Talk:Eric L. Haney
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Why is this page being considered for deletion?
- You should sign your entries using ~~~~
- The article was put up for deletion by its author to make a point about other user activities.
- This is a violation of the Wikipedia WP:POINT policy ("Don't disrupt Wikipedia to make a point") but we have to go through the motions on the deletion request. Georgewilliamherbert 17:07, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
The reference link is no longer valid. A replacement should be located. 220.127.116.11 16:51, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
- Good catch. I have linked to the Internet Archive version of that story. Georgewilliamherbert 21:36, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
It seems all reference to the criticism of Haney by former US Army Special Operation members including, Lt. Col. Lewis "Bucky" Burruss, Logan Fitch, CSM Mel Wick, and CSM Dick Davis, has been removed, it should be put back.
- I made mention of it in the intro section; more detail should definitely be provided on the article page for Inside Delta Force'. Alcarillo 19:46, 19 October 2007 (UTC)
Several consultants who are now working with the TV show, "Army Wives" have recently commented to me that Mr. Haney is persona non grata with many in the intel community today. They have no qualms about his past achievements or his abilities. I have been told by active operatives that their beef with Mr. Haney is that he violated an "unspoken code of conduct" with a few of his story lines on the TV show, "The Unit." In other words he went too far in revealing some aspects of current Special Operation procedures and tactics. So the old saying "loose lips sink ships" seems to still be valid in today's modern world as well. MajorChasCordite (talk) 01:51, 29 May 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by MajorChasCordite (talk • contribs)
--Comments by another professional: It is no surprise to me that the "Intelligence Community" has attempted to shun Haney. This is the M.O. for anyone who leaves the military and later becomes successful at any undertaking that involves writing about special operations. Based on several critical reviews of the information contained within this book, combined with outside sources and methods, this book stands up to scrutiny and many controversial items contained in this book are factually supported elsewhere. This includes the intelligence community.
The simple fact that Wikipedia quotes a source who published in Penthouse magazine as a credible source against Haney speaks volumes about the source. It's desperate and sad.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.104.22.168 (talk) 15:34, 1 May 2012 (UTC)
Haney on Iraq
Someone needs to provide justification as to why Haney's comments warrant inclusion in an encyclopedia article. Please see WP:NOT#NEWS; the article is about the person, not his opinions regarding current events. Alcarillo 16:04, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I understand that the source for much of the newer information regarding Haney's private sector work came from an interview with him. The unnecessary play-by-play notwithstanding, this still needs to be confirmed from another, independently-verifiable source(s). Haney is a primary source and as such, not sufficiently reliable. See WP:No original research.
Moreover, presenting unspecified information like "CEO of the largest corporation in Mexico" or "Middle Eastern countries" strains the credibility of the article. It's pretty easy to find out what the "largest corporation in Mexico" is -- why isn't that information included? And, that would still need to be verified. Alcarillo (talk) 18:19, 29 November 2007 (UTC)
Another professional comments: Why is any of the information from a Wikipedia article regarding the author in dispute when the primary source of this information is the book Inside Delta Force? If you have any information that directly disputes these claims, then produce the information (and links) here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 22.214.171.124 (talk) 15:37, 1 May 2012 (UTC)
The section on Haney's military career says that he went to Panama and was later promoted to CSM. Inside Delta Force says that he was considering leaving Delta Force when his promotion to CSM came through. Since the unit could have only one CSM, he had to leave and chose Panama for his next posting. Since this is a primary source, it's not strong enough to update the article. It probably should be considered though. Dsalex (talk) 07:36, 1 February 2008 (UTC)
- Is there a confirmation process involved when someone is promoted to CSM? I wonder whether Haney was informed of his promotion, but left 1SFOD-D pending a formal confirmation/investiture. Alcarillo (talk) 16:14, 19 February 2008 (UTC)
CSM is the same rank as Sergeant Major. You never are "promoted" to CSM you are promoted to Sergeant Major, there may in-fact be more than one Sergeant Major in a battalion, but only one CSM(you'll see this a lot in SF battalions where there may be a two or three guys promoted to Sergeants Major, but they have not been given a CSM slot yet so are stuck until someone cuts them orders. If you are a Sergeant Major and are assigned as the top enlisted man for a Battalion or larger element, you would be called a CSM. If you went to another unit that already had a CSM, though unlikely, you would be just a Sergeant Major. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 126.96.36.199 (talk) 02:09, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
Command Sergeant Major is a billet, that can be filled by someone holding the rank of Sergeant Major. Or, like an E-7 pulling a first Sgts job, any NCO can be pulled to temporarily fill the position. Sergeant Major however is a rank. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.8.131.52 (talk) 02:16, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
CSM for 5th Bn, 87th INF. I was there and on occasion would talk with him in his office. I had no relationship with Delta or any other special force but did know Haney in this batalion. I also remember learning some of my most enduring lessons from this fine Soldier. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.108.40.206 (talk) 12:52, 12 October 2008 (UTC)
Command Sergeant Major is NOT the same rank as Sergeant Major. It is the same paygrade, but not the same rank and does not have the same responsibilities. The insignia on the uniform is different as well. A CSM has been found capable of commanding a force of men. Such as a battalion. A Sergeant Major's sphere of influence is limited to those men directly under him. Read this:
"Enlisted soldiers who attain the distinction of being selected by the Department of the Army for participation in the command sergeants major program are the epitome of success in their chosen field, in this profession of arms. There is no higher grade of rank, except Sergeant Major of the Army, for enlisted soldiers and there is no greater honor...vs. this
"The sergeant major is generally the key enlisted member of staff elements at levels higher than battalion. The sergeant major’s experience and ability are equal to that of the command sergeant major, but the sphere of influence regarding leadership is generally limited to those directly under his charge." www.globalsecurity.org/military/intro/enlist
It takes a great deal of study, over time, and one must pass difficult tests to get through the Sergeants Major Academy. But only a handful of those who do are accorded the extra honor of being named a Command Sergeant Major. Haney was the CSM in Panama during Just Cause. Darlagirl (talk) 02:17, 24 April 2010 (UTC)
Another Quiet Professional states: This entire discussion, in and of itself, calls into question all naysayers to Mr. Haney's autobiographical information. If the simple fact that CSM requires additional handling by the Army is in any dispute in this discussion, then any "facts" presented against Haney elsewhere are not reliable. Darlagirl is spot-on (obviously having Army background) while there are a few others talking out of...I don't know where. (well I do, but won't say it here)— Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.127.116.11 (talk) 15:41, 1 May 2012 (UTC)
Does anyone know if this guy served in Vietnam? He is right in that age group, and he had joined the infantry by that time. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.104.22.168 (talk) 14:21, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
- Nothing in his book says he served in Vietnam; only that he enlisted in the spring of 1970, and entered the Army after graduation that June. Later Haney served in the 1st Ranger Battalion (not exactly sure when) which was formally reactivated in 1974. I don't know whether he served in any of the Ranger companies that were sent to Vietnam up until 1972. Alcarillo (talk) 16:25, 19 February 2008 (UTC)
I read his book too, and I just felt that was a glaring omission if he did go to Nam and didn't mention it. It must have put him in a wierd position to be a combat train soldier, surounded by other soldier who had been there, and he didn't go himself.--22.214.171.124 (talk) 14:19, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
- My read of it was that he didn't go to Vietnam, but continued with his advanced training while the US military presence was undergoing a drawdown in SE Asia. Not every enlistee in the early 70s -- or even during the height of the war -- when to Vietnam. Alcarillo (talk) 16:47, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
Haney did serve in Vietnam. Joined the Army right out of high school to do so. Book jacket refers to "combat infantryman"; p. 13. says 'never had a non-tactical assignment' and had been in the army 8 years by the time Delta came calling. Darlagirl (talk) 02:06, 24 April 2010 (UTC)
Haney does not mention Vietnam because it had little to nothing to do with his Delta experience. Reading the book from front to back, the reader gets an instant sense that this book focuses only on the Delta experience and nothing else. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 126.96.36.199 (talk) 15:43, 1 May 2012 (UTC)
Neither the term "non tactical unit" nor "combat infantryman" mean he saw combat before Delta. They just mean he was trained to serve as an infantryman in combat units. As the original author of this query years ago I consider this matter closed. Haney didn't go to Nam... unless he latter states he did so.188.8.131.52 (talk) 00:05, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
Haney was CSM of a light infantry battalion (5th, 87th INF) stationed in Panama at that time. I was a member of that battalion when he was there. I left just before the invasion. But we had been doing many things in preparation up to that point. CSM Haney was still there when I left. If he doesn't address it, I am sure he has his reasons. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.108.40.206 (talk) 12:46, 12 October 2008 (UTC)
Haney is no longer attached to the Unit television show. He retains his "based on" writer credit, and has been given a technical advisor title in place of the producer credit. He is in fact no longer with the show, and two consultants have been brought in to take his place. Unfortunately I can't find any mention of this in a basic Google search, but the credits part can be verified by watching the show.--HappyMaam (talk) 12:17, 19 October 2008 (UTC)
Haney was not a member of US Army Special Forces
I removed the "Members of the US Army Special Forces Category" link at the bottom of the page.
Haney was a member of SFOD-D, which is an abbreviation for "Special Forces Operational Detachment-Delta," but Delta is not a part of the US Army Special Forces Command, belonging, rather, to JSOC. Strictly speaking, Delta is a special operations unit, not a US Army Special Forces unit. There is a difference.
Further, Haney is not a graduate of the Special Forces "Q Course," and was never awarded the Green Beret. Serving in a Ranger unit does not qualify him for inclusion in the "Special Forces" category, as Rangers also do not belong to the Special Forces Command.
Haney could be included in other categories, like US Army soldiers, but linking his page to the category for US Army Special Forces soldiers is an error.
A distinction needs to be made between using the term "Special Forces" as a generic catch-all for special operations units, and using the term as it should be used, as a reference to the US Army Special Forces, which has its own command under US Army SOCOM, and its own 18-series career Military Occupational Specialties (MOS).
While some members of Delta are former members of Special Forces units, and retain 18-series MOS's while they serve within the unit, others come from Ranger units and retain 11-series MOS's. Haney was one of the latter.