Talk:Hope Diamond

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Popular culture section[edit]

This section is especially pathetic in this article, listing unimportant allusions from unimportant TV episodes. I suggest its complete removal. Any objections? Mlouns (talk) 18:35, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

If I don't hear objections by a week from today, I will probably delete the section. Mlouns (talk) 20:24, 13 September 2010 (UTC)
I object68.123.155.229 (talk) 19:50, 5 January 2013 (UTC)§ :D
Little late to object; it's been deleted for over a year now.--Tomwsulcer (talk) 19:58, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

Marie Antoinette[edit]

The article mentions that Marie Antoinette never modified the French Blue nor did she wear it. I don't believe that her resetting of the crown jewels is common knowledge; I'm not sure what the relevance of her inaction is. Perhaps mention of her should be removed and the paragraph should focus on the fact that the French Blue in the Order of the Golden Fleece pendant was unmodified from 1749-1792 with only the one exception of the "scientific study." Any thoughts?--68.225.131.130 (talk) 17:02, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

  • Marie Antoinette is often invoked as a victim of the "curse", supposedly having brought on the French Revolution and her death at the guillotine by having worn the blue diamond. While she did wear many of the crown jewels, the French Blue was not among them, thus contradicting another stock element of the legend. Wombat1138 (talk) 01:49, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Winston mailing[edit]

This article mentions Winston mailing the Hope to the Smithsonian in a brown paper bag through the postal service. However, the article on Winston himself identifies a different diamond as "The Jonker" that he had put in the mail. Since it was also a large diamond, the two could be confused. However, since The Jonker was uncut it is much more likely this is the one he had mailed as it would have appeared unspectacular to anyone who came across it. The Hope would have been finished and easily recognizable as valuable. 66.152.251.226 (talk) 14:45, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

value[edit]

I wonder, what is the estimated value of the hope diamond to date?

  • As stated in the article, the Hope diamond was examined by GIA gemologists in December 1988. They graded it for clarity, color, cut, and weight. They DID NOT appraise it. T.E. Goodwin 05:31, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

I have added the estimated value of the Gem in British pounds as well as in American dollars. Where in the world did the preposterous value of $300 to $350 BILLION come from for this diamond? That is ridiculous. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.148.111.26 (talk) 02:28, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

The Wittelsbach Blue, which is smaller by about 10 ct and has a similar, if less lurid provenance, just sold for $24 million. A range of $40-50 million is probably realistic.205.143.123.10 (talk) 00:14, 7 February 2009 (UTC)

Ten Years ago the Smithsonian estimated the value of the Hope Diamond at $100 Million. I would'nt imagine the value increasing very much over the past decade. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.59.101.93 (talk) 17:45, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

According to mostexpensivediamond.org The estimated value is around 350 Million I dont know if this qualifies as a RS but I figured it would be at least appropriate for the "Talk Page".--HighallTimes (talk) 04:51, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

actualy I just read it and in 2011 it would go for: 200-250 MILLION dollers!

Added to Wikiproject Paranormal[edit]

...due to the circumstances surrounding the curse, et al. --Chr.K. 19:14, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

  • If you read the Hope Diamond article carefully, you will see that the so-called "curse" was an invention that started in 1909, because of a newspaper article. Many of the people "cursed" by possession of the diamond never existed. Harry Winston often carried the Hope Diamond on his person, and he died at the age of 82 of natural causes. In actuality, there is nothing "paranormal" about the Hope Diamond, except for the ongoing nonsense about the alleged "curse." T.E. Goodwin 05:36, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Pitau[edit]

Sieur Piteau is not the forename of the jeweller, it is his title in french it is like writing in english Lord Pitau. I'd rather write 'The jeweller Piteau,' —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Chris CII (talkcontribs) 00:27, 3 March 2007 (UTC).

two images[edit]

The two images at the end of the article are pretty atrocious quality, and don't show the diamond nearly as well as the first pic. Can we get rid of them? They add nothing to the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 141.213.220.186 (talk) 06:07, 12 September 2007 (UTC)


this is a bunch of poopie. and curses are not real. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.68.12.134 (talk) 19:35, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

The old "Legends" heading[edit]

I have renamed the old "Legends" heading to Legend.

I removed the quotes that surrounded the heading's name because it seems to be silly to put quotes around the word legend as if you are saying, "this is the supposed legend."

I also changed the heading so that it can be singular since there is only one legend being spoken about at the time of the edit. When another legend is added, we can change it back to plural: Legends.

Joel M. (talk) 15:51, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

1970's TV Program[edit]

I vividly recall watching this program during the 1970's about the Hope Diamond (more than once in fact). It would be a good addition to the section titled "In Popular Culture"

http://tv.nytimes.com/show/53166/Legendary-Curse-of-the-Hope-Diamond/overview —Preceding unsigned comment added by Katyraider (talkcontribs) 03:08, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Additional Information[edit]

If you look very carefully at the bottom of Harry Winston's original setting for the Hope Diamond, you will see a tiny hook. From this hook, Evalyn Walsh McLean often hung the diamond named "The Star Of The East", a pear-shaped diamond weighing nearly 95 carats.

While the Hope Diamond was on exhibit in South Africa in 1965, it was displayed on a gold rosebush. The diamond rested in the center of a golden web like spider; alluding to the legend of bad luck.

Source for these additions: "Blue Mystery The Story of the Hope Diamond" copyright 1976 by Susanne Steinem Patch, Smithsonian Institution Press. Foreword by Paul E Sesautels, then curator in charge of the National Collection of Gems.

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Sabrina Sprite (talkcontribs) 00:05, 19 February 2010 (UTC)

Was Hope a King?[edit]

Hi, In the section 'The Museum national d'Histoire naturelle (MNHN) in Paris' there is the sentence, 'Like many kings before him, Hope could have pawned the French Blue to Eliason to get cash at a time the sterling was highly depreciated.' However, Hope was a banker and not of royal blood, am I correct? This sentence needs clarification as it implies Hope was a King. Not sure how to do this as I am not overly familiar with the details of the Hope diamond (having come here from the media reports of the new setting at the Smithsonian).

The stone's necklace with the Star of the East attachment ought to be mentioned in the article. Most people have never heard of the Star of the East and would probably be surprised to hear about it. --98.232.176.109 (talk) 08:10, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

However, a casual reader, such as myself, may come away with the impression that Hope was a King. Could someone with real expertise please correct! Maybe something along the line of, 'Like the kings who owned the the diamond before him, the Dutch banker Hope could have pawned...'

Hope this helps in the improvement of this article :-) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mondegreen de plume (talkcontribs) 05:24, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

Source for these additions: "Blue Mystery The Story of the Hope Diamond" copyright 1976 by Susanne Steinem Patch, Smithsonian Institution Press. Foreword by Paul E Sesautels, then curator in charge of the National Collection of Gems.

Photo needed of the new necklace![edit]

When is somebody going to post a photo of the new necklace??? --98.232.176.109 (talk) 08:12, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

And for that matter, post a whole bunch of new information culled from the Smithsonian show, like the story of the postal worker who carried the registered mail package to the museum? --Magmagirl (talk) 22:34, 19 January 2011 (UTC)

Hello! Done and done folks! Now if someone more qualified than I can move it around so it shows at the "right" place instead of waaay at the botom, it would be appreciated. I'm not suggesting it should be the "main" photo but surely it should be a bit higher up. Cheers, Observer31 (talk) 02:04, 24 March 2011 (UTC)

Article needs cleanup and attention[edit]

I took the liberty of adding the tag and category -- it looks like this hasn't seen a significant update since before Harry Winston revealed its new anniversary setting, and since then Smithsonian Channel aired "Mystery of the Hope Diamond," which also provided more information. --Magmagirl (talk) 22:41, 19 January 2011 (UTC)

Revamp expansion -- seeking advice[edit]

I'm worked on a tentative redraft of this article as part of the U.S. collaboration of the month in a sandbox here. I kept pretty much all of the previous information, with occasional copyedits, but added numerous references, a few sections and pictures. I added two wikitables to summarize info about the changing ownership and value, as well as the fates of previous owners.--Tomwsulcer (talk) 01:08, 12 July 2011 (UTC)

It's possible to swap the sandbox article in to the Hope Diamond article, then swap it out soon thereafter (this permits the two versions to be compared side by side); but it probably wouldn't be worth it because so much stuff has been moved around.--Tomwsulcer (talk) 01:08, 12 July 2011 (UTC)

While working on it, I was kind of surprised to find other sources on the web which were more thorough and comprehensive than Wikipedias so I hope the revamp will make it competitive out there. There are loads of interesting stories, as well as fabricated stuff about the supposed curse probably to generate publicity (to up the diamond's value?) but I tried to keep everything in and maintain the neutral perspective and yet try to write it (while keeping facts hopefully straight) to keep a flow going. I'm wondering:--Tomwsulcer (talk) 01:08, 12 July 2011 (UTC)

  • would people please look it over and offer comments and suggestions?--Tomwsulcer (talk) 01:08, 12 July 2011 (UTC)
  • one thing I'm wondering about -- and it's kind of a big issue which I'm not sure about -- but it's this -- is the Hope Diamond the actual stone in the Smithsonian? Or is it the pattern which is beautiful, or the idea of the stone, which is valuable -- in this latter case, the content about the French efforts to create a replica, based on the leaden forms, means that the cubic zirconia model in Paris is the same importance as the rock in Washington. I'm kind of leaning to thinking that the French efforts to create a replica perhaps deserves a paragraph or two in the Hope Diamond article, but that the replica stuff should have its own article somewhere. But I'm seeking advice on this question.--Tomwsulcer (talk) 01:08, 12 July 2011 (UTC)
Update -- sandbox article moved in here, so make changes directly here in the Hope Diamond article (not the sandbox) if you wish. One more thing: I'm leaving the expanded "quote" sections in the references for now -- to make it easier for people to check instead of using the slow-moving pdf files; but as per copyvio requirements, after about a week or so I will trim these quotes-within-references down substantially which will also trim the article down a bit too. --Tomwsulcer (talk) 15:02, 12 July 2011 (UTC)

Values[edit]

Where the diamond was sold in countries other than the US, the values should be given in that country's currency first, with the value in US dollars in parentheses afterwards. As it stands in this article at the moment, for its sale in the UK, in some cases the values are given in US dollars alone, which is clearly a nonsense as the USD is not the currency there. There must be consistency, I realise, in providing USD values for all its sale prices over the years, especially as it now resides in the US, but to give primacy to USD values for sales not in USD is just plain worng, especially in an international encyclopaedia. Conversely, the table is a mess - all values such as livres, francs etc should have 2011 USD value in parentheses. 86.133.210.78 (talk) 08:45, 10 November 2011 (UTC)

Agreed. Please fix.--Tomwsulcer (talk) 00:10, 11 November 2011 (UTC)

Photo[edit]

Hi folks. I've uploaded a 1974 official photograph from the Smithsonian of the Hope Diamond. Perhaps it's of value for this article. You can find the image here. -- Sarah (talk) 00:08, 27 May 2012 (UTC)

Cool! How did you get this photo! Great -- I added it. Maybe we should use it as the lead photo in the infobox? Thanks SS.--Tomwsulcer (talk) 01:19, 27 May 2012 (UTC)

Geological Beginnings[edit]

This section seems unnecessary to me, as it pertains to the general process through which diamonds are created, rather than any specific feature of the Hope Diamond. I propose that it be deleted - objections? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.15.32.35 (talk) 22:05, 30 May 2012 (UTC)

I object; geological beginnings are both relevant and interesting. Most people are unfamiliar with how diamonds are formed, and this article will be their only exposure to it. It relates to the diamond's uniqueness. Many subjects have a "history" section which helps readers place the subject in context; this one should too.--Tomwsulcer (talk) 20:02, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

Seconded, in favor. I found it a nice refresher on very basic geophysics with specifics on the hue and structural peculiarities that make this diamond unique. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Raiders88 (talkcontribs) 10:23, 19 January 2014 (UTC)