Talk:Dice

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Former good article Dice was one of the Sports and recreation good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
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Dubious[edit]

As I was copyediting this article, I found some information in it that I find dubious. (Much of the article is unsourced.) In particular, the article claims "Tacitus stated that the Germans were passionately fond of dicing", but there were no "Germans" at that time, and any such term would be an anachronism. There were Gauls, Franks, Celts, Teutons, and Goths, all living in that general region and/or providing ancestors for modern Germans, and I'm not sure what group Tacitus referred to. – Quadell (talk) 17:49, 27 September 2013 (UTC)

Also, the article claims "The word for four in Chinese, Japanese and Korean is a homophone of the word for death and is considered unlucky." Japanese, Korean, and the various languages in China are from different language families and have very different words for both "four" and "death". It isn't a homophone in all these languages. – Quadell (talk) 18:19, 27 September 2013 (UTC)

I guess we can see why it is was delisted at GAR... there's a lot of fix, but thank you for the copyedit! 129.33.19.254 (talk) 18:22, 27 September 2013 (UTC)
For anyone who's curious, The Chinese-Japanese-Korean thing is about the Chinese writing system. , the character for 'four' is pronounced the same or similarly as , the character for 'death'. Chinese languages, Japanese, and to a lesser extent Korean all use these characters, so this aversion is shared. Having said that, the connection to this topic is really "dicey", and I would have no problem cutting it from the article. Grayfell (talk) 08:07, 28 September 2013 (UTC)
Three points for "dicey". I too think it should be omitted. – Quadell (talk) 13:49, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

The use of "Germans" probably refers to the tribes of Germania as collectively identified in this way by the Romans. It seems to me one of those acceptable historical anachronisms. For example retrospectively referring to the Holy Roman Empire, what was going on in "England" when it was clearly individual Anglo-Saxon/Danish kingdoms or referring to Christopher Columbus as Italian before such a country existed. Now to the red fours. A linked article says now about India being the origin of red fours. Why?. Like thirteen in the west, four is an unlucky number in much of the far East and there have been sources to say the Red is a lucky colour used to compensate the bad luck. The origins of unlucky four may or may not be down to the homophone with death in Chinese, but it does not need to also be a homophone in other languages for the supistition to spread. Dainamo (talk) 08:45, 23 October 2013 (UTC)

I dispute that those anachronisms are acceptable for an encyclopedia. They are not NPOV because they are deliberate attempts to construct nationalistic narratives around ill-fitting historical facts. Your cited examples are more obviously non-neutral than the usage in this article that you mean to support by them so they actually undermine your case. 209.30.80.214 (talk) 03:16, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
The line about Tacitus and the "Germans" appears to be derived from the 1911 Encyclopedia Britannica [1]. I'll leave it to someone else to actually track down where they got it from, but as I recall, there's a lot of stuff attributed to Tacitus that only survives 2nd or 3rd hand, much like it ended up in this article. Germania is a valid historical concept, so calling them Germans is slightly clumsy, but I don't think this is non-neutral. Grayfell (talk) 03:40, 23 May 2014 (UTC)

Copy edit, September 2013[edit]

I have copyedited down through "Non-cubic". A copyedit is still needed from "Standard variations" down. Another day... – Quadell (talk) 13:47, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

I have copyedited the section "Standard variations". A copyedit is now needed from "Rarer variations" on down. Greatpopcorn (talk) 20:39, 8 November 2013 (UTC)
I have copyedited the rest of the article. Removing copy edit tag. Greatpopcorn (talk) 01:13, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

Are citations needed? Comment Reply[edit]

We have

The 4-sided platonic solid is difficult to roll, and a few games like Dayakattai and Daldøs use a 4-sided rolling pin instead.[citation needed]

The citations can be found in the wikilinked articles. Do we really need to repeat them here? — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talkcontribs) 12:56, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

I would think so, yes. A simple copy and paste should do the trick. 129.33.19.254 (talk) 16:05, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Games played with dice[edit]

With dice you can play Backgammon, Jumanji, Craps, .. Yatzee.., etc. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.6.175.142 (talk) 06:54, 20 August 2014 (UTC)

Do you want to suggest any changes to the article? It seems to me applications of dice is sufficiently covered in the article, with wikilinks to relevant articles.-- (talk) 19:24, 20 August 2014 (UTC)

This article is wrong. Don't read it! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.113.70.100 (talk) 19:11, 2 September 2014 (UTC)