Talk:Fantastique

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Untitled[edit]

Certain Anglophone writers are now using the term "fantastique" to describe their work. The most prominent of them is Clive Barker. He wrote an essay somewhere that eloquently expresses the essence of fantastique; could some Barker fan dig it up?

In fact, there would be an interesting postscript on the influence of French fantastique upon foreign literature. Oscar Wilde's The Picture of Dorian Gray is an obvious case, and Huysman is alluded to in the text. I think a case can be made for Fantastique influence on Borgès, as well-- though as he'd read EVERYTHING, one could make a case for any influence on him. Rhinoracer 10:04, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

???????? What happened to the discussion on this page? Has it been archived? If so, where? Has someone arbitrarily wiped it? Rhinoracer 10:45, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

I am a Sorbonne-trained scholar and an expert on the genre with several authoritative books on the subject; I also wrote the page, so my credentials on this topic are as good or better than yours. Your considerations about the Church's rationale and actions vis à vis the various tales and legends that evolved into fantasy during the Middle Ages are interesting but ultimately are theories. (As evidenced by your use of "likely" and other modifiers.) Other experts (including myself) disagree with your opinion. My views of the Church's role is far more negative than yours. I was admittedly wrong to have included my own bias when I wrote the entry originally, but you are equally wrong to continue to want to include yours. One could develop a new paragraph with both a pro- and anti-Church content, but ultimately, because I feel this is only a marginal issue, I would rather remove it entirely. JMLofficier 16:25, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

I would prefer an entire removal to biased misinformation. My writing was unbiased and was written from, I believe, a neutral perspective. JMLofficier's comment that his 'views of the Church's role is [sic] far more negative than' mine is a courageous indication of his own bias, one which I in my writing have tried to avoid: a statement of fact from textual and sociological evidence rather than 'pro-' or 'anti-Church content'. The subject of the article is the Fantastique, not the Church, and as such the development of the Fantastique should be kept in mind. My point is that it is important to consider the beginnings of this 'genre' and to discuss its development through a period when belief and custom was in a more or less rapid period of change in Europe, and that the effects of these beliefs and customs, and indeed what these are, should be taken into consideration; this should be done by a thorough, neutral consideration of the original sources and not through a variously biased early twenty-first century anti-Church perspective.PETF 23:30, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Doesn't follow?[edit]

"Some theorists of literature, such as Tzvetan Todorov, contend that the fantastique is defined by its hesitation between accepting the supernatural as such and trying to rationally explain the phenomena it describes. In that case, the fantastique is nothing more than a transitional area on a spectrum from magic realism to fantasy and does not qualify as a separate literary genre." Doesn't "trying to rationally explain the [fantastique]" make realism, rather than fantasy, the other end of the spectrum? Both realism and fantasy present 'consistent' worlds, but 'rational explanation' seems to me to evoke associations with realism in the first place. Whichiswhich 15:42, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Fantastique vs fantastic[edit]

Is this a different genre from the Fantastic? From reading the article I get the strong impression that it is, but the "Definition" sections cites work by Todorov which is definitely referring to the Fantastic. If the two are the same the articles need merging. If not, some major cleanup and explanation needs to be done. I'm happy to help, but I'm totally lost trying to untangle what belongs in which article. Please help me if you can shed any light on this! —Noiratsi (talk) 11:09, 10 March 2014 (UTC)