Talk:Arvanites

Karaiskakis

Since it's been established that Karaiskakis was Sarakatsan rather than Arvanite, I have removed him from the list. Athenean (talk) 19:33, 28 September 2010 (UTC)

of course that is what are you doing removing them one by one .. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.107.214.102 (talk) 22:57, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Karaiskaqi, Albanians ...and the church.... what happen in Agios Spiridon 1827....

http://books.google.com/books?id=Rk1iVvOr6RUC&pg=PA210&dq=Karaiskakis+albanian%5C&hl=en&ei=SMijTMzgHsKUswbE7LiqCA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=book-thumbnail&resnum=2&ved=0CCsQ6wEwAQ#v=onepage&q=Karaiskakis%20albanian%5C&f=false —Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.107.214.102 (talk) 23:30, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

This magazine treat him as Arbanite : "I read that Karaiskakis, Botsaris, Bouboulina and Makryiannis (9) had all been Arvanites.." The London magazine Chatto & Windus, 2004 Pelasgon (talk) 14:05, 19 October 2010 (UTC)

An old song of More..!

Old song of More

Getting together Turks and raja and the place to clean from arvanitas.

Retrieved from "Lambrinidhis Nafplia Page 306"Pelasgon (talk) 12:20, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Northern Greece

I see that Zjarri still insist on trolling. The "fact" that "arvanites in nothern greece consider themselves to belong to albania or to albanian nation" is a ridicoulus claim.Please provide a name ,just a name of one village where the people feel like that.Wikipedia needs accuracy and not propaganda. Lysus.K (talk) 14:08, 3 January 2011 (UTC)

That's really werid about the southern Arvanites vs northern Arvanites situation. We have a number of academic secondary sources that are specific about the identification of the Arvanites of nortwestern Greece: [["Speaking Albanian, for example, is not a predictor with respect to other matters of identity [[1]] There are also long standing Christian Albanian (or Arvanitika speaking) communities both in Epirus and the Florina district of Macedonia with unquestioned identification with the Greek nation]]..There are also long standing Christian Albanian (or Arvanitika speaking) communities both in Epirus and the Florina district of Macedonia with unquestioned identification with the Greek nation, even M. Vickers, who is a clearly pro-Albanian author, claims in her 2004 paper that Albanian/Arvanitika speaking populations of this region are assimilated today.Alexikoua (talk) 20:24, 4 January 2011 (UTC)

In addition there is this sourced statement: they (all Arvanites) have distanced themselves from the Albanians to the extent that most consider today offending to be called Albanians. I added it but was reverted. I think it should go back to clarify things. A Macedonian, a Greek. (talk) 22:12, 4 January 2011 (UTC)

Serbians in old Yugoslavia used to say the same about kosovar Albanians that they are offendet to be kalled Albanians, but that was only shameless propaganda. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.209.156.131 (talk) 22:07, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

Hi Alexikoua. If they are assimilated they are pretty much no longer Arvanites but an extinct group of people. Those who still consider themselves as Arvanites have an clear Albanian identity. Do you consider the Greeks in America who are assimilated of Greek origin? Also to be assimilated doesn't mean hate against your own origin and Miranda Vickers doesn't confirm this self-Albanian hate of the Arvanite people. There should be a strong clarification of the whole article through massive engagement by knowledgeable Wikipedia users with the goal to erase this kind of Greek natonalist segments and interpretations. --Albanau (talk) 15:51, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

Bull

"a term strongly disliked by all the other Arvanites, who also resent being called Albanians." why are you trying to speak for a whole group of people? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bronxguy (talk • contribs) 03:06, 22 May 2011 (UTC)

Unfortunately the article is hijacked by Greek nationalist users. The sources which provided the facts doesn't confirm this disputed statement and is hard to verify because it's a strange expression with Greek nationalist segements. We all know why the article is far from neutral; because today's Greeks consider this Albanian population as the main contributors to Greek freedom and independence and thus they try to hide the truth of their non-Greek ethnicity. It is probably true that they are assimilated now and for that reason they are an extinct population. Besides if they keept their identity they would consider themselves as Albanians because they spoke Albanian and practised Albanian traditions. There are a number of sources which use the term Arvanites synonymously with Albanians and the very word also mean Albanian. This prevailing environment surrounding the article is a tragic example of hijacking and undermines the trustworthiness of Wikipedia as a good encyclopedia. --Albanau (talk) 15:31, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

"a term strongly disliked by all the other Arvanites, who also resent being called Albanians"

This sentence is fairly exaggerated and mostly promoted by nationalist Greeks who consider the Arvanites as one of the pillars of Greek independence. The sentence is created out of nationalist Greeks prejudice towards ethnic Albanians and partly because nationalist Greeks consider people of orthodox faith as Greeks. The sentence that assimilated Arvanites consider themselves Greeks doesn't change the fact that the Arvanites as a population group have an ethnic origin and mother tongue completely different from the Greeks. Complete assimilation often means extinction. I ask for a objective source which doesn't stem from Wikipedia or Greek circles to further confirm this theory that the Arvanites object being called Albanians. It's strange for a non-extinct people who speak a own language to feel dislike of their origin that they still keep alive. Silence on this question will be answered with deletion of the sentence. --Albanau (talk) 16:41, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

It's sourced to GHM, in case you hadn't already noticed. Athenean (talk) 17:25, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

I would like to read the exact sentence of the writing statement (no copy from Wikipedia!) and know more about the source. Any link? --Albanau (talk) 17:37, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

The ref is in the article for crying out loud, in the "Minority" section. Just click on the ref and and you will get the pdf. Your insistence on "no copy from Wikipedia!" (not even sure what that means) is bizarre, but it seems that no one will be able to help you with that. Athenean (talk) 17:43, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

With no copy from Wikipedia I mean't no writing statement taken from texts in the Wikipedia but from the original source (with other words GHM). Are the authors of the writing statement Greeks since GHM is a Greek section of the organization? We should be careful citing Greek sources on this matter since Greeks do not recognize the cultural rights of the Arvanites. --Albanau (talk) 17:53, 16 September 2011 (UTC)