Talk:Characters of Kingdom Hearts

Riku true keyblade master

it was heavily hinted that Riku was the original chosen keyblade master and that sora only got it by mistake since riku led his heart into darkness and wasn't strong enough. In hallow bastion, he gets it from sora proving that he was the original chosen to be keyblade master.

in kingdom hearts 2 final mix, lingering sentiment assumes sora is someone else because he had the keyblade. lingering sentiment says he wasn't the one he chosen yet he also said he remembered him? in kingdom hearts birth by sleep, the scene of Terra watching young sora and young riku playing swords and ven asking aqua to erase him was probably the moment Terra chose riku.

since terra (obviously lingering sentiment) said to sora he known him, but yet thought he was someone else, doesnt that prove riku was chosen since riku could be the only one to be chosen at the time?Linder1990 (talk) 15:59, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

If you don't mind my interjection: all the talk of who was the "true" Keyblade Master seemed to be only a matter of subterfuge in an attempt to manipulate the protagonists. Riku's only source was what Maleficent/Ansem had told him and the only undeniable "proof" he had was when he took the Keyblade from Sora. If you are going to say the proof for Riku being the "true" Keyblade master is when "he gets [the keyblade] from Sora", then wouldn't it be rather significant that Sora took the Keyblade back? Discounting the manipulative dialogue of antagonistic characters, in the series there was never any other talk of a "true" Keyblade master, let alone whether Sora or Riku was this "master". I think the trading back and forth of the keyblade between the two characters only shows that Keyblade wielders both have influence over the blade (refer to the fight between Sora and Roxas in KH2), otherwise, I don't think there is enough empirical data within any of the currently released games to prove either character is the "true" keyblade master. Also consider that by Kingdom Hearts 2, all Keyblade wielding characters have their own Keyblades, and aren't trading back and forth.
PS. -
How can you think to consider evidence from scanned Japanese articles translated by fans of currently unreleased game as a verifiable source? You are only making assumptions so far, the scan pages don't actually say Terra chose anyone. You can only say Riku is the chosen "Keyblade Master" if the Birth By Sleep actually explicitly shows or says this. Conjecture and assumptions from fan-translated scans that only hint to possible plot points isn't verifiable or reliable.
Watemon (talk) 13:11, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

From Director's Secret Report:

There should be a hint about Riku being a chosen wielder hidden discreetly somewhere in the additions to the game, so certainly try and find it.

From the journal:

Riku was actually the rightful master of the Keyblade, but once he chose darkness over light, the weapon chose Sora instead.

It's pretty clear that Riku was the chosen master, but when he gave his heart over to darkness, it was too weak to accept the Keyblade, and it went to Sora instead.Not even Mr. Lister's Koromon survived intact. 01:04, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

Well, let's not forget that in The World that Never Was, Riku actually had a Keyblade: Way to the Dawn. This could mean something.

Also, about main character pages

why not keep a brief and small description of sora riku and kairi in this article, and give much more heavy detail when you make a separate one for them? there's plenty of information on sora, more than this article shows. i mean, you did it for organization XIII, so why not sora riku and kairi?Linder1990 (talk) 16:07, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

I couldn't agree with you more, my friend. Nintendoman01 talk, 9:17, 21 May 2009

Find enough reliable sources, and we'll certainly consider it. I've stumbled across a few here and there for Sora, but barely anything for Riku and Kairi. The number of sources for Sora is borderline in my opinion, especially with so little about the character's development/creation. Without that, I'd say the article would be content forking. (Guyinblack25 ^talk 15:26, 26 May 2009 (UTC))

regarding VEN!

there is no official kanji for "ventus" therefore we should not use ventus as a name. the name isnt official. so we should not use it.Haseo445 (talk) 17:46, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

EDIT: if i see any of you guys editing it to ventus, i'll reedit ti back to how it was.Haseo445 (talk) 17:46, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

I'm fairly certain Ventus has appeared in the promotional materials. Please let me find some sources before you revert it.Not even Mr. Lister's Koromon survived intact. 20:40, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

no, there's nothing saying "ventus", the obvious hint that tetsuya nomura and tai yasue gave was that his name means wind, just like terra means earth in latin, though the name was never made official AND there was no official kanji for his name. therefore we should avoid saying the name ventus.Haseo445 (talk) 15:31, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

Regarding Cloud's voice

If anyone happens to know who does the voice of Cloud in Kingdom Hearts, Kingdom Hearts: Chain of Memories, and Kingdom Hearts II, please edit this and include the name. It must be both the english voice acotr and Japanese voice actor, as well as a reference. Thank you.

                                                  -Mia  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.125.153.34 (talk) 13:32, 12 April 2009 (UTC) 

Remove Roxas's section

I propose to remove Roxas's section as he is fully described in Organization XIII's article. It is not the same case as Donald, Goofy or Maleficent, which are characters that existed before KH and that have individual articles. Organization XIII is already mentioned and linked, so I see no reason to include Roxas in this list and exclude the rest of the organization, especially Xenmas. --LoЯd ۞pεth 19:49, 19 June 2009 (UTC)

While I can see your reasoning, I'm afraid I have to disagree. Omitting Roxas from this article will leave a hole for general readers; he was a significant character in the story and was playable for the first part of KHII. Because the character is fully covered in Organization XIII, his section was purposefully left bare bones here. Also, Xemnas, is another significant character, is covered in the Xehanort and Org XIII sections of this article. Much like the Ansem villian in the first game, he's certainly not excluded. He just doesn't have his own section; Ansem and Xemnas were combined to form the Xehanort section. (Guyinblack25 ^talk 20:21, 19 June 2009 (UTC))

Re:KrytenKoro's edits

Long edit with too many different things going on to explain in the edit summary bar.

• removed reference to the fact that Kairi couldn't remember her time at Radiant Garden---not relevant to anything else, not a key aspect of her character
• Replica--->clone, references to Riku Replica stay in CoM article, I guess. The random capitalization would be confusing
• It's not totally clear what happens when Ansem's machine explodes or why so it's best to leave it vague.
• Mickey's thing reworded for great justice
• Bolster defenses? Not cited, but not terribly important anyway---removed
• Xion thing not too important to Ansem's section---removed
• Machine explode thing again, same reasoning
• Namine thing at end is cute, but not significant
• Roxas R/replica, same reason
• "Forbidden", not cited, not too important anyway---removed

So yeah. Axem Titanium (talk) 21:31, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

• Replica is the term used in 358/2 Days, and is an important story concept disparate from a simple clone. It should be used.
• I'm fairly certain that there is a quote explaining that the machine disrupted the hearts, but it's not worth reinserting without that quote. In any case, we need to explain what the machine is for - right now, it makes no sense whatsoever.
• The Namine thing at the end is similar to the scene at the castle that never was, which is also mentioned. If we don't want either scene, that's fine, I personally don't get why either of them would be significant beyond plot synopsis.
• Forbidden is the name of the weapon as given in 358/2 Days. Cite it to that if you want, but it needs to be reinserted.

Roxas's section should have a main link to the Organization XIII page's section on him, I think.Not even Mr. Lister's Koromon survived intact. 00:48, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

Ok:

• Used replica, uncapitalized
• Tried to explain the machine concisely
• Removed extra Namine scene
• We don't mention any other weapon names, not even Kingdom Key or Way to (the) Dawn. I haven't played 358/2 Days (clearly), but it's hard to imagine a scenario in which its name is that significant, especially compared to the other two weapon names I mentioned.
• I removed the thing about Johnny Depp/James Arnold Taylor since I removed all other voice actors except for the main characters'.
• Roxas' section has a link to his section at the Org XIII page. I don't think "main article" is the best way to do it, since it's not really his own article.

So yeah. Axem Titanium (talk) 13:50, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

Just chiming in- I think the string of edits that have taken place the past few days are a good balance and really helped the article. (Guyinblack25 ^talk 14:45, 1 July 2009 (UTC))

List reorganization

Sorry, User:137.187.40.49 was me. Somehow I got logged out without noticing. Anyway, I thought it would be nice to be able to actually have links in the TOC. I made slight rewords in the antagonist sections to make it clear that they are indeed villains. I left playable/super important characters in the "main" section. Conceivably, we could bump Donald and Goofy to "other" and move Xehanort up since he's pretty "main" too. Axem Titanium (talk) 15:26, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Sorry for the late response, been busy with off wiki things. Logging off has happened to me before too. I think the login times out.

Anyway, I've thought about getting the TOC expanded also, but I'm not sure what is the best way. I think the current structure works well, and would like to avoid major changes involving the main characters. We could manually create a TOC like in Characters of Final Fantasy XII. Of course, it won't update any changes to headings, which could lead to some problems down the road. Another option I've been thinking about is to significantly trim the "Other characters" section. Trim plot details to absolute bare minimum, write it in a more generalized style, remove many of the subheadings. Basically try to reduce the amount of "listy"-ness to it. Any thoughts? (Guyinblack25 ^talk 15:54, 20 July 2009 (UTC))

Well, there's only so much you can trim from "other characters" without removing them outright. I don't like the manual TOC idea because that's what we had before and it wasn't elegant. A problem I have with the current division between protagonists and antagonists is that the former has 10 sections while the latter only has 4, which seems kind of imbalanced. If it comes to that, we could call the sections "Central characters", "Other main characters", and have "Minor characters" be a subsection of the latter? Axem Titanium (talk) 15:04, 21 July 2009 (UTC)

By trim I mean finding some way to reorganize the "Other characters" content to remove the subheadings. The plot details are probably a small as we can get them, but maybe some redundancy between the sections can be trimmed with some generalizations. Getting it down to "Princesses of Heart", "Disney characters", "Final Fantasy characters", and maybe a few others would make a regular TOC possible. (Guyinblack25 ^talk 15:23, 21 July 2009 (UTC))

A semi-elegant, but kind-of-not, solution would be to replace the section headings with ";<big>Wonderland</big>", which would simulate the style of the headings without actually creating one. Axem Titanium (talk) 16:05, 21 July 2009 (UTC)

I don't know if WP:MOS allows for that though. And the article must comply with MOS to keep its FA status. (Guyinblack25 ^talk 16:20, 21 July 2009 (UTC))

I'm sure the MOS doesn't say anything about it. I wouldn't mind straight up removing the headings but then I'd worry about the paragraphs turning into massive text blobs with no clear way to break them up. I think some kind of rearrangment so we could use TOClimit would be best. Axem Titanium (talk) 18:10, 21 July 2009 (UTC)

Help:Section is the specific page I'm thinking of. It doesn't explicitly forbid doing that, but my gut tells me that it's not in the spirit of the guideline. The other thing is we'd have to use anchor tags to enable linking, which can make the wikicode messy. For example, <a name="Wonderland" id="Wonderland"></a>

Let me see if I can draft up a compact version of what I'm thinking about. Right now I'm not certain it will really fix things, but it's hard to know without something concrete to look at. (Guyinblack25 ^talk 19:06, 21 July 2009 (UTC))

just to let you know, it is definetly Riku Replica, not Riku clone nor Riku replica, it was originally created as a name, leave it that way —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.214.201.212 (talk) 08:21, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

Aerial blades

are now Ethereal blades].Not even Mr. Lister's Koromon survived intact. 21:33, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Ansem Reports

Okay, I haven't found anything in the Xehanort and Ansem entries that would need this consideration, but the Ansem Reports are not trustworthy. Even if Ansem is telling the complete truth in the Secret Ansem Report, the original Ansem Report is greatly circumspect. So basically, you guys might want to either qualify any citations to the Ansem Reports, or replace them with citations to Nomura interviews. Again, I didn't spot any suspect use of them, so this might be an irrelevant discussion, and I'm sorry if it is.07:59, 5 August 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.94.192.235 (talk)

Umm.. Just thinking...

Don't ya think the each character should have it's own article? I mean, The Kingdom Hearts Wiki has more info because it has character's own article.Alpha`s Arceus:Are You Siding with the Humans?! 18:54, 6 December 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Alpha`s Arceus (talk • contribs)

Kingdom hearts wiki allows speculation and unsourced information, there are probably sources out there but we would need to find some in order to make there own article. please look up the general notability guide.Bread Ninja (talk) 16:30, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

Most of the characters used to have their own articles but were edited into one for simpler navigation. However, perhaps Riku, Kairi and Xehanort could get their own. Evilgidgit (talk) 16:47, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

I suggest against it. Maybe new sources have come up since I last looked, but I don't recall much in the way of development and reception for Riku, Kairi, or Xehanort. Without such content, the articles cannot exist on Wikipedia. The separate articles were originally merged into this one because alone they did not meet WP:NOTE, WP:VERIFY, and WP:RELIABLE. Currently, Sora (Kingdom Hearts) does a decent enough job, but this one and Organization XIII no longer meet WP:RELIABLE because fan sites do not count as reliable sources. Without reliable sources, the articles do not comply with WP:NOTE and WP:VERIFY either. In light of that, I plan to bring the article up for WP:FAR and WP:GAR next month. Hopefully proper sources can be found. If not, then the articles will have to be demoted. (Guyinblack25 ^talk 17:58, 9 January 2010 (UTC))

I agree with User:Guyinblack25 and I even suggest to bring Sora's article back to a redirect into the section of this list. The split resulted only in a bunch of in-universe and overdetailed plot. --LoЯd ۞pεth 05:26, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

In universe or over detailed plot, doesn't mean it has to be removed. it can be rewritten in real world perspective, though, it's not really in-universe, just some sections. Also the plot seems fine.

If there is such an article that has no real references and is completely based on in-universe perspective, then yes it can be removed completely and without redirecting.

really though i don't think it's a bad idea to make a character article for some characters. for one i think Riku article can be brought back. of course it all depends on how bring it back. i suggest making special pages before making the actual article.Bread Ninja (talk) 15:58, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

After expanding Sora's reception section, the only character I noted could pass notability is Roxas, but better first make the section and then return the article.Tintor2 (talk) 22:45, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

After doing some work in a sandbox I redirected Roxas (Kingdom Hearts). I still need to do some work there. By the way, what image should the article have?Tintor2 (talk) 20:34, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

Port Royal section error

I'm sure that the descriptions for the undead pirates based off of Bo'Sun and Jacoby are the wrong way around. Have swapped them.

Also, Kingdom Hearts Wiki says that all three Pirates were voiced my John DiMaggio. Is this comfirmed somewhere else? Thejarofdirt882 (talk) 18:48, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

Xehanort page

I've noticed that Sora and Roxas have their own separate pages. Shouldn't the same be done with Xehanort? I mean, he is the series' main villain and has made much more appearances than Roxas in the series, although in many different forms, but still, he is a major character on the same scale as Sora. Shouldn't there be a separate page for Xehanort? Jienum (talk) 23:00, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

Read the the above paragraph. I was able to redirect Roxas' article as I found it passed WP:NOTE and other requirements. Besides, Xehanort only appears in Birth by Sleep while his alter-egos are the antagonists from the first games.Tintor2 (talk) 01:45, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

jacket

were can i purchase a character jacket of/for Transfomer —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.197.161.59 (talk) 22:39, 2 May 2010 (UTC)

Meaning of Kairi in Japanese

I'm interested in the Kingdom Hearts series, but I have never played it. In Japanese, there is only one word "Kairi" related to the sea, which means nautical mile. Its standard kanji compound word (jukugo) is ja:海里, and the non-standard one is 浬, which has been removed from the toyo kanji list. Has anyone talked about this before? --Shinkansen Fan (talk) 16:07, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

Tetsuya nomura has stated that the Kai in Kairi can mean Sea, as for Sora means sky and Riku means Land. Plus if we add any other meaning that would be original research>Bread Ninja (talk) 20:10, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

Yen Sid?

Um, while I'm only a UC (Unregistered Contributor) here, and can't really add much myself, but shouldn't Yen Sid have a section on here? He plays an important role (right?) in the games, yet there's little to no mention of him on here; his name is mentioned only 7 times, and he doesn't even have a description. Shouldn't something be done? I don't know if I have a right to say anything, since I can't add much, but I thought I could at least bring it to attention.--184.100.202.20 (talk) 19:41, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

I think who Yen Sid is missing here. :-( --ToonsFan (talk) 13:59, 20 May 2011 (UTC)

Wrong association

This article is associated with the french Wikipedia article [[1]], which don't exactly talks about the same subject : this article is about all Kingdom Hearts characters, but the french Wikipedia's one is only about one specific character, Ansem. Shouldn't the link to the french article be deleted ? Thomaskpi (talk) 17:34, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

Move request

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: not moved; consensus is against moving. ErikHaugen (talk | contribs) 04:49, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

---

Characters of Kingdom Hearts → Characters in Kingdom Hearts – Characters of Kingdom Hearts by itself is a sentence fragment and nonsensical title, in-line with Character profiles/lists for other games, TV series etc. —James ^{(Talk • Contribs)} • 3:03pm • 05:03, 8 May 2011 (UTC)

• Comment How is "Characters in Kingdom Hearts" any less of a sentence fragment? How is "Characters of Kingdom Hearts" nonsensical? What other character lists are you referring to? Just a side note as well, this is an article, not a list. I've seen a lot of "List of characters in X" lists but most character articles are "Characters of X". Axem Titanium (talk) 17:18, 8 May 2011 (UTC)
  • If you're not going to respond, then I'm obviously not convinced. Oppose. Axem Titanium (talk) 02:43, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
• How many article titles are full sentences? —Tamfang (talk) 16:55, 11 May 2011 (UTC)
• Looking at the category, it seems the formats used are "Characters of X" and "List of X characters". Personally I would say either "Characters in X" or "X characters" ("of" sounds wrong here, though I'm no games expert), and would therefore support the proposal, though I'd also be happy with Kingdom Hearts characters, and would do the same with the other similar articles currently named "Characters of X" (unless it turns out that this really is how the gamers phrase it).--Kotniski (talk) 09:07, 16 May 2011 (UTC)
• Oppose, the standard is "of"; you want it changed, then bring it up at WT:VG and we'll move them all at the same time. --PresN 16:05, 16 May 2011 (UTC)
• Oppose, the titles aren't meant to be full sentences. "Characters of X" is a simple way of saying the articles is about characters of kingdomm hearts. Regardless, The most of i've seen is "List of X Characters" and "List of XX in X series" when its much more specific type of characters. But Characters in X seems like a in-between form of the two and should be avoided.Bread Ninja (talk) 16:25, 16 May 2011 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Riku and Kairi

Okay, I'll note that I brought up this question a year ago, but I'll ask it again. I've noticed Riku and Kairi do not have their own articles. Granted last time I was told they were not very notable to gain their own articles. However, secondary characters like Terra, Aqua, Ven, Roxas and Xion all have their own articles, although this is likely because they are also playable characters. Thinking over, while Kairi will probably lack the guidelines to have a separate article, I believe Riku does. He is technically the second main character if Donald and Goofy are moved aside, and has been playable in most of the games (e.g. Chain of Memories, Kingdom Hearts II, 358/2 Days, the new 3D game, etc.) Just a thought, and I'll go on with the decision. Evilgidgit (talk) 19:21, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

When saying notable we don't mean about their roles in the series, but if they are able to pass WP:Notability guidelines as they possess third-party sources that talk about how the public received. From Riku and Kairi, I could only find a tidbit from the former, which is not enough to pass notability. Regards.Tintor2 (talk) 23:53, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Well, that's a good enough reason for me. Cheers. Evilgidgit (talk) 16:21, 12 June 2011 (UTC)

Villains' Council

The same should be done a section of the Maleficent's "Villains' Council". Who (excluding Maleficent and Pete) consists with: Hades, Jafar, Ursula, Oogie Boogie, and Captain Hook, and the members found by Pete: Captain Barbossa and Scar.--ToonsFan (talk) 15:34, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

Figures do more

sould it say that the Figures can be used as chess pices — Preceding unsigned comment added by Darkened wiki (talk • contribs) 19:33, 21 January 2012 (UTC)

Seems kinda trival, but I don't think anyone would object if you had a source for it. (Guyinblack25 ^talk 14:15, 23 January 2012 (UTC))