Talk:Brønsted–Lowry acid–base theory

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Redundant

Much of this information is already covered in detail at Acid-base reaction theories. Propose removing this page and adding one of the examples from here to the theories page.Sareen eng 06:20, 28 July 2005 (UTC)

Agreed. This page (and its relatives Lewis Acid theory etc...) should be subsections of a larger acid-base theory page, currently named Acid–base reaction. That page should probably be renamed. Acid-base pages on wikipedia in general seem to be a bit of a backwater, with talk pages years old and similar lapses in major edits to articles that would benefit from more attention. Zolot (talk) 20:28, 2 January 2013 (UTC)

Boric acid

I am trying to understand your use of the word "exemplifies" in the sentence "The case of boric acid exemplifies the usefulness of the Brønsted-Lowry concept as the acid does not in fact dissociate." I would say that boric acid is not an example of a Brønsted acid, but rather a Lewis acid, with the empty orbital on the boron reacting with OH-. One could explain that it is an exception, but as this article is on Brønsted acids and bases, I am not really certain why it is included. Could you comment? Dirac66 (talk) Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Petergans"Signed Petergans (talk) 07:14, 2 August 2008 (UTC)

Housecroft and Sharpe, Inorganic Chemistry, chapter 6. Quote "A Brønsted acid can act as a proton donor". Specifically, it does not require that the proton is produced by dissociation. Boric acid conforms to the general expression
acid + base $\leftrightharpoons$ conjugate base + conjugate acid
Petergans (talk) 07:14, 2 August 2008 (UTC)

Thanks. I found your quote on p.163 (2nd edition 2005) and I think that it is ambiguous about dissociation and could be interpreted as you say. However chapter 6 does not mention boric acid, and all the examples of Brønsted acids there are of dissociation. So I looked through the specific references to boric acid in Housecroft and Sharpe and found on p.314-5 (sec. 12.7) the sentence "In aqueous solution, B(OH)3 behaves as a weak acid, but is a Lewis acid rather than Brønsted acid" [Authors' italics]. In view of this second quote from the same book, I think the phrase "proton donor" must be understood to refer to dissociation.

Upon reflexion, I suggest that it is worth pointing out that boric acid is different, but without stating that it is a Brønsted acid. Perhaps "Some acids form H+ (or H3O+) without dissociation of the acid. For example, the reaction of boric acid with water is ......, so that it is a Lewis acid and not a Brønsted acid." Dirac66 (talk) 03:12, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

Formulas in Image

The image in this article describing the self-ionization of water gives the formula of water as HO2 rather than H2O, and of the hydronium ion as HO3+ rather than H3O+. The renditions of the molecules, however, seem be accurate under the assumption that the larger red sphere represents oxygen. 165.124.142.247 (talk) 08:17, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

Yes, you are correct. Fixing an image requires modifying the original image file, so I wrote a note (in French) on the talk page of the (French) user who created it at fr:Discussion utilisateur:Cdang. Hopefully it will be fixed soon. Dirac66 (talk) 13:18, 8 April 2010 (UTC)
Done--Wickey-nl (talk) 15:26, 10 April 2010 (UTC)
Hello,
the problem lay in the way MediaWiki transforms the SVG in PNG. If your Web navigator can display SVG, you can check that the SVG looks different than the PNG and even than the way Inkscape shows it.
I already made a bug reports few years ago, but nothing changed…
cdang|write me 16:08, 10 April 2010 (UTC)
I'll assume you are correct - I can't check as my browser does not display SVG as far as I know. Since it is better to have an image which displays correctly on everyone's browser, it will be best to keep Wickey-nl's version now. Dirac66 (talk) 20:03, 10 April 2010 (UTC)
Of course, this was not the point, it was just an explaination (the formulas are OK but not well rendered). If you use IE, you have plugins for this, see SVG#SVG and Microsoft Internet Explorer.
cdang|write me 10:20, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
It seems it is displayed correct in all browsers, now: [1]. I had replaced all text elements. --Wickey-nl (talk) 11:19, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
Do you mean you changed the texts → paths?
cdang|write me 06:50, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
I removed all texts and made new ones.--Wickey-nl (talk) 14:48, 20 April 2010 (UTC)