Talk:Films that have been considered the greatest ever/Archive 2

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Making this article serious

Following the comments from the VfD debate above, I have been through the article and removed uncited entries. I now I have probably removed too many films, and we should be able to find cites for some of them, but I believe this is the only way to make a credible entry.

From the main list:

  • It's A Wonderful Life: The film by Frank Capra which initially was a box office disappointment but has grown to become known as a powerful film about the worth of a compassionate individual willing to sacrifice his dreams for others.

From the genre list:

This is not true. Walt Disney's films (meaning the ones he himself worked on) are general-audience films intended for all ages. Yellow Submarine is not any more intrended for an adult audience than Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs was; remember 30 years, a world war, and a number of cultural revolutions seperate the films and the periods in which they were made. And, as far as "greatest i nthe genre go," neither Yellow Submarine... (continued) --b. Touch 19:30, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)
    • Fritz The Cat: One of the first animations intended exclusively for an adult audience.

...nor Fritz the Cat should be on the list. If limited to three entries, those enteries would be Fantasia, Pinocchio, and Beauty and the Beast. As is the case with Titanic, The Lion King's large box-office revenue cannot be used as the sole barometer of its greatness.

  • Romantic comedy
    • Annie Hall: Oscar-winner for Best Picture cemented reputation of director Woody Allen. Voted best American comedy by the AFI.

The AFI did NOT vote Annie Hall the best American comedy from what I can determine, so I removed it. --Samuel Wantman 19:59, 26 Jun 2004 (UTC)


  • Science fiction
    • A Trip to the Moon: The first science fiction film by the film pioneer, Georges Méliès.
    • Blade Runner: widely acclaimed science fiction film directed by Ridley Scott based on a Philip K. Dick story, which set the tone for the science fiction noir/cyberpunk genre
    • Forbidden Planet: first real instance of science fiction being taken seriously as a genre in Hollywood, with a large budget for its time; script was loosely based on Shakespeare's The Tempest and an inspiration for Star Trek.
    • Alien: The most honoured American science fiction film with a horror focus which has a creditible extraterrestrial and the beginning of the first American major female feature action film hero, Ellen Ripley.
  • Western
    • Stagecoach: established prominence of director John Ford.
    • The Searchers: Nearly twenty years after Stagecoach, John Ford directed what is often considered the greatest Western of all, and one of the greatest films ever.
    • High Noon: The Western as allegory of a sheriff faces a returning enemy even while his community deserts him as within latter day Mccarthyism.
    • Shane: The story of a lone gunfighter coming to an embattled community.
    • The Wild Bunch: The film about a passing of an era as a group of gunfighters end their careers and lives in a bloody climax.
    • Little Big Man: The landmark film that fully established the reversal of the image the Native American nations as savages into the new traditional sympathetic characters in this genre.
Films that are considered greatest from a particular country:
Movies that are widely considered important, if not the greatest ever
I agree with your removals unless citations can be found a movie should not be placed on this list. There are two films that have good citatations and that you removed, however. LOTR is tied for the most Oscars and The Third Man which was named the best British film of all time by the BFI. - SimonP 14:27, 3 Jun 2004 (UTC)
You are quite right of course. I did it too fast. I will put those back. Pcb21| Pete 15:37, 3 Jun 2004 (UTC)
OK, done. I also put back Citizen Kane into the United States section - figuring it was ok to list twice because we will probably be able to rebuild the country specific list. What do you reckon? Pcb21| Pete 15:43, 3 Jun 2004 (UTC)
Sounds good. - SimonP 19:28, 3 Jun 2004 (UTC)
Many of these films are actually good. Most of those on the list are not, they are merely popular. Explain. Localperson118 11:22, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Saving Private Ryan considered the best and most accurate portrayal of World War II combat ever by revered historian Stephen Ambrose, on which he also acted as military advisor.

Hey, if Ambrose served as advisor, he might be slightly biased, what? Burschik 12:34, 17 Aug 2004 (UTC)

I agree and will remove it. It'sa ridiculous to use the opinion of someone involved in making the film to support such a judgment.Lisiate 02:07, 29 Nov 2004 (UTC)



What about Faster Pussycat! Kill! Kill! - described by John Waters as "beyond a doubt, the best movie ever made. It is possibly better than any film that will be made in the future."? The Recycling Troll 00:34, 23 Sep 2004 (UTC)

It needs to be something more substantial than one person's opinion (with the exception of extremely notable film critics like Roger Ebert). [[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 00:47, 23 Sep 2004 (UTC)
If we could gather a few more of these sorts of quotes together though, with attributions, then it might work as another section. "Individual favourites of film world luminaries"/"Wacky selections"... something like that. Interviews with Tarantino for example should be a goldmine for choice quotes about films both "good" and "so bad they're good". Pcb21| Pete 11:20, 23 Sep 2004 (UTC)

I'm giving Fahrenheit 9/11 a seperate bullet from Bowling for Colombine due to it's historic critical and commercial success.

Bias towards modern films?

Looking over the list, I notice that there are very few films made before about 1965. Of particular alarm are the deletions of the early Walt Disney animated features from the list. Is there a particular reason why Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs, Pinocchio, and Fantasia are no longer on this list? Is it okay to add them back? Those three films are the ones Beauty and the Beast and The Lion King stand in the shadows of, and, while a casual viewer might (of course) prefer the newer films, the older films are still upheld by critics for their storytelling, audience appeal, and artistic quality. --b. Touch 19:22, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)

If you can come up with a significant critic to cite (which shouldn't be difficult, I imagine), sure. Basically, anything that can be backed up by a reliable (and relevant) source can be included. -[[User:Aranel|Aranel ("Sarah")]] 21:59, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Very nice

This is a really nice list. Good job to all those who worked on it!