Talk:Dyeus

Deva

Is *Dyeus related to Deva, or does the name only bear a superficial resemblance? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deva_deity

related, but not derived directly. Deva is from *deiv-o-. dab (ᛏ) 11:31, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Of course, if we're going for a consistent orthography, that should probably be *deiu-o - and that would be the root from which Tyr would be derived. *deiuos > *Tiwaz.

Ancient anthropomorphic stone stela (Ukraine), possibly depicting an early variant of a god related to Dyeus

"possibly"? "variant"? "related"? The above caption of the picture seems highly conjectural --[jon] [talk] 14:53, 27 Feb 2005 (UTC)

I know :-\ it's from a book that links it to Dyeus, but until I find the exact reference (particularly, where exactly is the stele), I was forced to be weasly. dab (ᛏ) 15:45, 27 Feb 2005 (UTC)

cut from article

A point worth mentioning here is that in Modern Persian, the word Dīv means demon. With the arrival of the Persian prophet Zoroaster, the old system of gods worshipped by the Iranians was deemed evil and replaced by a new system consisting of only two gods: Ahūrā-Mazdā, the god of light, and his counter-part, Ahrīman, the god of darkness. It can therefore be inferred, especially in the light of the above facts on Deus, Zeus, and other Indo-European forms mentioned above, that Dīv had been used to refer to one, and most likely, the supreme deitity of the pre-Zoroastrian Aryan pantheon.

there is some truth in this, but unfortunately it doesn't belong on this article. This is due to confusion of *dyeus and *deivo which were related, but not identical words. Also, why bother with modern Persian when we have the Avestan word, daeva. This point would belong on deva. *Dyeus appears to have been pretty pale at the time of Indo-Iranian unity already, and the suggested split (not entirely accurately described above) concerned two classes of gods the asuras (Aesir) and the daivas or "heavenly ones". *Dyeus doesn't really enter into this. dab (ᛏ) 08:58, 23 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Germanic version

To say that Germans turned Dyeus into a featureless, pale nonentity is overstated. The Old Norse did so by saga times, but the cult of Tiw/Tiwaz was certainly very important in other areas.

"Weather god"?

I removed the statement implying that Dyeus was a weather god. There was such a god in Proto-Indo-European times (at least according to Brian Branston's The Lost Gods of England), but he was distinct. From him came Thor, Indra and the nameless Hittite Weather God. I mean, this very article itself further down distinguishes Dyeus from Thor and Indra. I would assume, rather, that some versions of Dyeus (Zeus, for example) assimilated characteristics of this other god, not the other way round (of course, that's just my theory and to include it would be original research). elvenscout742 21:29, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

Jehova?

Is Jehova related etymologically? It souns similar, and it would fit the concept. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Uberisaac (talk • contribs) .

Nope, it is not related etymologically. Jehovah is Semitic, not Indo-European, in origin. It is derived from a Christian error in interpreting Hebrew scripture that mistook the consonants of Yahweh ("YHWH", the Tetragrammaton) annotated with the vowel sounds of Adonai, to be the name "Jehovah"—originally pronounced "Yehowah" (so you can see the similarity to "Yahweh" in its original pronunciation). This mispronunciation dates back to 500 years ago, whereas Yahweh has been around for many millennia. The etymology of Yahweh is a matter of dispute, but it is most likely from the Proto-Semitic root hwy and originally meant "he brings into existence" or "he causes to be", a suitably generic title for a creator deity, and one with much less character than Dyeus. :) -Silence 21:36, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

---

This is discussed at length in several places on Talk:Tetragrammaton. AnonMoos 16:15, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

French?

Maybe Dyeus is related to Dieu, french word for God. --Neotenic 14:53, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

No. The other way around. Dieu (french) is based on Deus (latin) which was most likely based on Dyeus.85.138.1.15 08:42, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

The article says that Latin deus is based on *deiwos not *dyeus. -- pne (talk) 14:46, 9 November 2007 (UTC)

Deva

Is it also likely that the Sanskrit word deva originates from Dyeus (and thus is a cognate of deus)? Jon Harald Søby 01:17, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

cognate, but different ablaut grade. Dyaus is the corresponding Indic form (as the articl says already). dab (ᛏ) 14:33, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Duw

I thought I should add that the Welsh word for God is Duw... it seems related, but I'm not sure where it should go if at all.

Seems likely, at least to *deiwos, cf The Dagda. 惑乱 Wakuran (talk) 14:37, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

Subscript 2? Huh?

There are a couple of words spelt with a subscripted '2' in the middle of them. How could this possibly be pronounced? Was this by any chance intended as something else, put in with some goofy Windoze character set in mind, and converted by robot to this form? ;Bear 10:54, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

See Laryngeal theory. The short answer is that we don't know how the laryngeals - if they existed - were pronounced (especially since we have no sound recordings of PIE); they stand for "something which turned into X in language family A, Y in language family B, etc.", and all h_1 are the same something and all h_2 are a different something, but what exactly the somethings sounded like is uncertain. -- pne (talk) 14:48, 9 November 2007 (UTC)

Indra

Article states Indra cannot be traced to IE. Even though I am no linguist I think it should be related to Sanskrit nar, Greek anḗr/andrós and Sabine nerō.Aldrasto11 (talk) 10:05, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

The PIE root is *h2ner; the Sanskrit form /naras/ reflects this root, without the -d-. That d is an innovation of Hellenic, like the -aik in gynh/gynaikos. The d was inserted because Hellenic realized vocalic laryngeals as vowels, thus the a- of the Greek; Indic did not have this, and if it had gained the -d- would have resulted in ndras -> adras (if it happened before nasal resonants became vowels), not andras. Moreover, there would be no reason for the a- to become i- as in Indra. -Senori (talk) 02:05, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Greek

Is there any cognity to Greek the Greek word theos? I mean they seem strikingly similar, practically only different by changing the voiced aspiration y to a voiceless h, but that's nonlinguistically said. --91.34.219.10 (talk) 17:28, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

Linguists have puzzled over the matter for more than a century, but no hypothesis linking the words is widely accepted. In the line of development leading from Indo-European to ancient Greek, the original consonants [dh] and [d] are not at all commonly interchanged or confused... AnonMoos (talk) 17:59, 6 November 2011 (UTC)

Very interesting that "theos" does not originate from this word. Do linguists know what the etymology of the word "theos" is? I'm assuming it has an Indo-European origin, but there are no articles on the word. Thanks24.189.108.166 (talk) 17:37, 24 February 2012 (UTC)

The standard conventional proposals are listed at wikt:θεός#Etymology... AnonMoos (talk) 02:53, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

"Jesus"?

Need I say more? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 119.202.90.53 (talk) 12:05, 6 November 2011 (UTC)

If you're implying that there's any connection between the two words, then you're unfortunately completely wrong according to the consensus of modern scholarship. Dyeus comes from an Indo-European root deyw-/dyew-, while Jesus comes from a shortened form of the Tetragrammaton YHWH plus a derivative from the Semitic triliteral root y-š-ʕ (where "ʕ" is a voiced pharyngeal consonant of a type which does not occur in Indo-European languages). The initial consonant of the word "Jesus" was not even pronounced with an initial affricate sound until certain early medieval Romance languages developed a "y" to "j" sound shift which affected all similar words, such as Latin IVDEX (pronounced "yoodeks") evolving in Old French into a form which became the word "Judge" when borrowed from French into English... AnonMoos (talk) 17:52, 6 November 2011 (UTC)

lol, I think the unsigned user just got owned.80.203.20.94 (talk) 21:38, 12 March 2012 (UTC)