Talk:Greco-Roman wrestling

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Olympic Status Relevant?[edit]

The NY Times article was misinterpreted and wrestling was not eliminated from the Olympics. The Olympics have a core of 25 sports which is constantly in flux in order to stay relevant. When the NYT article was written the IOC decided to shortlist wrestling, not remove it entirely. At the IOC's meeting in Sept. wrestling was added as an additional sport along with two others. My question, is the Olympic status relevant? I updated the article with ref to the IOC's own news briefs but I'm not sure it should even be mentioned. --24.250.30.244 (talk) 00:36, 29 December 2013 (UTC)

Legend Greco-Roman: French- or Celtic wrestling?[edit]

I deleted the legend. I cut the lines about the old idea that the style was created in France and by French athletes. Unfortunately, if we ignore the campanilism, there is no evidence to demonstrate this. The oldest french writings and rules about wrestling were created by foreigners, above all by European immigrants during the 16th-17th century. Also we know that during the first Olympic games even the sportman Pierre Fredi DeCoubertin called it Greco-Roman wrestling (and not French wrestling). The story of the "French origin" started to circulate during the period of the Belle Epoque, when the "made in Paris" conquered the aristocrats of Europe. But "la lutte moderne" was not created by them. France had strong "lutteurs" only in Bretagne, specialized in the celtic back-hold wrestling style (Gouren), who often went to Paris to show their own skill. Because of this fact, many French thought that Greco-Romaine wrestling was created by them.

I am not doubting the above. Please, do you have any printed references, for the above? (The closest I have come to verifying the above is that Encyclopædia Britannica(1981), claims that "Exbroyat of Lyon is generally credited ... Greco-Roman" (This must mean, that the latter is not universally accepted, thereby giving more "room" for "your" version, one thinks.)
Regards, No fiction pls (talk) 07:47, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

Where is the proof that GR is not French? And if that is true, were did GR come from? Ancient Greek wrestling allowed holds below the waist, and more closely resembled modern Turkish wrestling.Dan20001 (talk) 16:55, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

For god shake, greco-roman wrestling is not french. When French enriched GR with rules, the sport did not lose its origin. First of all, the word roman in greek, does not refer to the Roman era. "Ρώμη" (pronounced as "romee" in greek) means physical strength and it is the second part of the word "Ελληνορωμαική" (greco-roman) which actually means greek phsyical strenght. This type of movements (that later were develloped into a sport) were taught to greek children as a mean of protection after the loss of ones sword in the battle. Secondly,we must underline that these techniques presented the readiness (for war) and the strenght of each man, so the were combined to a unifide form, the GR wrestling, which was considered a Olympic sport. Finally, the modern Turkish wrestling, combines movements where wrestlers can grap each-other's clothes (which is prohibited in GR). To sum up, Grecoroman wrestling is neither french nor Celtic; its origin is greek. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.202.38.188 (talk) 14:24, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

There are the Greek wrestling and the Wrestling articles that cover the history/mythology of the style of wrestling performed by the Ancient Greeks ... this article seems to be specifically about the modern day sport of Greco-Roman Wrestling. I find this source notable and relable: http://www.fila-wrestling.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=18&Itemid=36
It makes it clear that modern Amateur Wrestling has it's origins in France (the former Roman colony of Gaul) and it was given the name Greco-Roman to sex it up a bit. Please provide compelling rebuttal. Hutcher (talk) 04:56, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

This is silly. Every serious work on the subjects states that Greco-Roman is of French origin and the name was used to increase its popularity. Even FILA takes this viewpoint and has an article up about it on their website. It is coming across as if a Nationalistic Greek is trying to rewrite history the way this article is being locked to say GR is of Greek origin. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.146.192.214 (talk) 14:03, 20 March 2011 (UTC)

Is it possible for someone to change the Parenthood section to "various continental european folk wrestling"? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.53.0.152 (talk) 21:01, 11 November 2012 (UTC)

College sport?[edit]

Is this a college sport? If not, how do guys get started in it?

Greco isn't the style that the NCAA uses - that's Collegiate wrestling, and because colleges use collegiate, high schools use a similar style with a few tweaks. The Olympics use freestyle and Greco, though, so the national governing body (USA Wrestling) promotes off-season tournaments in those styles (usually freestyle Saturday and Greco Sunday). Guys start wrestling Greco to improve their balance and upper-body skills, and the ones who are good keep at it. They're not always the same ones who are good at the other two styles. Mytildebang 18:53, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

Pankration[edit]

The text reads: "This form of wrestling was believed to have adapted from the Ancient Greek style of wrestling and to have been practiced mostly by Roman soldiers throughout the empire. In fact, it is derived from a 19th Century French form of show-wrestling popular for its high throws. Real ancient wrestling was quite different; see pankration." In fact,Pankration and wrestling were separate sports in ancient olympic games. This part of the text isn't exactly pertinent I think. XVA 10:22, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

I disagree - it's a common misconception that Greco is the more "pure" style, somehow, because it is closest to the "true" Greek style. I think it's an interesting and relevant fact. Mytildebang 17:02, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
What I'm questioning is the Pankration reference. It is totally irrelevant to the topic since it was a separate sport in the ancient games that actually included blows (punching and kicking).XVA 05:31, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
Greek wrestling or Pale would be the correct reference, and it was indeed very different than modern Greco - see the article. It allowed submissions, did not forbid leg holds, etc. Greco has almost nothing to do with Pale. I'm changing it to reflect this and removing the tag as I believe this to be very clear, please continue the discussion if you believe this to somehow be a mistake. FlowWTG 01:27, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Notes[edit]

Seems the notes are get cumbersome on the page. A drop-down list would be a solution. Is that an option?--THE FOUNDERS INTENT TALK 23:52, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Judo and olympic wrestling[edit]

It says in the article that Greco-Roman and Freestyle are the two styles of wrestling practiced at the Olympics. That's incorrect, there is also Judo, which is also an Olympic Sport. I'm making the necessary changes. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.7.54.224 (talk) 01:19, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

But Judo is not regulated by FILA, the international governing body for amateur wrestling. Judo is in the Olympics, and there is grappling involved, but since it's not regulated by FILA, it would be more precise to identify it as grappling, not wrestling, per se. Wikiman86 (talk) 17:40, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

If someone claims in the article , that "Greco-Roman" is one of 3 styles of "olympic grappling-events", then I am fine with that, for now.
(In addition to the mention of olympic wrestling events.)
  • This way, one avoids the issue of "is judo a part of international -, or folk style wrestling, or other category"
Cheers, No fiction pls (talk) 21:12, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

List of national champions(greco-roman), by nation[edit]

Alphabetical list of nations with "National championship"s. HI IM PETER

(National champions are listed within each section) :

This incomplete list I have placed here, so that a wikipedian can, in the future, make a seperate "article-stub" (or a related one).

  • Before a stub (as mentioned above) is created, I hope there will be a new(?) "stub-category" (Greco-Roman wrestling, and possibly seperate categories for some other styles)! I hope to follow up on that, soon.

(If fine wikipedians can not straighten out, any problem as indicated above, then maybe nobody can?)

(Work is in progress!)

Cheers, No fiction pls (talk) 20:58, 4 January 2009 (UTC)