- 1 Grammar and Language of the main paragraphs
- 2 Tone and assertions
- 3 Documentation for claims
- 4 Measuring Body Image
- 5 Attractiveness and social issues
- 6 More Info Needed
- 7 Body Image vs. Body Imaging
- 8 BDD
- 9 Removal of Entry: "Disambiguation Issue."
- 10 Added Entry: "Body Image and the Brain"
- 11 treatment?
- 12 Transsexualism
- 13 Removed Sentence
- 14 Section on Obesity
- 15 Missing info about "flabby"
- 16 Sex differences
- 17 Media additions
- 18 Dismantling the media pressures of body image
- 19 'In Hollywood' Addition
- 20 Section titled "Dismantling the media pressures of body image"
- 21 The Negative Effects from the Media on Body Image
- 22 Sexuality and Body Image
- 23 Changing the Images
- 24 Race and Body Image
Grammar and Language of the main paragraphs
The writing needs to be completely redone, with all of the "his or her" and "their" references. I don't feel I am capable of the complete rewrite that is needed. If no one else can do it, I can try, but I am not the best one to try. I guess I'll watch and try some drafts off-line in the mean time.
Tone and assertions
The "Body image and weight" section is poorly done at the very least. I'm not sure why the writer thought it was appropriate to assume that all people classified as overweight "should" lose weight, or perhaps less controversially, to assume that the population of people who think they need to lose weight is neatly contained within that of people classified as overweight. There's a lot of serious medical evidence contradicting the first assertion and the second simply seems to fly in the face of common sense. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 22.214.171.124 (talk) 04:20, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
The tone blithely assumes that the overweight ought to have a negative self-image, ought to lose weight, or have benefitted from social pressures about weight. The tone is not neutral and expresses faddish pseudo-science in support of prejudice against the fat.Cyranorox (talk) 17:08, 13 December 2010 (UTC)
Perhaps someone has already edited that section, as I don't see anythign terribly controversial in it. If there are still problems, feel free to edit. as of this point the NPOV tag has been there for 9 months without much change so I'm removing it —Preceding unsigned comment added by 126.96.36.199 (talk) 14:34, 31 March 2011 (UTC)
Documentation for claims
The article makes assertions about women's consciousness regarding weight.
This is appropriate for some women. Some are too concerned about body weight. On the other hand, many women (and of course men) are not thinking and acting in a healthy manner regarding their weight. A very high proportion of American males and females are obese. Dogru144, 12:40, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
Your point? Obese people may be just as concerned about their body weight as their skinny counterparts.
Mention some case studies? It will make the reader understand the concept more practically. fuck u ===Advertisments===hi Why does this word not appear when the standar pair of reference brackets are used? I removed them, so that the word advertisments would appear. I will first try to put s after the closing brackets. Dogru144, 12:40, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
Measuring Body Image
I don't understand how body image is measured and how it may identify obese people as having a poor body image just because they are aware that they are obese. Is there an example of the questions asked?Guava 19:41, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
I removed some of the statements that attempted to link "healthy" weight expectations with predicted body image perceptions.Guava 19:41, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
This isn't linked very well with body image. "Ideal" body shape should be an individual assessment, not a collective assessment.Guava 19:41, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
More Info Needed
There is considerable research done about body image. One important source that covers such research is Sarah Grogan's Body Image: Understanding Body Dissatisfaction in Men, Women and Children. Body Image is actually a huge topic that needs a lot of work.
Yyarin 00:33, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
Body Image vs. Body Imaging
Body image is the idea of what the body should look like. It is a social and culturally defined perception. Body imaging is the idea of how one's brain unconciously "sees" the body. It is based on the neural representation in the brain either by motor neurons or sensory neurons. I'm not sure if Body Imaging is the appropriate term, but these two concepts are incredibly different from each other, further, as I have stated in another comment, Body Image is a very large topic, Body Imaging can probably be covered in about one or two paragraphs.
Yyarin 00:32, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
The term body image (not body imaging) is used in neuroscience, neurology, and other sciences.
Cynic2005 11:11, 23 October 2007 (UTC)
- It should be clarified that "body image" has two meanings used in two separate contexts. Two articles, one for each meaning, is even better.--AMSA83 21:54, 1 June 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by AMSA83 (talk • contribs)
Body Dismorfic Disorder should be mentioned in this article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.8.131.52 (talk) 21:56, 22 January 2007 (UTC) i 2nd that 184.108.40.206 (talk) 22:15, 15 April 2013 (UTC)
Removal of Entry: "Disambiguation Issue."
There is another technical use of the term "body image", which refers to the association of areas of the motor cortex with the voluntary movement of body members. This is often shown as the motor homunculus depicted by Dr. Wilder Penfield. This image distorts the body according to the areas of the motor cortex associated with its movements. For example, it shows the thumb as larger than the thigh because the thumb's movement is much more complex than that of the thigh and thus occupies a larger area of the cortex. The motor homunculus plays a central role in proprioception. This body image is involved in phantom limb phenomena as well as their opposite, as in the case of brain damage resulting in the disappearance of parts of the body from conscious perception.
I removed this because it is partially misinforming. Proprioception correlates to somatosensory, motor, and parietal cortices. Body image refers to the sense that you have a body (which involves proprioception, the vestibular system, and vision.) Body Image does not refer to the motor or sensory homunculus itself. Also, the motor cortex does play a role in proprioception and phantom limbs, but central to its role is voluntary movement, not proprioception.
cynic2005 09:19, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
Added Entry: "Body Image and the Brain"
First, I added my own entry to the article, and correspondingly updated the references section. Secondly, I edited the first sentence and following first paragraph. Lastly I merged the first paragraph, and the entry "Research: measuring body image," under "Body Image and Physical Appearance." This article may need a new lead paragraph, highlighting both usages of the term "body image."
cynic2005 06:19, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
Here is a study relating to the brain structure of male-to-female transgendered and transsexual individuals, in an attempt to solidify the "female brain in male body" theory surrounding gender identity disorder: http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/85/5/2034
Hi, I'm a student editor here. As part of a project for my college class, I researched gender and sexuality in relation to body image for this article. This is what I wrote in regards to gender and body image, particularly discussing transgender/transsexual individuals. I'd like to see it added to the section on gender differences:
"Although gender is a socially constructed concept created to categorize people into a binary system, one’s gender identity has an impact on one’s body image and self-esteem. Some poor body image can stem from gender dysphoria, but a majority of gendered insecurities are rooted in social standards of beauty. While both cis men and women suffer from poor body image, sharing similar phenomenology of the condition, rates of comorbidity, and levels of body dissatisfaction, women are stereotyped for being dissatisfied with their physical appearances. Body image is considered a women’s issue. Because of this stigma surrounding eating disorders and poor body image, fewer men seek help or report their illnesses. Even though some discrepancies exist between men and women who present with clinical levels of eating pathology, the similarities appear to outweigh the differences. Men tend to have muscular dissatisfaction while women tend to have body dissatisfaction. Because lean muscularity is stereotypically seen as more masculine, men have a desire to obtain this body type. Women, simply aim for thinner bodies.
Body image issues that impact cisgender people affect transgender men and women; however, there is more of a social pressure to assert masculinity or femininity for trans people than there is for cis people. Trans individuals experience negative body image to a greater scale than cisgender men and women. Social validation of gender identity is important for people who may have been gender blending at some point in their lives but who found that landing firmly on one side of the fence rather than the other… is important and meaningful for [them]… [I]t is a mistake of society not to recognize this. It is also necessary to acknowledge who can afford to transition, both in the literal and metaphorical sense. Many transgender and transsexual people are expelled from the workplace for not following gendered dress codes, and face physical, emotional, and sexual abuse. Film and literature present women with masculine characteristics negatively, impacting how transgender and gender non-conforming masculine-presenting people view themselves. Interpretations of what qualifies as male presentation also vary between and within cultures. Masculinity is expressed in body language, behavior, occupation, speech, vocalization, inflection, content, and cultural stereotypes of appropriate actions. Many trans men are focused on how they are perceived physically as men, however.
Trans women also suffer from negative body image in ways that are different from cis women and trans men. Unfortunately, not enough research has been done on body image and self-perception within the transgender female and gender non-conforming female-presenting communities. Trans and gender non-conforming people of color also have different experiences with body image, but there is a lack of research regarding these specific groups." — Preceding unsigned comment added by Queercello (talk • contribs)
- Queercello (talk · contribs), thank you for bringing your proposed material to the article talk page first, after this latest message I left on your talk page. It would have been better if you had started started a new section on the talk page for your proposed content, however. This is because, as noted at Wikipedia:Talk page guidelines#Layout, posts at the bottom of the talk page indicate that they are the newer discussions; therefore, they are likelier to get more attention. In this case, however, Grayfell and I are aware of the content you are attempting to add to the article. Where are you proposing that your content be placed in the article? Also, remember to sign your username when discussing matters on Wikipedia talk pages. All you have to do to sign your username is simply type four tildes (~), like this:
~~~~. I added an "unsigned" tag for your comment above. Flyer22 (talk) 01:26, 29 December 2014 (UTC)
- Flyer22 (talk · contribs), I'm new to Wikipedia and editing so I'm sorry about my previous mistakes. I'd like to see the edit at the bottom of the Gender Differences section. Queercello (talk) 01:45, 29 December 2014 (UTC)
- (I've added a reflist to this section, just to make it easier for me to see the proposed references. Grayfell (talk) 01:57, 29 December 2014 (UTC))
- Hello again. Including info on transgender in this article is a good goal. I think the proposed edit has some problems, but the sources, at least at a glance, seem acceptable to me.
- The proposed edits are not phrased in an entirely neutral way. For example, stating that gender is a socially constructed concept, without any qualification or explanation, is not really going to work. That's not universally supported by reliable sources, so the edit would need to be phrased to make that clear. A case could be made that the academic consensus is headed in that direction, but it's not there yet, and the body image article isn't the ideal place to go into that debate. Gender, gender binary, gender role, and gender identity are better for that. Some of those articles are in need of good academic sources, by the way. I would suggest looking over Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Words to watch. As another example, in the last paragraph the word "unfortunately" is making a value judgement, and should be rephrased to attribute the value judgement to a specific person or group, rather than using Wikipedia's voice to make that call. That entire paragraph needs a reliable source, as well. Grayfell (talk) 02:58, 29 December 2014 (UTC)
- Queercello (talk · contribs), for replies, check back in the sections you post to the talk page. Replies might come swiftly or not, or there might be no replies. For example, Grayfell replied to you above. In addition to what he stated, you need to keep your punctuations clean; see WP:REFPUNCT. Flyer22 (talk) 01:47, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
- Here is my edited version of the section I was hoping to add. I hope this is more neutral and appropriate for Wikipedia:
- "Gender identity has an impact on one’s body image and self-esteem. Some poor body image can stem from gender dysphoria, but a majority of gendered insecurities are rooted in social standards of beauty.
- While both cis men and women suffer from poor body image, sharing similar phenomenology of the condition, rates of comorbidity, and levels of body dissatisfaction, women are stereotyped for being dissatisfied with their physical appearances. Body image is considered a women’s issue. Because of this stigma surrounding eating disorders and poor body image, fewer men seek help or report their illnesses. Even though some discrepancies exist between men and women who present with clinical levels of eating pathology, the similarities appear to outweigh the differences. Men tend to have muscular dissatisfaction while women tend to have body dissatisfaction. Because lean muscularity is stereotypically seen as more masculine, men have a desire to obtain this body type. Women, simply aim for thinner bodies.
- Body image issues that impact cisgender people affect transgender men and women; however, there is more of a social pressure to assert masculinity or femininity for trans people than there is for cis people. Trans individuals experience negative body image to a greater scale than cisgender men and women. Social validation of gender identity is important for people who may have been gender blending at some point in their lives but who found that landing firmly on one side of the fence rather than the other is important and meaningful for them; it is a mistake of society not to recognize this. It is also necessary to acknowledge who can afford to transition, both in the literal and metaphorical sense. Many transgender and transsexual people are expelled from the workplace for not following gendered dress codes, and face physical, emotional, and sexual abuse. Film and literature present women with masculine characteristics negatively, impacting how transgender and gender non-conforming masculine-presenting people view themselves. Interpretations of what qualifies as male presentation also vary between and within cultures. Masculinity is expressed in body language, behavior, occupation, speech, vocalization, inflection, content, and cultural stereotypes of appropriate actions. Many trans men are focused on how they are perceived physically as men, however.
- Not enough research has been done on body image within the transgender female and gender non-conforming female-presenting communities, or in the transgender people of color."Queercello (talk) 16:01, 7 January 2015 (UTC)
I cited Vilayanur S. Ramachandran as the originator of the idea "which may explain transsexualism." I removed the following sentence: "While anything is 'possible', one must question the likelihood of any notion that suggests an organ can possess its own sex." Whether or not an organ can possess its own sex is not relevent to the topic of the article. This interpolated sentence also appears to be the bias of the contributor which seems to be based on a limited understanding of the brain and the theory implied.
cynic2005 10:07, 13 February 2009 (UTC)
Section on Obesity
It seems to me that the section entitled "obesity a brain disorder?" is not only poorly written, but also fails to make a relevant connection to the subject of this article. After significant editing, this section could potentially be placed under "obesity". If you disagree, please comment. Otherwise, I will eliminate this section.Wiki emma johnson (talk) 00:28, 31 August 2009 (UTC) (: —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.127.116.11 (talk) 05:44, 8 April 2010 (UTC)
Missing info about "flabby"
I am going to change the title from "sex differences" to "gender differences". I also am going to add some subheadings to this category. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Eleonor.thomas (talk • contribs) 20:10, 21 April 2014 (UTC)
Firstly, I agree with the sex differences change. When talking about body image, it is important to use the word gender instead of sex because we are talking about societal constructs. Also, it may be good to add some more about media that is coming out now that wishes to transform our obsession with skinny bodies. Specifically, I am referring to the DOVE campaigns that are about loving your body. These are geared toward women, but if there are any for men, that would be good to add as well.
Dismantling the media pressures of body image
I added this section to this page to offer viewers examples of how films and advertisements are being made that challenge the media. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Eleonor.thomas (talk • contribs) 20:23, 5 May 2014 (UTC)
'In Hollywood' Addition
I wanted to shed some light on how Hollywood impacts people's body images as well, so I wrote this subsection. It was suggested that I make some edits, so this is a modified version of what I wrote. Thoughts? Here it is: The mass media, including magazines, television, and social media websites, portrays idealized images of both men and women that represent both genders as perfect or better than reality.  While many factors lead to distorted body image, the mass media is largely at fault, especially the entertainment industry that is rooted in Hollywood. The entertainment industry consistently sends messages to women and men that their bodies are imperfect or flawed through airbrushed and refined celebrities, all with toned bodies, styled hair, and clear skin.  In a survey of 1,000 people regarding the impact of Hollywood images, only 10% said they were completely satisfied with their bodies, and 80% admitted that the depictions on television, in movies, and in fashion magazines made them feel insecure about their appearances. 34% would even be willing to try diets that pose health risks.  Essentially, Hollywood and the entertainment industry influence both women and men’s personal perspectives on their bodies and convey unhealthy messages about beauty and perfection.  (Pawsworth101 (talk) 00:53, 28 May 2014 (UTC))
- I recommend reading WP:NPOV, as that addresses several difficulties with your contribution. Having Wikipedia say that mass media is at fault is a problem. Unless it is a completely uncontroversial point, backed up with sources, Wikipedia doesn't say someone's at fault, no matter how strongly we might feel about it. The article could explain who says someone's at fault, and maybe why their opinion is significant, but not as though it were coming from Wikipedia directly. Additionally, a survey in People magazine is not good enough as a source. It's not really a scientific journal, so polls like that are rarely statistically reliable enough to use. Otherwise your use of sources if pretty good. Since you've only got two sources, the whole thing is a little unbalanced in terms of WP:DUE weight. You might want to either find more sources, or make the section more concise. Again, the main obstacle you will need to overcome is that your contributions read a little too much like advocacy. No matter how strongly you believe something, this isn't the place for that (WP:NOTADVOCATE). I hope that helps. Grayfell (talk) 05:54, 28 May 2014 (UTC)
Section titled "Dismantling the media pressures of body image"
This is regarding this section, which I deleted. The first paragraph was totally unsourced, but had some possibly useful content phrased in a way that had advocacy problems. The second paragraph had sources, but they were more clearly related to other sections, where they would make more sense. It was also not NPOV. There's also an issues with using a primary source for a scientific study, which should generally be avoided. Since the last paragraph seemed to degrade into an apparent guerrilla marketing campaign for Dove beauty products, I decided to just remove the whole section pending further discussion. Grayfell (talk) 05:36, 28 May 2014 (UTC)
The Negative Effects from the Media on Body Image
Body image is a huge issue in today’s world. Many young girls and boys (as well as adults) are impacted every day by the media, and what they feel they should look like. The media consists of television, magazines, movies, billboards, etc.. Through the media, people are shown what “beauty” is supposed to be. When a company wants to sell a new beauty product or campaign, they typically use a skinny woman, or a tall slim man. When this happens, that little girl who rushes home from school and flips on the T.V. see’s this and automatically associates skinny with beauty. If this little girl happens to be overweight, she may take this commercial to heart and in turn develop an eating disorder or a psychological disorder. Sure this seems far fetched, but it happens far more than the public realizes. If more celebrities or even just regular people decided to take a stand and put a stop to all of this body hatred, the human population would be far better off, and much happier. If this happens, in the future another little girl might rush home to the television and feel like the most beautiful girl on the planet, inside and out. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.104.22.168 (talk) 23:29, 30 July 2014 (UTC)
Sexuality and Body Image
We need a section that relates sexuality and body image. I wrote this section and was hoping we could add it to the article after the section on Gender Differences:
"Sexual minority women have the highest incidence of body dysmorphic disorder and body dissatisfaction at 7.7%. Heterosexism and homophobia or biphobia are realities for LGBTQ+ individuals, and discrimination can have a tremendous impact on sexual minority women’s mental health. Body image problems among bisexual women are rarely studied. Most research on body image has focused on heterosexual women or lesbians, contributing to bisexual erasure that occurs both within our heteronormative society and within the LGBTQ+ community. Dominant sexualities and gender binaries leave bisexual women feeling invisible and contribute to body dissatisfaction in bisexual women. Many studies of sexual orientation and body image in women lump together lesbians and bisexual women, failing to acknowledge differences in the psychosocial factors that impact body image. Nearly all women face social pressure to conform to idealized standards of female beauty, but bisexual women occupy a different social standing due to their attraction to two genders. Many bisexual women identify with both heterosexual culture and lesbian culture. Lesbian communities have been seen as "feminist safe havens where lesbians and bisexual women can separate themselves from the dominant heterosexist culture." Feminist values, such as critique of female objectification and standards for female beauty, play an important role in how bisexual and lesbian women perceive themselves and their bodies. However, because a significant portion of bisexual women are interested in relationships with men and in attracting men, they may feel pressure from patriarchal ideals.
Lesbians often feel better protected from body image issues because, some believe, "the lesbian community challenges heterosexual culture’s objectification of women." Some studies show that lesbians have higher self-esteem and less body dissatisfaction; when comparing bisexual and lesbian women of equal weights have been compared, lesbian women have been more satisfied with their bodies. On the other hand, some believe that idealized femininity is pervasive, and women are expected to live up to cultural standards for womanhood which center around appearance. Thinness is often a component of femininity. Some theoretical frameworks believe that lesbians have been socialized to focus on their physical appearances just like heterosexual women have been. There is a complicated role of societal messages promoting patriarchal ideals of femininity for lesbians.
There is an overrepresentation of gay males in eating disorder samples. However, homosexual and bisexual men experience body dissatisfaction differently than women. There is a societal pressure for gay men to be more “physically attractive,” a label stereotypically characterized by lean muscularity. Homophobia and discrimination negatively impact homosexual men’s body image and self-perception. Because gay men are exposed to higher concentrations of estrogen in the womb, many of them act stereotypically “female” and are unfortunately characterized by stereotypically feminine behaviors, like restrictive eating. Sexual minority men, particularly sexual minority men living with HIV, have elevated body image disturbance and increased depressive symptoms. Negative body image in gay and bisexual men is related to biological causes (lipodystrophy) and sociocultural variables." Queercello (talk) 02:10, 29 December 2014 (UTC)
Changing the Images
The current images at the top of the article do not fully encompass body image and the issues that come with it. I believe they need changing. I do not understand how to navigate Wikipedia Commons, so if someone else could do it, that would be great. Once copyright issues have been sorted, etc., I recommend images similar to these: https://20something1thinking.files.wordpress.com/2014/05/12-positive-body-image-from-michelbritney00-blogspot-com-1.jpg and http://shortroundandfast.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/Body-image-photo.jpg.
Of course, the ones I recommended cannot be used because they are not on Wikipedia Commons, but I think images that are similar to them would fit the article. I just don't think the current pictures are the best suited for it. Queercello (talk) 17:15, 3 January 2015 (UTC)
Race and Body Image
We need a section that relates race and body image. I wrote this and would like to see it after the section titled Body Image and Weight:
Prejudicial stereotypes about gender and race are unconsciously absorbed by children and reflected in their self-esteem and body image. Cultural influences, mainly illustrated through pictures in books, perpetuate bodily stereotypes. Children and adolescents of color, due to the lack of representation in media and advertising campaigns, mirror characteristics that apply to white children and teenagers. Lighter skin, light and straight hair, light eyes, and thinness are seen as beautiful within communities of color as well as white communities. Research shows that relatively fewer Blacks suffer from negative body image and disordered eating. Black women are less vulnerable to body-image dissatisfaction and are more proud of their bodies than whites and Hispanics. Overall, Black women and girls are more satisfied with their bodies than white women due to the acceptance of larger body sizes within their communities. However, there is also research that suggests that people of color are often overlooked in studies, which leads to a large underrepresentation of these issues within those communities. Many racial differences in body image may exist due to the type of self-presentation and likelihood of weight problems. Some research suggests that Black girls and women express a desire to lose weight because there is often a greater likelihood of becoming overweight due to the socioeconomic statuses of minorities. There are also differences in standards of beauty within communities of color. Latina and African American standards describe round and heavier frames. Women of color in America, however, struggle to fit into white culture, where women are slim and fit. Participants of color in studies acknowledged the thinness ideal and rejected it through active resistance. They identified both physical and nonphysical attributes as beautiful, including hair, skin tone, curviness, confidence, personal style self-care, strength, and spirituality. “Black women are not immune to the thinness ideal but are perpetually coping with it.” For black women, hair and skin tone, attributes that are not considered in self-image for white women, are important. As per societal standards, natural hair is less attractive as opposed to relaxed hair or wearing a weave. Women who are of darker skin tones are deemed less beautiful than those with lighter skin tones. As found in a study of sun-exposure behavior of East Asian immigrants in Australia, many eastern societies stress that fair skin is more beautiful than tanned skin, leading to a tradition of covering skin when outdoors, and no sunbathing culture. Shadeism and racism contribute to cultural beauty standards, where slender, white women are depicted as more beautiful than curvaceous, full-figured dark-skinned black women. Although negative body image and self-esteem issues are less common in women of color, they are not immune to societal pressures of ideal body image. Queercello (talk) 01:32, 5 January 2015 (UTC)