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Could you provide a source for that? Unfounded, unsourced conjecture does not belong in the article. --Transfinite 18:07, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
- At this point, the entire article is unsourced. Miracleimpulse 14:30, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
- Fair enough. However, extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof, and your theory about a massive conspiracy between Hallmark Cards and American Greetings is a rather extraordinary claim. --Transfinite 18:55, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
- The proof is in the cards: millions upon millions of Sweetest Day cards with nearly identical highly deceptive statements printed right on the back of every card. American Greetings was founded in 1906, Hallmark in 1910. Both were there for the first Sweetest Days which started in 1921. What's going on is obviously co-ordinated intentional deception in order to sell products. Miracleimpulse 22:34, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
- A clarification: The merge discussion above was originally posted on Talk:Hallmark. Miracleimpulse moved it over here. --Transfinite 22:33, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
Hallmark and American Greetings have already used Wikipedia for purposes of mass deception on the Sweetest Day page, is it such a stretch that they might be deceiving everyone further by posing as two companies? Miracleimpulse 04:10, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
- I'm still waiting for any proof, whatsoever, of this conspiracy theory of yours. --Transfinite 05:13, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
- Let's start with: Over the past several years, Hallmark and American Greetings have issued hundreds of millions of Sweetest Day cards with nearly identical Sweetest Day verisimilitudes printed right on the reverse side of each card. Their websites also sock puppet the same verisimilitudes about Sweetest Day. Miracleimpulse 12:00, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
- Not proof of anything. Only that they are working in a co-operative manner to fashion the holidays America celebrates, and making big money in the process. Did you know that the former president of Hallmark Brands USA is now president of American Greetings' Carlton Cards? Miracleimpulse 13:21, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
- ...so the guy took another job. Again, for these to be merged there would need to be demonstrable proof that the two companies had effectively the same company due to a corporate merger, etc. Unless you have some reliable source evidence of that there is nothing more to discuss and this tag is an exercise in WP:POINT.--Isotope23 14:39, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
- The point being that Wikipedia is being used by industry for purposes of mass deception. It has already happened on the Sweetest day page, and it is happening here too. Did you know that the founding president of The Hallmark Channel is now director of The Hatchery, American Greetings' version of The Hallmark Channel? I guess she got a new job too. Or did she? Miracleimpulse 14:57, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
- ...and this supports your merge reasoning "This article should be merged into Hallmark Cards because American Greetings appears to be a Public Subsidiary of Hallmark Cards..." how? You have yet to produce any evidence at all.--Isotope23 15:00, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
- The evidence is everywhere Isotope. Co-creation of fake holidays. Interchangeable presidents. Is your paycheck blocking your ability to see these things? Miracleimpulse 15:12, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
- And you top it all off with yet another assumption of bad faith bordering on a personal attack...with no evidence. If you can't differentiate between reliably sourced evidence and conspiracycruft, we have nothing more to discuss.--Isotope23 15:23, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
- Why don't we put this matter up for arbitration and let others figure out the motivations for your edits both here and on the Sweetest Day page. After all, it is in the best interests of Wikipedia to determine whether or not industry is using Wikipedia for profit. Miracleimpulse 15:34, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
Question: Why doesn't this Hallmark article mention that Hallmark makes all Disney greeting cards?
Answer: Because Gibson Greetings used to make all Disney cards, and Gibson was bought by American Greetings.
- Every day in every way, Hallmark and American Greetings are a Monopoly. And Wikipedia is being used by industry for purposes of mass deception on this page, the American Greetings page and the Sweetest Day page. It is that simple. Miracleimpulse 03:10, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
- The article doesn't mention any of Hallmark Card's licensing agreements. When you are making such a brash claim, you need to have evidence. All I've seen so far is speculation. Unless you find a source that directly claims that Hallmark and American Greetings are involved in some sort of grand conspiracy, then there is nothing to talk about. I'm tired of this "Don't you see! Make the connection!" stuff. Wikipedia is not the place to "Make the connection." I find two companies engaged in fierce competition a much more likely theory than a large conspiracy. I think Occam's razor applies. --Transfinite 04:47, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
- That the former president of Hallmark Brands USA is the current president of Carlton Cards is not speculation.
- That the founding president of The Hallmark Channel is the current director of The Hatchery is not speculation.
- That Hallmark now makes all Disney greeting cards is not speculation (Gibson has been sliced up like a piece of meat between American Greetings and Hallmark).
- That the flagship American Greetings Carlton Store at Chicago's Merchandise Mart recently closed without notification and was replaced by a Hallmark Gold Crown Store is not speculation. (Note to Transfinite: Saw this one for myself.)
- That American Greetings and Hallmark promote Sweetest Day using nearly identical verisimilitudes is not speculation.
- That American Greetings and Hallmark are blocking nearly every patented new greeting card concept from the market is not speculation.
- What are your sources on this information? I'd like to look into this myself. --Transfinite 22:59, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
Just as a reminder and so there is no confusion, you're arguing over greeting cards. Haizum 06:01, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
- See Talk:American Greetings, and now there's a thread on WP:ANI. Newyorkbrad 06:06, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
The term "Hallmark Holiday" is a pop-cultural reference to the concept that certain "holidays" are created and/or glorified by commercial interests - not just the Hallmark company - in order to sell products rather than celebrate a religious or secular special occasion. While the pop-culture term "Hallmark Holiday" carries the trade name of a specific company, its meaning far transcends the fact that the term carries the tradename of a specific and highly successful greeting card company. These articles should absolutely not be merged, because despite the use of a company tradename (which, of course, should be properly credited as belonging to that company) the term, in pop-culture, has vastly transcended the business dealings of that particular company. Look at it this way: many people use machines made by many companies to photocopy documents, and a large percentage of them to refer to the process as "Xeroxing," even though a large percentage of those photocopies are not made on machines made by the Xerox Corporation. A rough anaology, I admit, but I think it gets my point across. Properly credit the tradename Hallmark to its owner, and include text about how the term "Hallmark Holiday" came into existence, but do not merge the article with that on the Hallmark company. It would be destructive to the informational/social purpose of WikiPedia, and unfairly demeaning to the Hallmark company. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.8.131.52 (talk) 10:27, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
Are you aware of how big American Greetings actually is? Look at thier corporate information and see all the characters they own, the companies they own, or acquired over the years. If anything, they would buy Hallmark! 184.108.40.206 (talk) 01:13, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
I removed hallmarkgreetz.com from the article because I'm not sure it is a legit part of Hallmark.
- The whois records are different.  versus 
- I can't find a link to hallmarkgreetz.com on hallmark.com
- Adding the link is Hnoom's first and only edit.
If I'm wrong, I aplogize, but better safe than sorry. --Transfinite 19:25, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
Answer: I can understand your thoughts, but the link to this site is located on the www.hallmark.com site.
Click on "E-cards and More", on the right side there is a banner; New from Hallmark! Make Your Own Holiday Cards. The product is fairly new, and I am not really sure how they call the product itself. It think it should be "Create your own cards.", which is shown on the site itself.
I see it now. I wasn't 100% sure either way, but they have a banner ad off to the side on thier e-cards page. Durr. --Transfinite 01:51, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
I don't know about other places, but in North Carolina, Hallmark stores have different names. They're like, Jackie's Hallmark, Debbie's Hallmark, Daphne's Hallmark, and Andy's Hallmark. The first one is in at least Laurinburg, the second and third are in Raleigh and the last one was in Asheville, last I checked. --Jnelson09 20:41, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
- They are probably franchises. I don't know much about the company, but I think they have corporate owned stores as well as franchise stores that may have the owner's names in them.--Isotope23 20:51, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
There are corporate owned and franchised Hallmark Gold Crown Stores. They can have any name such as "Jackie's Hallmark" but they are all Hallmark Gold Crown Stores Chris1834 (talk) 00:14, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
Assistance in upgrading this article
I work with Hallmark Business Expressions' (a subsidiary of Hallmark Cards) communications agency. We are looking to update this article and make it fully accurate and more informative.
We would like to add Hallmark Business Expressions to the Subsidiaries section of this article. According to what I've gleaned from suggestions on the (WP:NPOV) and autobiographical guidelines (WP:Auto), the best way of incorporating some of our suggestions is to post them to this talk page to let the community decide how best to incorporate them. If anyone would like to work on this article further, please contact me on my talk page.
My reference for this addition comes from BtoB Magazine and can be found at http://www.btobonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20061016/FREE/610160701. If the community is okay with this addition, I will post a revised Subsidiaries section here for final approval and technical review.
I look forward to working with editors transparently and in good faith to make this article better. We understand the value of Wikipedia and want to make sure all interested readers get a thorough, neutral view of Hallmark and its subsidiaries. We respect this process and want to update this article seamlessly and transparently. Thank you. Morningstarcomm (talk) 15:34, 15 January 2008 (UTC)
- Here is an updated Subsidiaries entry that reflects the addition of Hallmark Business Expressions as a subsidiary.
- Hallmark Channel: a television network
- Binney & Smith (now Crayola, LLC): makers of Crayola-brand crayons
- Rainbow Brite: a franchise of children's dolls
- Hallmark Cards: a chain of independently-owned card and gift stores in the United States and Canada
- Hallmark Business Expressions (HBE): Formed in 1996, Hallmark Business Expressions is a business-to-business subsidiary of Hallmark Cards, Inc. and is headquartered in Kansas City, MO. Morningstarcomm (talk) 19:02, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
Merge Hallmark holiday
Hallmark holiday is just a bit of nonnotable slang used here and there but with no solid cites to provide info that would be able to create an article that is anything but oriinal research/synthesis. Mere use of the term briefly in a couple of columns in no way establishes notability for a Wikipedia article. At best it should get a brief one sentence mention here. DreamGuy (talk) 20:49, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
- Disagree. Hallmark Holiday describes a concept that is not limited to Hallmark cards as such. Any commercial entity, working for its own benefit, that manipulates public opinion to generate hype around a fictional or non-existant holiday bears this identification. Hallmark name is stuck to it because Hallmark was the first to do it. Sort of like 'Kodak moment'.
- अभय नातू (talk) 00:56, 24 April 2009 (UTC)
- Disagree. The term is widely used in various social and political contexts, and is not limited to things relating directly to Hallmark. Example: http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/04/27/politics/politicalhotsheet/entry4970855.shtml —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.127.116.11 (talk) 16:34, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
- If there's a notability problem, you may wish to consider articles for deletion? Although just to note it has been nominated before and was snowball kept. --tgheretford (talk) 14:15, 19 June 2009 (UTC)
Merging Business Connections
Probably the Hallmark Business Connections should just be deleted? The Business Connection has no content and it seems that people are against merging information to this page. Although the founder of Hallmark links to this page. So I would think that the page Hallmark Cards represents the business and not some other concepts. If this is not correct, then we need a disassociate page, because it is definitely conceptually mixed up; the intro IS about the company. 18.104.22.168 (talk) 19:44, 16 March 2012 (UTC)