Talk:Caitlín R. Kiernan

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Fair use rationale for Image:Murderofangels.jpg[edit]

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Fair use rationale for Image:Lowredmoon.jpg[edit]

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Image:Lowredmoon.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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Image:Silkcov.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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Fair use rationale for Image:Thresholdcov.jpg[edit]

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WikiProject Comics B-Class Assesment required[edit]

This article needs the B-Class checklist filled in to remain a B-Class article for the Comics WikiProject. If the checklist is not filled in by 7th August this article will be re-assessed as C-Class. The checklist should be filled out referencing the guidance given at Wikipedia:Version 1.0 Editorial Team/Assessment/B-Class criteria. For further details please contact the Comics WikiProject. Comics-awb (talk) 15:58, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

C-Class rated for Comics Project[edit]

As this B-Class article has yet to receive a review, it has been rated as C-Class. If you disagree and would like to request an assesment, please visit Wikipedia:WikiProject_Comics/Assessment#Requesting_an_assessment and list the article. Hiding T 14:59, 12 February 2009 (UTC)

Separate list[edit]

Is it time to think about splitting the list of into a separate bibliography / list of works article, as done at Arthur C Clarke & List of works by Arthur C. Clarke.

The continuously growing list here is swamping the article imo, and makes it more diffcult to navigate (ie, if i wanted to see the external links). A list also has the advantage of being a better redirect target for the books, as descriptions of the works can be added. If no opposition, i'll so such a split soon(ish).Yobmod (talk) 15:44, 12 February 2009 (UTC)

I think it is a good idea for all the reasons you stated. I'd been wondering about it myself. Aleta Sing 22:20, 12 February 2009 (UTC)
Oki, i've done the split, and added a "main" link here at the bibliogrpahy. I left what i considered the major works, the novels and collections. If anyone knows better, feel free to move important works from the list article - in the future, i think the novels and collections list should also be reduced (to the most recognised works), but that can be done when the list gets long again.Yobmod (talk) 16:12, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

personal bio details[edit]

Though the following is sourced, I question it's appearance in the article:

"Kiernan is a transsexual,[5] a lesbian,"

How many articles on cisgenered, heterosexual authors bother to point out that the author in question is not transgender and is heterosexual? I might also question the inclusion of the fact that the author's Wiccan, though it seems less questionable than mentioning gender and sexual orientation. There's a distinct double standard here, guys. And unless someone can come up with a very good rationalization for including this information, I'm going to remove. And no, it hardly matters that the author has made the information public in her blog and elsewhere. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Moosalot (talkcontribs) 19:16, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

I would add, I'm going to make this edit tomorrow, unless someone can demonstrate a substantive argument that justifies this singling out of TS/queer persons. --Moosalot (talk) 23:57, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

Did you even bother to read the source? "So, as a transsexual, how can I not write about the transmutation of flesh? How can I not write about having one mind, and a body that doesn't match? So when I'm writing about parahumans in a story like 'Faces in Revolving Souls', it's partly autobiography -- writing about what I've been through. I'm never going to be comfortable in this body, for a lot of reasons, and I'm constantly drawn to the subject of transformation, in a lot of different aspects."
The subject identifies it as an important factor in her writing. Who are you to declare, on the basis of your own views of political correctness, that something an author says is important to her writing is to be censored out of Wikipedia. If you remove this, I'll revert and cite you for vandalism. Hullaballoo Wolfowitz (talk) 00:05, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

Of course I read the source. It's not a question of whether or not Kiernan finds these things relevant to her fiction. Having read many CRK interviews, there are many things she considers very relevant to her fiction that she's publicly discussed (the sea and Lewis Carroll, for example) which aren't noted here. Singling out highly personal, sensitive facts about her gender and sexual orientation – when it's not routinely done with cisgendered, straight authors - is, at best, a questionable double standard. Removing it would hardly constitute vandalism, and I feel like you're resorting to a threat right away, instead of trying to make a reasoned argument (which you've not yet made). --Moosalot (talk) 00:24, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

The fact that she considers it important and discusses it is a good reason for keeping it in. It sounds likeer you have a better case for adding those other details than for removing these. LadyofShalott 00:29, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

If we added everything that she's cited as extremely important – from her blog and interviews, for example, you'd need to write an entire section regarding influence, which you'd be doing, of course, to justify keeping the information that should be edited out. Look at the Stephen King article. Anywhere, does it say, "King is a cisgendered heterosexual"? No, of course not. It's not included in the King entry because his sexuality and gender are considered normative states. --Moosalot (talk) 00:32, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

In his case those details are not particularly pertinent. In hers they are. It is a question of relevance, not normativity. LadyofShalott 00:36, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

Do you honestly, for even a moment, believe that King's wife (a reflection of his heterosexuality) and comfort with his birth sex have not played a huge role is his writing? --Moosalot (talk) 00:39, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

Well, and they are discussed in the article about him, contrary to what you seem to be claiming. LadyofShalott 00:43, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

I do not claim they aren't discussed. I claim that he is not classified or singled-out socially because of them. There's not a special category for "heterosexual American authors." Why not? I'll simply report this to "the biographies of living persons noticeboard" and see how it goes. It's an important issue, well beyond this article, and needs to be addressed. --Moosalot (talk) 00:46, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

I believe I'm going to create categories like "cisgendered scientists" and "heterosexual writers." It baffles me how people fail to see these categories/double standards as discriminatory, or how Wikipedia allows it to persist. It's certainly time it be brought to the attention of the GLAAD and other groups. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Moosalot (talkcontribs) 23:31, 17 July 2012 (UTC)

In Wikipedia Frank Yerby is identified as African-american, Phillip Roth as Jewish and Samuel Delany as gay so there is precedence unless trannsgender is somehow different than racial, religous and gay.Nitpyck (talk) 05:28, 2 December 2012 (UTC)

I'm confused. Shouldn't this article be rewritten to use "he" instead of "she"? If this author is a transsexual that means he has an XY chromosome pair which means male. Unless he has somehow changed that to XX, then she is not appropriate.

Born a male, but no mention of sexual reassignment. Why?[edit]

This seems an important point to me, more important than sexual preference. Because it is important, and nowhere in the article is it mentioned that the subject was born as a male, I call the hiding of this fact extremely intellectually dishonest. I came to Wikipedia to get the answer as to whether I was looking at and listening to a male (male physiognomy and male voice), but I did not get that answer. What does that say about the usefulness of this article?

For instance, other biographies give their subject's birth name as, William Jefferson "Bill" Clinton (born William Jefferson Blythe III; August 19, 1946). We don't have anything like this in the present article. Admittedly, it is very difficult to find any reference of these facts on the subject Caitlin R. Kiernan on the web, not in the subject's own web page or others.

Another example, in a 2008 Locus interview, the name Caitlín Kiernan is repeatedly referred to in its past tense, as in "Caitlín Kiernan was born Ireland and grew up in rural Alabama." Is this true, and is it grammatically correct? Was the baby's birth name "Caitlin"? Encyclopediae should disclose these important biographic details.

Again, "She studied vertebrate paleontology, geology, and biology at the University of Alabama at Birmingham and the University of Colorado at Boulder"...The question being was Caitlin a "she" during this period, and if not, then I would call this a discrepancy or error of grammar. [1] giggle 14:08, 15 December 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gregory.george.lewis (talkcontribs)

The article does say she is transsexual. If you want it to have more details than that, then reliable sources must be found. That is true for any article; it is especially true for a biography of a living person. LadyofShalott 15:19, 15 December 2012 (UTC)

References[edit]