Talk:Beirut

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Old talk[edit]

There is no section at all, and little mention in the article, about business & industry in Lebanon. Come on! Cities are not just political places; places where wars happen; cultural places (UNESCO, etc.); tourist places; but also places where people need to work and earn a living!!

Should we make an article about New York City and say nothing about Wall Street, the banking busines; the big seaport; and the many industries that are located there, too? DAW 74.249.76.242 (talk) 23:58, 7 August 2008 (UTC)


"There are twenty-one universities in Beirut, including the American University of Beirut (oldest and finest in the Middle-East),"

I'd love to see the source for that claim. Could it be more POV? I thought my imaginary university of ballsacks was the FINEST... Isnt finest POV by defenition?

Actually Im just gonna go ahead and remove the word finest. Oldest is something easily verifiable considering, finest is not. Finest as in most slutty girls? Finest as in best architecture? Finest as in wtf? Yep, defenitely deleting it. Sorry for the double edit here tho.


I wasn't sure why it was necessary to specify that Brooklyn is in New York City which is in New York, so I removed the last one. I feel it reads better like that and there is still enough information under the link for anyone who does not know what Brooklyn or NYC is to find out easily enough. I'd be happ to discuss it, however. Nevilley 07:25, 8 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Should the mention of the airstrikes link to the article on the conflict itself? -F.S.O--train--'09 19:20, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

I don't think that you need to put scare quotes around "Hezbollah bunker" -- it's enough to say that the Israelis claimed it was one, which already indicates that it was the claim of one side and not necessarily established fact. But I haven't edited this yet. 24.47.190.74 03:16, 25 July 2006 (UTC)motorneuron

Why does the article mention, under the "Israel airstrikes" section, all the bombardments of Lebanese territory, and not only the ones which hit targets within the area of Beirut itself, as it should be in an article that discusses the mere city?


I was reading something about the population density in manhattan. a million and a half ppl but 57 square kilometers. beirut is 30 square kilometeres

yet

beirut is less densley ipulated according to the chart on the right

someone correct this, simple math shows its wrong. but then is the area correct?


I feel that it is unencyclopedic to comment upon allegations made as to the conduct of a war (by both parties) when it is difficult in the extreme to verify these assertions. It is my opinion that the proper conduct for an encyclopedia is to provide a dossier of verified facts, the reporting of current events is best left to the mass media.

The first several paragraphs are clearly biased against Israel. Let's please keep politics out of Wikipedia. There are plenty of other sites where you can let your opinion be known.

Will all contributers please sign their posts Indisciplined (talk) 18:37, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

Beirut Coat of Arms & Flag[edit]

I added the Beirut coat of arms, taken directly from www.beirut.gov.lb which is the official Beirut municipality website. The picture is in public domain as long as it is used for informational and educational purposes only. I'm sure everyone would agree with me on this step. Ad vitam aeternam (talk) 22:47, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

I also added the flag of Beirut based on the coat of arms and referenced (http://www.flickr.com/photos/councilmembergarcetti/184277133/) Ad vitam aeternam (talk) 12:30, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

Someone keeps deleting the flag, although it respects the rules of fair use. Who is to decide if it is to stay or not?!?!?!?! Ad vitam aeternam (talk) 23:51, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

Jerusalem?[edit]

Among the twin cities, there's Jerusalem listed with the Israeli flag next to it. I followed the source, it says literally " Jerusalem the capital City of Palestine" with the Palestinian flag next to it.

Now because Jerusalem is not internationally recognized as Palestine's capital, I understand not putting the Palestinian flag, but to put the Israeli flag is utter nonsense. I think the lesser of the 2 evils is to replace the Israeli flag with the Palestinian one. Remember, Lebanon is OFFICIALLY at war with Israel. 89.133.155.193 (talk) 22:18, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

I think the above makes a lot of sense--the Lebanese position on this is quite clear on one side, and not always for the obvious reasons.

09:05, 18 June 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Abedwayyad (talkcontribs)

Conflict stuff[edit]

Yes - we're all concerned about the conflict. Since it is an ongoing, fluid, current event, readers should be referred to the article about the conflict itself. Opinions and facts about the conflict do not belong in the article.

To this end, I have added a "conflict" section to the article and refer interested readers to the 2006 Israel-Lebanon conflict article.

This is the text that I removed:

The city, along with the rest of the country, is currently experiencing a major humanitarian crisis as a result of the coordinated missile strikes and artillery fire from Israeli aircraft and artillery units. These strikes have so far mainly targeted the city's southern suburbs, widely considered to be Hezbollah's strategic headquarters.
The stated purpose of the strikes are to destroy the Lebanese Islamic militant organization Hezbollah. However, in reality a policy of collective punishment against the Lebanese population is being executed; a great part of the city's infrastructure, including its international airport as well as most of its major bridges and highways have also been partially or completely destroyed. Indeed, these events are inline with the statement of Israel's chief of staff, Lt. Gen. Dan Halutz, who said "If the soldiers are not returned, we will turn Lebanon's clock back 20 years." (Source: CNN) Under the 1949 Geneva Conventions collective punishment is a war crime. Article 33 states: "No protected person may be punished for an offence he or she has not personally committed," and "collective penalties and likewise all measures of intimidation or of terrorism are prohibited."

I need to tune up some formatting at the beginning of the Beirut article and will do so now. --AStanhope 21:00, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Israeli Airstrikes[edit]

I propose removing the Israeli Airstrikes section of the article. This information belongs in the 2006 Israel-Lebanon conflict article - not in the article about Beirut proper. Alternatively, an article called 2006 Israeli airstrikes on Beirut or something similar could be produced. Why not? Sounds good! --AStanhope 21:06, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Here is the entire removed section regarding Israeli airstrikes for use elsewhere:

  • On July 12, 2006, Israel attacked dozens of targets throughout the country as part of an operation Israel claimed was aimed at recovering soldiers kidnapped by Hezbollah in a cross-border raid earlier in the day. Critics say this is retaliation for Lebanon's toleration of attacks on Israel, pointing to a prisoner trade offer by Hezbollah. [1]
  • On July 13, 2006, the raid extended to the Lebanese capital, Beirut. Israeli jets fired missiles at the Rafic Hariri International Airport, which forced its closure and diversion of flights, as well as damage to Hezbollah's Al-Manar television station, and the destruction of the Rayak Air Base in the Bekaa Valley in east Lebanon.[2]
  • On July 14, 2006, over 50 civilians have been killed, and Israeli jets dropped bombs on the southern Beirut suburb of Dahieh, a Hezbollah stronghold in Beirut. Also, the international airport came under attack once again. [3]
  • On July 15, 2006, Israeli warships bombarded coastal targets in northern Beirut, such as the port, lighthouses, and navy radars at the Lebanese army's coastal base. One Lebanese soldier was killed while a few were wounded. But earlier, Hezbollah attacked an Israeli warship killing four Israeli soldiers. Israeli jets also dropped leaflets over the north-western tourism city of Manara Street and the rest of Lebanon. Children and adults ran into the streets to snatch up leaflets, which had a caricature of Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah as a serpent and read: "Is the resistance ... helping Lebanon? The resistance ... is destroying Lebanon!" [4]
  • On July 16, 2006, the assault on Dahieh at Beirut's southern suburb resumed as an attempt to destroy Hezbollah targets and kill Hassan Nasrallah of the Shi'ite Muslim radical group. Israeli jets also destroyed the bridge in that area that leads east to Hazmieh. [5]
  • On July 20, 2006, seven Brazilians were killed by Israeli airstrikes. [6]. Israel claimed to have bombed a "Hezbollah bunker" in the Beirut suburb, however Al-Manar dismissed this claim and said that the jets hit a mosque in that area. [7]
  • Currently, foreigners and Lebanese are trying to flee from Lebanon by sea, to Cyprus and then to their home countries, or by land to Damascus, Syria, either to flee through its airport or stay there as refugees. Warships from the United States, the United Kingdom, Canada, and Commonwealth of Nations are still evacuating their citizens to Cyprus, which is critically overcrowded with tourists and evacuees.[8]
  • There are an estimated 90,000 Sri Lankan mostly female domestic workers in Lebanon. As Sri Lanka is itself undergoing a rebel attack by the militant LTTE ("Tamil Tiger" terrorist organization), the government is not organizing any exodus for its citizens.

I agree that this is extremely important information however I don't think it belongs in the Beirut article proper. Whoever is behind this, please consider integrating it into the 2006 Lebanon-Israel conflict article or starting a new article on the topic. Thanks! --AStanhope 21:12, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Beirut / tel aviv comparison[edit]

i don't see the point of comparing the two cities. you could compare beirut to many other mediterranean cities in turkey or greece or even north africa i say the comparison should be deleted, there's no need for it

Saifi a SUNNI negihborhood? Hahahaha[edit]

'Beirut has both developed and less developed neighborhoods. Its most famous Sunni Muslim negihborhood is Saifi Village at Downtown.' This information is both inaccurate and misleading. Saifi is not even a neighborhood per se. It's barely ten buildings full of non-residential shops. Plus it's population is not remotely exclusive to Sunni Muslims. I know that many Christians and other Muslims have clinics/offices/apartments there. If that info is meant to heightened one group of Muslims over the other, and to make foreigners believe that there is actual segregation between the two Muslim groups, I think it should be removed at once. This is not 'The Truth'. And why allude that downtown is a Sunni neighborhood. We all know that there are many many many Christian properties there (both historical and personal). If you insist on a Sunni neighborhood, why not choose something like 'Malla/ Nazlit el Hoss', 'tallit el khayat' or even 'Verdun', which is a reasonably elegent. --LestatdeLioncourt 20:01, 8 November 2006 (UTC)Bold text

I've just started looking at this article, and I'm curious if there's even any reason to list the neighborhoods? Are any of them notable? Should they all be listed? Should the entire paragraph just be removed, or moved to its own section instead of the introduction? George Saliba 13:13, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

This article needs sources!![edit]

Hi. I was just glossing over the Beirut article...it is in desperate need of sources. There are several POV statements that I'm about to fix...I thought I would mention it here. I'm going to go at it a little at a time...please feel free to provide thoughts/input/etc...--Xtcrider 15:22, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

To user 213.132.39.22:[edit]

You have, on several occasions, inserted lines in this article similar to "of course, this title was self-proclaimed by the Lebanese themselves, and is still stubbornly and pretentiously still being used by some of them" when referring to Beirut's nickname "Paris of the middle-east". Whether you are right or wrong (which isn't the point), your sentence is blantanly POV, unsourced and doesn't belong in an 'encyclopedic' article...if you can reference your sentence (much like I referenced the nickname), please do so...your approach isn't very constructive... --Xtcrider 02:05, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

what are the major transportation iin beirut Lebanon?

transportations[edit]

what are the major transportation iin beirut Lebanon?

Suburbia[edit]

Should I add in information about the suburbs in Beirut (ie Mansourieh, Antelias Antelias, and Mkhallis)? If so, would this make a new section or go under one that already exists? TBL 23:22, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Pictures[edit]

I think that the pictures on Beirut aren't enough and are rather unappealing. I think we should place an aerial picture of the Beirut peninsula. God knows there's alot on Yahoo or Google. Im still new here so i have no idea how to add pictures. But i have many awesome ones. Someone show me how to do it..lol

The page needs a larger, modern picture of the city, there are only pictures of buildings and historic photos of the city. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.173.43.247 (talk) 02:00, 22 July 2012 (UTC)

line removed from opening paragraph[edit]

Regarding the sobqriquet "The Paris of the Middle East," one author wrote: "although this was a title the Lebanese self-appointed to themselves, and many Lebanese still pretentiously use this title, despite Beirut being a shadow of it's former glory days."

Besides the redundancy and awkwardness of the phrasing "self-appointed to themselves," and the unnecessary inclusion of an apostrophe in the possesive "its," the entire sentence is highly derisive of both those Lebanese who chose to refer to their city by this title and the state of the city itself. The sentence is utterly inappropriate for a Wikipedia article, which has rigorous standards of formality, impartiality, and clarity. Before contributing to Wikipedia any further, the author must consult Wikipedia's style guidelines at length. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.232.207.175 (talk) 09:10, 5 January 2007 (UTC).

Deleted external links[edit]

External link or links have recently been deleted by User:Calton as "horrible Tripod pages which add little information, are full of ads, and fail WP:EL standards." No better external links were substituted. Readers may like to judge these deleted links for themselves, by opening Page history. --Wetman 15:02, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

History[edit]

Beirut is more than 5000 years old and this should be mentioned at the begining of the history section. The current first paragraph implies that it dates back to 15th century B.C. which is wrong.

Excerpts from http://www.middleeast.com/beirut.htm

Historical Heritage

Beirut stands on the site of a very ancient settlement going back at least 5,000 years. Its name appeared in cuneiform inscriptions as early as the 14th century B.C. In the first century B.C., Berytus, as it was then called, became a Roman Colony and under Roman rule was the seat of a famous Law school which continued into the Byzantine era.

> >

I added it

Wow[edit]

The whitewashing Zionists have so greatly absolved themselves of responsibility that the "History" section of this article mentions a "war" without referring to the 1982 attack on Lebanon by name. This is getting ridiculous. Alyoshenka 12:38, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

European Port?[edit]

I have removed the category of European Ports since Beruit is not in Europe. Should anyone feel this is incorrect, please comment here. --KNHaw (talk) 06:30, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

Then I suggest Lebanon should not be present in all European maps as usual, unless a royalty fee be paid.89.133.139.252 (talk) 20:36, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

Gay life[edit]

NPR just did a story on how gays and lesbians are tolerated in Beirut, moreso than elsewhere in the Middle East: Gay Community Thrives in Lebanon. This article doesn't have a culture section per se, so I'm not sure where to add mention. -- Beland 05:55, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

It probably belongs in the LGBT rights in Lebanon article. — George [talk] 06:35, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Steps for making Beirut a Featured Articke[edit]

Hello everyone. I just had a word with one of our moderators, tariqabjotu, and he stated that the lists under "Districts & Neighborhoods", "Colleges and universities", "Public Spaces", and "Famous Births" need to be replaced with prose or removed altogether. Also, he had a point pointing to other FA cities like Jerusalem, New York City, Mumbai, and others found under Wikipedia:Featured articles#Geography and places. We should also have an well-sourced article made up almost entirely of prose. (I will also address the members at WikiProject Lebanon directly at the WikiProject talk page as well.) - Omar 180 17:51, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

Ya Libnan, Plagiarism, & Original Content[edit]

Either get rid of Ya Libnan, or stop deleting Blogging Beirut. Blogging Beirut is majority (90%) original photojournalism, whereas Ya Libnan is nothing more than a portal that aggregates other sites' stories. How is it that plagiarism of the first degree is allowed but real, original, unique photojournalism isn't? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.229.104.3 (talk) 02:42, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

GA Review[edit]

Unfortunately, this article is not ready for Good Article status at this time. I have several concerns about this article, including:

  1. It needs quite a few more references. In some places, entire sections are unreferenced.
  2. There are multiple "citation needed" tags in the article.
  3. References must have at least a title, publisher, accessdate and url. If available, the author and date should also be stated. I strongly recommend {{cite web}} templates.
  4. The article needs to cite reliable sources, and I'm not convinced that some of the ones used are considered reliable. 999beirut doesn't have any information when I click on the link. And wikipedia is cited multiple times, although it cannot be used as a reference for other wikipedia articles.
  5. The article has too many pictures, in my opinion. It's at the point of overkill.
  6. There are many choppy paragraphs in the article. Single-sentence paragraphs should not be used. A lot of the prose would flow better if it was joined into well-developed paragraphs. Much of the article reads as a list right now.
  7. The "Neighborhoods" section is a list, although two post above this review is a message from November stating that the list should be made into prose.
  8. More development is needed in some areas, which will help with the short paragraphs. I find that a lot of the information is mentioned briefly, but no real detail is given about it. There is a lot of "Beirut has this. Beirut has that.", but the reader doesn't learn much other than that these things are located in Beirut.
  9. "Arts & Fashion" and "Famous Births" don't follow naming conventions in the Manual of Style. The & sign should be replaced, and only the first letter in the section header should be capitalized.

These are some of the items that stand out to me. I believe it will take a while to get the referencing and copyediting done so that the prose flows well and is thoroughly referenced. I am failing the article for now, and I encourage you to address these points and preferably place the article for peer review before renominating it. Best wishes, GaryColemanFan (talk) 20:48, 16 April 2008 (UTC)


thank you, we'll have to get busy Eli+ 06:01, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
  • I removed the gallery, which was overkill, as some of the images there were already in the article. This section[9] seems problematic too, and at least two images should be removed from there, so we could align the remaining two to either the right or left. Funkynusayri (talk) 12:59, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Silk[edit]

Silk does not grow! Silk is obtained from cocoons made by the larvae of the mulberry silkworm. belissarius (talk) 18:33, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

Laodicea in Phoenicia[edit]

Which Seleucid Laodice it is meant? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Alain08 (talkcontribs) 18:14, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Beirut City = Beirut Governorate?[edit]

Are the city of Beirut and the Beirut Governorate the same thing? What I'm asking is whether Beirut is a municipality and a province all in one? If so, that needs to be made note of so people won't get confused thinking they have two different borders/sizes, etc... --Criticalthinker (talk) 09:51, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Conquest by Agrippa[edit]

Is not possible that Agrippa conquered Beyrut in 64 BC because he born a year later (63 BC). In 64 BC Beirut was conquered by romans; Agrippa toke Beyrut during the civil war against Marcus Antonius before 31 aC--83.33.218.114 (talk) 18:28, 25 November 2008 (UTC)

Hooray for fun[edit]

I was really disappointed to see that very little info on the town's more recent history as a spot to get to for fun (party/drug/drinkey wise). The lead played it up fine but it was completely absent from the main body. I threw in three sources on a few lines. Feel free to adjust them. I hate to use quotes to that extent so someone might want to tinker with it.Cptnono (talk) 09:39, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

Economy[edit]

I blanked a substantial portion of text in the economy section already flagged with citation needed. It read like an investment or traveler advertisement. I went through a couple not online sources I had on hand but info was not mentioned or out of date. To make it even worse, related wikipedia articles had dead sources. If anyone has something regarding the business district, banking, port, tourism, or other aspects it would help.Cptnono (talk) 10:56, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

Old Panorama of Beirut to appear as POTD soon[edit]

Hello! This is a note to let the editors of this article know that File:بيروت القرن ١٩ أسود أبيض.jpg will be appearing as picture of the day on November 22, 2010. You can view and edit the POTD blurb at Template:POTD/2010-11-22. If this article needs any attention or maintenance, it would be preferable if that could be done before its appearance on the Main Page so Wikipedia doesn't look bad. :) Thanks! Banzoo (talk) 13:06, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

Picture of the day
Old panorama of Beirut

A panorama of Beirut in the late 19th century under Ottoman rule. After the collapse of the Ottoman Empire following World War I, Beirut, along with the rest of Lebanon, was placed under the French Mandate. After Lebanon achieved independence on 22 November 1943, Beirut became its capital city.

Photos: Maison Bonfils; Restoration: Banzoo
ArchiveMore featured pictures...


when was berytus renamed Beirut?[edit]

id like to know when berytus renamed Beirut i am researching Phoenicia and was wanting to know more about the important cities and discovered that berytus and beirut were same city but i could not find out the exact time this city got re-named. 76.244.150.120 (talk) 18:58, 8 May 2011 (UTC)

Culture: Cosmopolitanism?[edit]

In the section on culture, Beirutis are described as being proud of their city's "cosmopolitanism". Having lived there, I would say most Beirutis would agree to that kind of speech but, in fairness, such a description is not backed up in the article. What passes for "cosmopolitanism" is the multi-layered history of Beirut--which is not, in and of itself, proof of cosmopolitanism. I was going to edit the passage but wanted to wait for others' opinions.

Abedwayyad (talk) 09:21, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

How?[edit]

... is Alex cooler than Beirut? --Kid 007 (talk) 04:24, 17 December 2011 (UTC)

Magic. Perhaps the same magic that causes 2500 out of less than 40 Jews to vote in Beirut. TFighterPilot (talk) 00:11, 20 January 2012 (UTC)

File:Beirut.png Nominated for Deletion[edit]

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Demographics[edit]

The article uses a 2009 election breakdown - does someone have a link to the original source for those figures? Tigerman2005 (talk) 05:06, 20 June 2012 (UTC)

List of Governors in wrong place[edit]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beirut#Twin_towns.C2.A0.E2.80.93_Sister_cities

But I don't know what to do with it. Dolphincradle (talk) 18:33, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

I figured it out and I fixed it.Dolphincradle (talk) 05:32, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

Destruction of historical sites section?[edit]

I think there should be a dedicated subsection about how many historical sites are destroyed to make way for new developments (often the developers are ministers!). The BBC have a great but depressing article on the issue. Malick78 (talk) 07:04, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

Travel warnings in lead of article[edit]

the travel warnings apply to the whole of the country. same way we don't put travel warnings for say Colombia in the Bogota article. why does a single purpose editor want to push this into the lead of an article. LibStar (talk) 01:51, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

Well, I don't think your being very fair with your characterization of me being a Single Purpose Editor. I'm a new account to Wikipedia. It's not as if I've been editing for 9 years, and I've only chosen the Beirut page to make additions. I didn't get around to editing other pages yet. As far the edits are concerned, it's a perfectly valid and pertinent add-on to the article. The sources don't just mention Lebanon as a whole, they mention Beirut in particular as being racked by frequent car bombings and political violence. In the opening paragraphs, there's no mention of its frequent negative security situation. That would be misleading. I'm not inserting an opinionated viewpoint. I've presented perfectly valid sources for the material added. They all mention Beirut, along with Lebanon as a whole, as having a deteriorating security situation. And the wording of the sentences reflect that. Bosqdew (talk) 02:15, 26 May 2014 (UTC)
but why choose to put in the lead, see Wikipedia:LEAD#Introductory_text. if you've been editing for 9 years (longer than most editors) what other articles have you edited? LibStar (talk) 03:17, 26 May 2014 (UTC)
I haven't been editing for 9 years. I've hardly been editing for even 9 days. The reason that particular content should be in the lead is to make the introduction more balanced, and make it reflect everything about Beirut; even if it's negative. There are many positive attributes about the city in those paragraphs, but there are no connotations to any of the city's adverse or gloomy realities that currently engulf it. It's to introduce the page with a fair and balanced approach. Bosqdew (talk) 03:32, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

I still think it is WP:UNDUE, there is a mention of car bombings in history section. LibStar (talk) 03:49, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

Well, I think we need a consensus. You, and your particular opinion are not sufficient grounds for excluding the content from the article. I don't WP:OWN this article, but more importantly, neither do you. I have yet to see any reasonable cause for not inserting it. Bosqdew (talk) 03:56, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

I notice there is a bit of a dispute here, is there anyway I could be of assistance? ♥ Solarra ♥ ♪ Talk ♪ ߷ ♀ Contribs ♀ 03:59, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

Solarra, I welcome another opinion on inserting this into the lead. LibStar (talk) 04:08, 26 May 2014 (UTC)
I am trying to edit one of the introductory paragraphs of the page to insert a balanced and insightful approach to the content. The paragraphs in that area of the article only display the city as a vibrant metropolis that has everything going for it. But in reality, there are a lot of things that make Beirut an inhospitable place to live or work in. Mr. Libstar wants those additions removed because he thinks otherwise. I don't feel as an independent editor, I need his permission to make a helpful properly sourced addition to the article. Bosqdew (talk) 04:06, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

you don't need my permission but one of my points is you are using country wide travel warnings to paint Beirut. and why do you have so much interest in this topic? do you intend to add gun violence to Mexican city articles? LibStar (talk) 04:17, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

Well countries in general do not issue city warnings. They only issue "Country Warnings". But within those countries warnings, Beirut in particular is mentioned as an unpredictable violent locale. It's just for reference purposes. As far as my interest is concerned, don't read too much into it. I didn't wake up one morning and all of sudden developed a wild fascination for Beirut's security issues. I just happen to be reading the article one day and noticed that the most important part of the page, the introduction, failed to mention its current violent nature. I don't see what your point is, in trying to exclude the content other than a personal opinion, which isn't justified. Bosqdew (talk) 04:26, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

are there other sources that point to a specific security threat in Beirut? I've found coverage of the 2013 car bombing but that is already covered in the article. also you didn't answer my question do you intend to add gun violence to Mexican city articles? LibStar (talk) 04:31, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

Bogota, Rio de Janeiro, Caracas, Guayaquil, Johannesburg, Islamabad, Mexico City are all cities known for their crime, yet no mention is made in their lead sections. LibStar (talk) 04:34, 26 May 2014 (UTC)
You sound confused and completely off base. I don't understand what your trying to point out. Who is talking about a specific threat to Beirut? This is not a newspaper article. This an encyclopedia page. The references note that the city in particular (along with the country) have been racked by violence in the past, and the situation remains tense. Therefore, they are instructing their citizens not to travel there for tourism purposes. Who is mentioning specific threats? Bosqdew (talk) 04:44, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

I'm not off base. why doesn't this appear in other city articles with known country wide travel warnings. also you didn't answer my question do you intend to add gun violence to lead in Mexican city articles? LibStar (talk) 04:45, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

so why isn't it mentioned in the lead of all these other cities? WP is an encyclopaedia that aims to ensure a consistent approach to the same class of articles. introducing country wide travel warnings in the lead of Beirut (and I'm not sure why you are so insistent on Beirut) is completely off base. LibStar (talk) 04:47, 26 May 2014 (UTC)
other cities subject to country wide travel warnings but no mention made in lead of article Kinshasa, Cairo, Lahore, Cape Town, Tehran. LibStar (talk) 04:50, 26 May 2014 (UTC)


A number of those articles do not have expansive lead sections that are well developed. That's why additional content is not present. The other articles don't express rosy material regarding their tourism attributes the same way this article does in its lead section. Do you have anything pertinent to add? Because this conversation seems to be going nowhere. You don't have a consensus for your argument. As long as I insert sourced material, you can't prevent me from making additions. So far, all you've been doing is inserting clueless opine. Bosqdew (talk) 04:55, 26 May 2014 (UTC)
I've questioned the inclusion on a number of grounds WP:UNDUE, and Wikipedia:LEAD#Introductory_text and a lack of consistency with other city articles that in countries subject to travel warnings, the last point is very valid. You have not demonstrated anything to overcome this, but insist you are 100% right. also you didn't answer my question do you intend to add gun violence to Mexican city articles? LibStar (talk) 04:59, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

also do you actually intend to edit other articles? or will stop editing on Beirut once your beloved contribution is added? LibStar (talk) 05:00, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

We'll wait for a consensus. I have my valid points too. You don't WP:OWN this article. As long as I insert sourced content which doesn't constitute WP:OR, I'm allowed to insert it. I'm not committing an act of vandalism. You don't have a consensus. All you have is your personal opinion. If there is no consensus in the future, I will re-insert the content. I don't need your personal permission to edit this page. And Mexico City, has nothing to do with this conversation. I already explained above your irrelevant examples. As far as the future is concerned, I'll try to edit any page that you haven't so far, that way we don't get into a dispute. I'm only interested in making helpful additions. Not trying to pick fights with other editors. Bosqdew (talk) 05:07, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

I have now removed the POV in the intro including reference to it being a tourist attraction. LibStar (talk) 05:11, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

Well, well, well, Mr. POV. I'm pleasantly surprised. I might not add that addition after all. Because indeed now, the opening paragraphs don't paint such a rosy picture about the city. I'm glad we came to an amicable solution. Bosqdew (talk) 05:19, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

took some time but glad we arrived at something. LibStar (talk) 05:24, 26 May 2014 (UTC)