidney stone remedy related to that? It was in one of Stephen Jay Gould's books - that might be worth briefly mentioning as well. With this kind of article, defining terms helps a lot.

I'd suggest the sentence "Due to the lack of human studies supporting any benefits of this diet, it is generally not recommended by dieticians and other health professionals." should come earlier. It serves a useful framing role.

On the whole, this is pretty good. I think it's well on the way to GA, just that difficult articles such as this are hard to get perfectly right. Think I'll ask WP:FTN to have a quick look as well, since getting these sorts of things right is that board's expertise, so they'd be useful to have on hand. Adam Cuerden (talk) 15:13, 20 February 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for taking the time to look at the nomination. The use in changing urine pH/kidney stones is discussed in the History section at the bottom of the page (placed there per WP:MEDMOS). It isn't really used for that purpose much anymore as medications do a much better job than diet does, so it's largely a historical relic for that use. My time on Wikipedia is extremely limited for the next week or so, so I might not be quick to respond here. Please bear with me, I will get back to the suggestions as soon as possible. Yobol (talk) 04:30, 21 February 2014 (UTC)
Sounds good! A little tweaking of the lead, and I think this one's a pass. Adam Cuerden (talk) 04:53, 21 February 2014 (UTC)
Sorry for the delay, moved the sentence higher (2nd paragraph) as suggested. Thanks for bearing with me. Yobol (talk) 15:46, 5 March 2014 (UTC)
It's amazing how much that change makes to how the article reads. Promoted. Adam Cuerden (talk) 16:09, 5 March 2014 (UTC)