Talk:Ballpoint pen

I'd love to try, but I can't read it - anybody know how to get an english translation?Bobzchemist 15:03, 24 May 2007 (UTC) {{unreferenced}}

Shouldn't that be ballpoint? No, the hyphen is needed.Bobzchemist 13:20, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

Introduction

The first sentence is getting unwieldy, and hard to read, any suggestions?:

How about:

A ball-point pen is a modern writing instrument that deposits a line of ink on paper by means of a tiny ball at the tip of the pen. A classic ball-point pen has an internal chamber filled with a viscous ink that is dispensed from the tip during use by the rolling action of a small metal sphere (0.7 mm to 1.2 mm in diameter); the ink dries almost immediately after contact with paper. Inexpensive, reliable and maintenance-free, the ballpoint has almost completely replaced the fountain pen in everyday writing. In British English it is also eponymously known as a "biro" (pronounced bye-roe in Britain but sometimes bee-roh" elsewhere), named after its inventor, László Bíró.Other forms of this type of pen are known as rollerball and gel pens.Bobzchemist 14:48, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

Accents

It's known as a 'biro' in the UK, not a 'bíró' 84.70.234.107 16:18, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

Ballpoint pen general article

I want to add several categories:

• Technical description of how and why they work
• The introduction of the pens in new york city
• Their transformation from a luxury item to a mass-produced commodity

any comments?Bobzchemist 20:11, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Importing from the village pump:

Conflict of information - ballpoint pen

Zagreb states it was invented by Slavoljub Penkala which article states he invented an automatic pencil. Ballpoint pen states it was invented by Laszlo Biro -- SGBailey 2004-02-05

At least one person went a bit overboard a while ago concerning Slavoljub Penkala. It has been claimed that he invented the propelling pencil (which IIRC checks out), the fountain pen (which doesn't, although he had a patent on at least one specific design), and apparently now the ballpoint pen too. I think it was Biro. Onebyone 21:05, 5 Feb 2004 (UTC)

As explained under ballpoint pen, several people have 'invented' it at different times. However, I don't think Slavoljub Penkala is widely thought to be one of them; indeed, the Zagreb article in question is rather in need of checking in several ways, so is like very unreliable. - IMSoP 03:38, 6 Feb 2004 (UTC)

There are conflicting accounts of who invented what when. This article is heavily biased towards Laszlo Biro andSlavoljub Penkala, and is unreferenced. The reality is somewhat more complicated. I will be adding referenced material as time permits.Bobzchemist 15:38, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Sharp Electronics and Eversharp

Though the story is often repeated, Eversharp (Wahl) was never related to Sharp Electronics. See A Tale of Two Pencils

This line is not right "Inexpensive, reliable and maintenance-free, they have almost completely replaced the fountain pen.". The Fountain Pen industry is alive and well and the Ballpoint pen has not killed it off - well at least not in the UK. To indicate that the fountain pen is as good as dead is misleading.

It is perfectly accurate. Would you take issue with the statement that automobiles have all but replaced horses? They have. Chris Cunningham 16:23, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

About pronunciation of "biro"

What's in there currently should stay as it is. Someone edited out the reference to it being pronounced as "bye-row", but I suppose the pronunciation truly is different depending on where you are. My last name is Biro and my family pronounces it bye-row. I have friends from England and they pronounced my name "bye-row" immediately without me having to tell them to, which is very rare for Americans who have just met me. Anyway, I have heard in Hungarian the actual word is pronounced "bee-row". Whatever. So there are two different pronunciations, and that's that. --bī-RŌ 01:48, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Can we remove ...

... the list of manufacturers and the list of retailers? This is not encyclopedic content; it is simply an advertising list.

Mike Helms 21:48, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

• I removed the retailer list, as I agree that it was not encyclopedic. I'm less sure of the manufacturer's list. Figma 05:54, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

• • I think the manufacturer's list is appropriate. It is not common knowledge, nor is it readily accessible elsewhere. I could understand challenges to individual items on the list, but as for the list in general, it should stay.

Trivia

The bit about NASA spending millions on a space pen and the Soviets using a pencil is untrue. http://www.snopes.com/business/genius/spacepen.asp . The part about 100 people coking to death on them every year is probably also an urban legend. Moberho 17:43, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

I was unable to find a source for the "100 people per year" stat. I was able to find a cite for actual cases of choking (although not death). I replaced the unsubstantiated with the substantiated. WayneConrad 20:47, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

The trivia entry about Anne Frank's diaries, especially the language "supposedly wrote the fabled account" struck me as suspicious, so I went to the annefrank.org web site where I found the issue discussed under the title "Question 4 on the authenticity of the diary of Anne Frank" (http://www.annefrank.org/content.asp?PID=794&LID=2). I have paraphrased the information presented there. This being my first Wikipedia edit, I have no idea how to officially footnote this. Since this calumny seems to be a widespread "urban myth", it seems better to acknowledge and correct it, rather than remove the entry (which was my first inclination). ----FrankR

Image:Ballpointpentip.jpg

Okay, guys, the picture is overlapping some text. We need to fix that, and I am not that good yet, so could someone fix it? Mew Mitsuki (talk) 22:03, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Hungarian name

I've never heard the ballpoint pen being called Bíró-toll in Hungarian. Google gives only 4 hits for it, all historical. It is called "golyóstoll" (pen with ball) nowadays. --Tgr (talk) 22:26, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

External Links

I remove this link "ducttaperevolution.com/duct_tape_pen.htm" because it says "Page Not Found". Ancos (talk) 00:46, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Optical effects

I am no expert on the subject, but in China we have a system of thought, that for someone with poor handwriting, blue pen is more visually appealing, and for someone with good writing skills, black becomes more appealing. Apparently there is psychology-related research done on this, and there is also the superstition that school students are awarded better marks from teachers where blue pen is used (teachers may be biased towards those with better handwriting) and so many students exclusively use blue pen for this purpose. Has anyone else heard of this and is willing to expand? -- 李博杰  | —Talk contribs 04:28, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

Sounds interesting, but this probably isn't the most appropriate place for it. Maybe at an article on handwriting or on visual perception, but I dunno. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 04:41, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

Ballpoint Picasso?

...this evasive maverick's imaginative scribblings are considered as the foremost to which all other ballpoint artwork is compared.

Ballpoint Picasso... DaVinci of Doodlers... evasive maverick... What is this, a tabloid review?

I'm talking about Lennie Mace, the "ballpoint king" from the "Ballpoint pens in everyday life" section.

Blatant promotion, laudatory tone

After my last remark, the part related to Lennie Mace has been slightly moderated, but still not enough. So I decided to moderate it myself, and rather mercilessly. Lennie Mace may be a great artist, but the blatant promotion and laudatory tone is unacceptable for a Wiki article. Also, one should avoid using terms like "international acclaim" when talking about a particular piece of artwork which doesn't even return a single page of Google Search. --Metalliana (talk) 13:39, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

The Sunday Gospel

From "Multi-colored pens" section:

"It is strongly discouraged that one use these pens in traditional sketching technique. The difficulty required in creating consistent sketching lineweights is far too difficult for the average artist/student to achieve."

This info is non-specific for multi-colored pens. Yes, drawing sketches is more difficult with ballpoint pens than graphite pencils. So what? How is this related specifically to multi-colored pens? But wait... it gets worse:

"Only through the glorious hands of our Lord and Saviour, Frank Lloyd Wright we seen proper sketching techniques with a ballpoint pen. Therefore, only through the effective channeling of his spirit can one use a pen as such for hand sketching."

Someone was definitely high when writing this "spiritual" nonsense. If anyone has a better idea, be my guest. But I'm simply removing it along with the aforementioned statement.

Wassad (talk) 03:17, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

Multi-Colored Pens

Someone just deleted this whole section. While I do think it could use some editing, I don't think it should be deleted completely. How about:

 == Multi-colored pens ==   
 -    
 - Some ballpoint pens have multiple colors that can be selected by the user. These are made   
   using the same type of assembly used for single-color pens and for pen refills, but since an  
   ink resevoir can only have one color of ink filled into it, mult-color pens must use a 
   different resevoir/tip assembly for each color. All multi-color pens use retractable  
   mechanisms.
 -    
 - Multi-color pens come in several varieties. The most common versions of these are the 
   three-color pen, which has black, blue, and red ink colors. Four-color pens also have  
   green ink. A pen has even been produced that has 10 colors in one. Colors that are commonly 
   found in 10-color pens are black, blue, brown, green, orange, pink, purple, red, turquoise, 
   and yellow.

Bobzchemist (talk) 13:34, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

End of history section - "went on sale at the end of the year"

At the end of the history section, it appears that some content was added before the section describing that the pens went on sale at the end of the year in Britain and by the next year in Europe. No date is given. This orphan needs to be rewritten for clarity or combined with some other part of this section. Phluorine (talk) 19:57, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Prining ink as incentive

This: ""Bíró had noticed that inks used in newspaper printing dried quickly, leaving the paper dry and smudge free. ""

is nonsense, because then newspaper printing was done with carbon black low viscosity inks.

If that story is true, Biro might have been impressed by the high viscosity (paste-like) inks used

in Offset printing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.221.246.217 (talk) 12:12, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

The manufacture of economical, reliable ballpoint pens arose from experimentation, modern chemistry, and the precision manufacturing capabilities of 20th century technology. Many patents worldwide are testaments to failed attempts at making these pens commercially viable and widely available. The ballpoint pen went through several failures in design throughout its early stages. The first patent on a ballpoint pen[2] was issued on 30 October 1888, to John Loud,[3] a leather tanner, who was attempting to make a writing instrument that would be able to write on his leather products, which then-common fountain pens could not do. Loud's pen had a small rotating steel ball, held in place by a socket. Although it could be used to mark rough surfaces such as leather, as Loud intended, it proved to be too coarse for letter writing and was not commercially viable. In the period between 1904 and 1946 particularly, alternatives or improvements to the fountain pen were invented. Slavoljub Eduard Penkala invented a solid-ink fountain pen in 1907, a German inventor named Baum took out a ballpoint patent in 1910, and yet another ballpoint pen device was patented by Van Vechten Riesburg in 1916. In these inventions, the ink was placed in a thin tube whose end was blocked by a tiny ball, held so that it could not slip into the tube or fall out of the pen. The ink clung to the ball, which spun as the pen was drawn across the paper. These proto-ballpoints did not deliver the ink evenly. If the ball socket were too tight, the ink did not reach the paper. If it were too loose, ink flowed past the tip, leaking or making smears. Many inventors tried to fix these problems, but without commercial success.[4] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.90.135.11 (talk) 12:25, 2 February 2012 (UTC)