Talk:Bukovina

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Untitled[edit]

Lipovans[edit]

There is nothing about Old-Russian settlement in Bukovina. Could somebody write more about that? Luka Jačov 11:37, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

The flag is wrong[edit]

The flag is all wrong: first of all, the blue-red colours were disposed vertically! You'll have to rotate the picture to the right, I guess. And the flag also had the coat of arms af Bukovina disposed in the center (see it here: http://ro.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imagine:Bukovina_1910_%28Wappen%29.jpg.). At least the colours must be fixed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.107.121.199 (talk) 12:52, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

Bukovina Germans' role; Roman Dacia[edit]

I read the mindless drivel and stupid nationalist arguing on the other talk page. You guys are all nuts. It was the Bukovina Germans who civilized all you lot, gave you the first decent government you had (Maria Theresa and Joseph, 1775-1790) and freed you from the Ottoman yoke. Fortunately, most of them were intelligent enough to get out of there and come to decent countries like the US and Canada. I note that in the current article there is only one sentence dedicated to them, though they built everything that is still standing from the 1775-1918 period, and they made up some 25% of the population for a century and a half.

And if we want to argue about who treated the Jews worse, the Romanians and Ukrainians are right up there with the Germans in the great historical guilt sweepstakes. So get over all these ancient grudges and behave like adults.

Oh, by the way, no Romans ever came anywhere near Bukovina. Roman Dacia was an obscure minor province, barely settled, basically a military buffer zone, and its boundaries stopped a couple of hundred kilometres south of Bukovina. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.156.1.119 (talk) 17:56, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

I find this last part to be quite bizarre. To say that Roman Dacia was "obscure", "minor", "barely settled" is unrealistic. Roman documents and archaeological fids show the extensive Roman settlement in Dacia, the establishment of Roman cities, the thriving economic life, reason for which it became known as "Dacia Felix", therefore not a just a "military buffer zone". It is known that what was designed in 1775 to be "Bukowina" was not part of Roman Dacia. And, yes there should be more in the article regarding the German contribution to Bukovina`s cultural and economic life, but I reject altogheter this kind of atitude: "the Bukovina Germans who civilized all you lot", which is simply insulting to everything there was before 1775, and to the other ethnic groups in Bukovina.(Daniel1918 (talk) 12:53, 6 September 2008 (UTC))
Romanians have built over there (before the arrival of the "civilized" germans) some things which are nowadays part of the UNESCO patrimony. On the contrary there are not a single one built by the the germans. Also.. keep your ignorance for yourself (your boorishness is only your problem) even you've been trying to spread it around with some political correctness false spices. —Preceding unsigned comment added by FabricioRB (talkcontribs) 06:31, 22 August 2010 (UTC)


@the OP--You are half correct with your mention of Roman Dacia, as it's core consisted of Transylvania proper, Banat (including Serbian Banat) and Lesser Wallachia, and briefly including the rest of Wallachia, southernmost Moldavia and Southern Bessarabia (South of Upper Trajan's Wall), though for the most part, the overwhelming majority of Moldavia was un-effected by Roman rule. It seems that both sides rely too much on Dacia--one disregarding it entirely, the other making it their cornerpiece while the truth most likely lies in the middle--with equal emphasis on the Romanized inhabitants of Bulgaria north of the Balkan Mountains, northeast Serbia (excluding Vojvodina) and the Dobruja who would have fled north (and a smaller number south to the Pindus region) after the Bulgarian invasion and settlement of those regions and adjunct regions to the south and southwest.
As for the rest of your post, it is garbage. The Romanians established a state on their own by in the region the mid 14th century and those of Moldavia had no contact with any Germans, only those of Transylvania and Wallachia did so via the Transylvanian Saxons who were an isolated outgroup. Regarding the Bukovina Germans, they were simply sent into the region to populate it, in the same sense as the Danube Swabians were sent into Hungary to repopulate it because of the devastation of the Turkic wars. The policy of populating Bukovina proved fortunate in the short run but disastrous in the long run (just as with the repopulation of Hungary) as large numbers of Ukrainians, along with smaller numbers of Jews and Poles were moved in from neighboring Galicia, reducing the previously homogenous Romanian population to a minority, concentrated around the southeastern third of North Bukovina.
This minority status thus allowed Soviet Russia to act on it's 'Drang nach Westen' policy of gorging itself on foreign lands and deporting the inhabitants in violation of everything civilized, just, honorable and human, lowering it's already near bottom standards to that of Nazi racial policies and greater states, something that the USSR's successor states have yet to raise themselves above, with Belarus still celebrating September 17th--the 'official' day of the 4th partition of Poland. Instead of annexing what was simply Ukrainian and Belorussian--about 2/3 of North Bukovina, the northernmost parts of Bessarabia around Khotin, and just over half of Poland 'east of the Curzon Line'--everything was taken. What happened to North Bukovina--where a third of the native Romanian population was murdered or deported between 1940-1959, much like what was done in Eastern Poland (and to a lesser extent Bessarabia, though brainwashing replaced deportation for the most part following WWII, just like with the Bulgarians in Vardar Macedonia), despite the Polish majority in the Wilno region (the western 3/4 of Wilno, northwest 3/5 of Nowogrodek and eastern Bialystok) and the mixed Polish and Pro Polish population of northeastern Galicia (eastern Lwow and all of Tarnopol), the whole region was swallowed by the USSR and purged of it's 3,500,000 Poles, along with the additional 1,200,000 in the USSR and 150,000 in the Baltic States...however by 1950 only 2/7 of the 4,850,000 Eastern Poles remained in their homelands. Likewise, the southwestern most portion of Bessarabia which had a Romanian majority (up to the Tasbunar River) which was likewise eliminated. Prussia1231 (talk) 20:03, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

Massacre of Fantana Alba[edit]

I noted with surprise that the Fântâna Albă massacre in Bucovina (see wikipedia English and Romanian) has not been mentioned. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Arnaldo Mauri (talkcontribs) 22:22, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

Bukovinan or Bukovinian[edit]

Which is the correct attributive (or adjectival) form of the place name? -- Deborahjay (talk) 10:03, 27 September 2009 (UTC)

ow2do?[edit]

|flag_p1=Flag_of_Moldavia.svg |s1 = Kingdom of Romania |flag_s1= Flag of Romania.svg |flag_s2= Flag of Ukraine.svg last1misin--i'v[[RSI]]>typin=v.v.hard4me!!>contactme thruMSNpl[sven70=alias (talk) 05:17, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

Expulsions[edit]

After the war the Soviet government deported or killed about 41,000 Romanians.

Presumably, the Soviets also expelled or killed the ethnic German residents, as they did elsewhere in Eastern Europe. Sca (talk) 15:33, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

The Germans of North Bukovina were re-settled by Nazi authorities between 1940-41 much as their counterparts in Eastern Poland, the Baltics and Bessarabia were. Prussia1231 (talk) 19:08, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

Ethnic Breakdown according to the 1930 Romanian census:[edit]

Bukovina:

  • 379,691 Romanians or 44.51%
  • 248,777 Ukrainians or 29.16%
  • 92,492 Jews or 10.84%
  • 75,533 Germans or 8.85%
  • 29,680 Poles or 3.48%
  • 11,881 Hungarians or 1.39%
  • 7,948 Russians or 0.93%
  • 7,197 Others or 0.84%
  • 853,009 Total

The above numbers were derived from combining the statistics of the inter-war Romanian counties of Câmpulung, Cernăuți, Rădăuți, Storojineț and Suceava. The Ukrainian total includes 12,437 of the Hutsul regional Ukrainian subgroup, who on their own account for 1.46% of the region's population. Prussia1231 (talk) 19:09, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

Division of Bukovina Map from US State Department[edit]

It would appear that this map holds merit to the division of Bukovina in 1940 (and again 1947), both in the ethno-linguistic situation of the time and in what, at least then, the US State Department thought the borders should be, though I'd like to see what others have to say about it. While on the subject of Romania and the border changes of 1940-1947, there is a similar map of Bessarabia.

Source Prussia1231 (talk) 00:02, 3 July 2012 (UTC)