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There were previously two rather huge paragraphs which discussed the borders of Black country with different definitions. I am not from the area, but I identified three different definitions from the original text:
- The deep and shallow coal definition (wide definition)
- The cultural and industrial definition (wider definition)
- The shallow and outcropping coal definition (narrow definition)
Is this correct?
I have organized the border discussion into a seperate section. The two paragraphs are merged together and duplicate information is removed. There were no citations in the old text, and Ḯ've added citation needed everywhere to state this.
Since the old text was very poorly written and almost impossible to understand, the rewrite may not mirror the original intention of the authors. I welcome others to correct the text, at least it's now possible to read it.
I'm from Walsall and i consider it to be a part of the Black Country, mainly because of it's leather production and the way people talk. Wolverhampton i also consider to be a part of the Black Country, including Dudley, Sandwell, West Bromwich, Northern Birmingham and everywhere between. I don't think there is actually a border or map which could explain where the boundary of the Black Country begins and ends. It's slightly different wherever you go mainly because of it's people and i think that's where the problem lies, people have settled with this and i know for a fact that 2 generations ago there was a neighborhood in southern cannock (bridgtown) which could partially be considered a part of the Black Country because of it's people. Defining where the Black Country is, is not easy like defining London or elsewhere, it's like saying, draw a diagram on this map showing where all of the Londoners live. We should dismiss trying to put a definate location on where the Black Country is, for the nearest answer, 'West Midlands' and 'Southern Staffordshire' would be appropiate but this still wouldn't include every part of it.
Someone mentioned that Heath Town was a part of the Black Country but Wolverhampton was not, or near enough this idea, well that i can say is practically impossible to say. Heath Town is maybe a mile away from Wolverhampton Town Centre and on one of the key roads towards it. Saying Wolverhampton was not part of the Black Country and Heath Town is, must surely be on thoughts. The 'Black Country Museum' i believe is based within Wolverhampton and much of the coal mining and furnaces are still visible here. Metal Factories cover large industrial estates which litter Wolverhampton too, showing a clear heritage.
It's my belief that the Black Country itself should be defined by it's people, not location. By doing so your forgetting MBC's and towns, your linking the Black Country to the workplaces and the people that worked within them (or their ancestors), that is how the area came of it's name.
AccuraUK 00:03, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
The Black Country Museum is within a mile of Dudley Town Centre and is further away from Wolverhampton than Dudley itself.
I would also question the inclusion of blackcountrypodcasting. It's not a notable media outlet - I had lived in the Black Country for 18 years and as a youth would expected to have heard of such a thing but I never knew it existed?
For me, that paragraph is shameless advertising. Thoughts? Worley-d 19:37, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
- I agree with much of what Worley-d says. Perhaps blackcountrypodcasting is advertising; however as there is already a link to the BBC Black Country web page and a paragraph and a link to the Express and Star, we can hardly remove just one of them. This advertising needs to be watched, and if they multiply, then culling will be needed.Pyrotec 20:16, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
- While I know not a lot about Heath Town vs. Wolvo., I've long argued that Cannock (and some of its surrounding areas) should come under the Black Country label.
- I think, what I'm saying in essence, is that I agree with AccuraUK, in that defining the Black Country's not as easy to do as defining (for example) London is.
Removal of profiteering links and incorrectly stated quotes
I also agree that advertising should be removed as a whole but again do we remove just the links that are clearly making a profit i.e businesses such as the Express and Star and the BBC or should local community groups such as Black Country Gob www.blackcountrygob.com be removed?
There is a place for promotion of such groups that are infact promoting the region and not just out to make profit from. The Black Country region is full of people with memories and Black Country Gob is collecting those memories via it's members just as wikipedia is. There is no claim to be the only one however you will see that as an active forum and a great and popular genealogy section BCG has omething to offer. Surely for a place such as this it is paramount to get correct information and where best but from the mouths of real Black Country Folk!
I am the site admin of BCG and feel that asa community group we can assist the region and it's people and therefore request that we be added to the page with a link to our site. The link serves no seo benefits and so this is not a request for advertising purposes but does let the people interested know they have somewhere to go to meet others and also to research the region and gain true facts from the true people not just some university graduate who reckons they know all about the Black Country "because they read a book".
Anyone care to support this non profit community group? :) I can be emailed at Gobby@blackcountrygob.com should anyone wish to contact me. Sorry if I placed this comment incorrectly but i'm new to wiki. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 126.96.36.199 (talk) 19:19, 22 July 2008 (UTC)
I would have to say the the Black Country Gob is a great resource for Black Country people. It is full of old information & articles as well comments etc from Black Country people that would make a great resource for material from people who want to learn more about the Black Country. I would definitely recommend a link from this page for those in search of more information. I am not associated in any way with the Black Country Gob and as a resident of the Black Country, I can recognise what a great resource it would be for those from the Black Country as well as the "outsiders". —Preceding unsigned comment added by Thewetdogproject (talk • contribs) 16:43, 10 November 2009 (UTC)
"Thee, Thy and Thou are still in use" I grew up in Kinswinford, and went to College in Stourbridge and I have NEVER heard "Thee, Thy or Thou". "You" is pronounced "Yaw" which I imagine could have been influenced by the sound of "thou" but in means "You" and is not modified in any way that can be compared to Thee/Thy/Thou. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.8.131.52 (talk) 22:03, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
A number of places and features in the Black Country are in Category:West Midlands articles missing geocoordinate data. If you can provide coordinates, please do so. Thank you. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 16:44, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
On OS Maps
To be added later: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/west_midlands/8212725.stm Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 15:47, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
The Black Country in Literature
Does anyone feel that a section with this name could usefully be started??
Removed the part about the accent; horribly written
'The Black Country is also known for its distinctive dialect, which differs slightly in various parts of the region. For instance: "How are you?" in Black country dialect has two variations "ow am ya?" is from the Wolverhampton area and "Ahh bin ya?" in the rest of the Black Country. "Ah bin ya?" is a good example the Black Country Dialect is similar to the German language. "Ah bin ya?" Germany (phonetically) "Ah bist do?"
The common mistake is that the people from the Black Country are associated with Birmingham people, because of the misconception of their close proximity. This can be a great insult to most, as the city of Coventry is nearer to Birmingham in areas than the Black Country and the connection is never made between them.'
The section below on the dialect is much better. However, someone could reword a mention of the dialect in the introduction as for many, the first thing associated with the Black Country is the dialect. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.108.40.206 (talk) 11:06, 27 December 2010 (UTC)
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How does the Black country differ from the West Midlands conurbation?
- The city of Birmingham itself, Solihull and Sutton Coldfield are part of the West Midlands conurbation but not part of the Black Country. Beyond that, it gets tricky, since there's no real agreement on the boundaries of the Black Country itself. Among the biggest questions is the status of Wolverhampton: much of this article seems to have been written with a sweeping mindset that no part of Wolverhampton qualifies at all, but not everyone would agree with that - even local residents.
- For example: in the southeast corner of the area governed by Wolverhampton City Council is Bilston, which has a strong heritage of coal mining, steel making and so on, and which definitely has a Black Country character. In the northwest corner is Tettenhall, which has a much more rural history. One thing that Wolverhampton certainly does share with places like Dudley is a dislike of being lumped in as "really part of Birmingham", and using the Black Country name is a handy way of showing that. I actually come from Wolverhampton, so it's not only "outsiders" who get confused! Loganberry (Talk) 02:23, 5 May 2014 (UTC)