Talk:Great Lakes Megalopolis

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Largest Megalopolis "in the United States"?[edit]

Considering the inclusion of Toronto and other Golden Horseshoe Canadian lands, I defer to more geographically-minded individuals than I to assess whether this is an accurate statement.Eunomiac (talk) 10:04, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

Scratch that, the headlined claim is strictly wrong: Edited accordingly. Eunomiac (talk) 10:09, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

The article still needs...[edit]

... a section on: Transportation Economy Inter-regional relations The importance of the Great Lakes on the region

And will be very favorable to also include a star-class gallery.

I will also like to point out that I am currently working on a more advanced table ThisguyYEAH (talk) 01:42, 25 July 2011 (UTC)

Here is a reference for the Economy section from U.S Army Corps of Engineers (January 2009).Great Lakes Navigation System: Economic Strength to the Nation. The population table in the present article is fine and it should stick with CSA/CMA statistics. Some were objecting to adding flags. Also per capita statistics are distorted comparisons and should not be included, for example, they are not reflective of lower cost of living advantages in areas with lower GDP. We can update 2010 populations when they are released, but no need to keep changing the population table format. GDP data may as well be simplified as entire state or province instead since the major areas account for most of it. Thomas Paine1776 (talk) 18:05, 25 July 2011 (UTC)

I was working on this table long before you even began yours. Yes, I did stop for a while to catch up with my schoolwork but I have been working on it since February 26, 2011. I can easily eliminate GDP per Capita, no problem although in my opinion they provide better insight on the quality of life; but I am only 15 years old so alright, whatever you say buddy, you probably know best. I am using statistics, it is in fact your table and the previous in which the numbers make no sense. I am getting my information straight of the Wikipedia Article which in turn gets its information from the official Census Bureau site. As for Canadian cities, I am currently getting my numbers from the official site too. I have not yet began GPD since I just added it last night.ThisguyYEAH (talk) 18:39, 25 July 2011 (UTC)
Its a megalopolis, not necessary to itemize numbers for every smaller area. Simply group them with the larger CMA/CSA. Numerical growth in the present article is preferable to percent growth, since these are only estimates if that helps. If we have missed a Canadian area let's see where it can be added. We may be able to add GDPs to come up with a regional GDP for an area or simply list the GDP for the state or province separately, since the CMA/CSA accounts for most of it anyway. Started the economy section. A suggestion would be to take the table we have in the article and add enhancements so we can assist, rather than attempting to re-do it all. Thanks.Thomas Paine1776 (talk) 18:42, 25 July 2011 (UTC)

"Windsor" and "Ste-Catherines--Niagara"[edit]

"Windsor" and "Ste-Catherines--Niagara" seem wrong. Considering how other areas are dealt with, this should be "Detroit-Windsor" and "Buffalo-St.Catherines" respectively. -- 70.49.127.65 (talk) 23:57, 30 June 2012 (UTC)

I think the current divisions into "Windsor" and "Detriot," and "Ste-Catherines--Niagara" and "Buffalo" are more proper than the proposed unions. I think it's reasonable to claim that national boundaries cause contiguous constituent cities, such as Detroit and Windsor, to function as independent subunits of the trans-national megalopolis. 96.47.114.150 (talk) 06:14, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

Montreal?[edit]

Can someone explain why montreal is listed within the "Great Lakes" megalopolis? It has never been considered part of the Great Lakes region and even in the "Emerging Megaregions" Map it is arguably located geographically closer to the north-east mega region: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/51/MapofEmergingUSMegaregions.png Can we get some clarity on this issue? Wikispeaks (talk) 07:31, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

One would gather it's a matter of it being tied closely with Toronto, also with the rest because of the Saint Lawrence Seaway pattern of settlement in Canada and the Great Lakes (see eg. New France). But the article is sourced so you should review those sources. Alanscottwalker (talk) 20:40, 19 March 2013 (UTC)
Toronto ? I don't think it has anything to do with Toronto. Montreal is its own city and does not rely on Toronto for anything. Toronto is but a small part of the Great Lakes Megalopolis. It's important to remember that the supplied map by America 2050 project is only one theory of what constitutes the Great Lakes Megalopolis. UrbanNerd (talk) 22:01, 19 March 2013 (UTC)
I didn't say it relied on it for anything (whatever that means). All these cities are their own city. The urban development along the St Lawrence is what would make it a connected city. Also, for the OP, note many of the cities are not on the Great Lakes. Alanscottwalker (talk) 00:24, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

I can't find any source in the article that firmly places Montral in the Great Lakers Megapolis? I would agree Montreal is very much apart of the quebec city-windsor corridor considered it's own megalopolis however i don't see any evidence it is also part of the great lakers megalopolis. Otherwise you could argue any city in the qubec-city windsor coridor would likewise be part of the great lakes. I don't think hunches or assumptions as to how montreal is connected to the region would be enough to verify it's place in the article. Third party sources would be needed. Wikispeaks (talk) 10:11, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

The Great Lakes - St. Lawrence is the original reason for including the cities from Windsor to Montreal in the Great Lakes Megalopolis [1]. But what is the basis for your claim that Montreal to Windsor is a "separate" megalopolis? If that is truly a different scholarly conception, then an article or subsection of this article could be created. In fact, there is already one on Quebec City–Windsor Corridor Alanscottwalker (talk) 10:53, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

In my experience as a citizen of the Great Lakes megalopolis, it functions more like a series of overlapping and interconnecting megastructures, which I'll call hubs. The Montreal-Windsor corridor might be one of those megastructures (the Canadian hub). The Windsor-Detroit-Indianapolis-Pittsburgh region is the Ohio hub, the Detroit-Indianapolis-Milwaukee-QuadCities region is the Chicago hub, and the Minneapolis-QuadCities-St.Louis-Milwaukee region is the Plains and UpperMidwest hub. Inclusion of Montreal represents the thought of those who include the entire Canadian belt as a constituent and distinct hub within the larger Great Lakes megalopolis. Apart from this, cities like Windsor might still be included as peripheral cities of the Ohio hub. Of course, I know nothing about Canada; I'm just trying to give a vocabulary which expresses the notion that if the Montreal and Toronto portions of the Canadian belt are distinct entities of their own, then inclusion of a Canadian hub of the Great Lakes megalopolis should not extend said hub past the Toronto portion of the belt. Perhaps one could postulate that Toronto is both a hub of the Great Lakes megalopolis and part of a larger, independent Canadian megalopolis, the way Houston is part of both the Gulf Coast and the Texas Triangle simultaneously. In any case, the real question is, "how connected are Toronto and Montreal?" -- 96.47.114.150 (talk) 06:38, 28 May 2013 (UTC) Anonymous

Greater Toronto Area and Chicagoland population/increase is incorrect[edit]

How, HOW, is Chicagos CSA population projected to grow 1.1 million if it's annual growth rate is around 0.60%?! Toronto's growth rate is 9-10% yet it is only slightly listed higher at 1.6 million...This makes no sense
The CSA is 9.7 million now, 0.6% growth rate a year is around 55-60k. This means that in 2025 the population will be around 10.3 million. That is about a half a million gain, not the astronomical 1.1 million that this page is stating. The total percent increase is around 6-7%.
Now, onto Toronto. I found this chart from Stats Canada with the population and growth rates for Toronto. The 2025 GTA population is expected to reach 8.4 million. That's 2.7 million more that right now, more than a million higher than this chart states. The projected increase is around 50%, and was released from Stats Canada that the Greater Toronto Area's population is increasing at around 225000+ a year.

As you can see, this chart seems to be doubling Chicago's metropolitan area's increase and halving Toronto's. I'm not even going to get into Detroit's 16% increase as it is losing 0.2% a year. Technically, this table is saying that Chicagoland, a city that has been in a constant decline for 60 years, is supposed to gain more people within the next 12 years than the NYC Metro and LA Metro. This page at the moment is a joke.


Come the next week if nobody can oppose my point, I am going to change this table. TheCanadianGuy123 (talk) 14:45, 10 May 2013 (UTC)

I would just suggest you go slow in updating the table and make sure you are comparing like things across all entries. And that your sources are widely relied on and fairly represented (per WP:NPOV). Your comment, however, seems a little agenda driven, as its doubtful that whoever made the table had ill-intent. But as the table is past dated, there is little reason not to update it appropriately. Alanscottwalker (talk) 18:35, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Updated the page tables to the proper population estimates.. If anybody is wondering why the references were not put, it is because the pages for some reason are blocked. The references are on the history page and below this text. The CMA page is a PDF.

CSA: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Combined_Statistical_Areas

CMA: Search "Greater Golden Horseshoe 2001-2041 Population Forecast"
DO NOT CHANGE THE TABLES ON THIS PAGE UNLESS YOU HAVE CLEAR-CUT PROOF

TheCanadianGuy123 (talk) 20:15, 16 May 2013 (UTC)

Why are the U.S. numbers not coming from the U.S. census web site?[edit]

Currently they are coming from http://www.fairus.org, which can't exactly be described as unbiased. Shouldn't the numbers only be coming from the official U.S. census web site? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Banderson1962 (talkcontribs) 01:26, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

Cleveland's Metropolitan Population[edit]

Hey just wondering why Cleveland's Metro Pop. is listed as 2,891,988..? That's a blatantly incorrect figure.

Thanks, 173.246.6.235 (talk) 01:50, 13 April 2014 (UTC)

Cleveland's Metropolitan Population[edit]

Hey just wondering why Cleveland's Metro Pop. is listed as 2,891,988..? That's a blatantly incorrect figure.

Thanks, 173.246.6.235 (talk) 01:50, 13 April 2014 (UTC)

Cleveland's Metropolitan Population[edit]

Hey just wondering why Cleveland's Metro Pop. is listed as 2,891,988..? That's a blatantly incorrect figure.

Thanks, 173.246.6.235 (talk) 01:50, 13 April 2014 (UTC)

Addressing inclusion/exclusion more explicitly in article[edit]

I removed a sentence from the lead that seemed confusingly worded (and which also referenced Houston for reasons I don't quite understand). I replaced it with a broader claim about the relationship between the Rust Belt and the megalopolis. Clearly there is extensive overlap, but there are some metros that are generally considered part of one but not the other. My aim was to introduce the reader to the idea that there is an important connection between these two concepts/regions and then maybe we can address some of the ongoing debate and definitional nuances in the body (with respect both to the Rust Belt connection and also the basic definition of the megalopolis itself). For example, several entries in the table are flagged as dubious, but maybe we can say more in the article about the extent of this debate. Any ideas on the best way to work this in? As part of the history section, or as a separate section about "disputed metros"? Maybe I'll attempt something, but I'd love to get some ideas about how we can improve the narrative aspects of this article. Wantonlife (talk) 02:59, 21 July 2014 (UTC)