Talk:Humiliation

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Lobsided[edit]

According to this article Humiliation seems to be a phenomenon mainly concerned with sex and fraternities... (scratches head) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.75.190.161 (talk) 19:49, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

Humiliation studies and war[edit]

Important to this subject is the matter of the use of humiliation in war/human conflict -- particularly as it relates to the rape of women and the emasculation of men. The present appalling situation Darfur is a perfect example of this phenomenon. deeceevoice 15:11, 5 December 2005 (UTC)

Humiliation in pop culture[edit]

I wonder if a section of this article could include an analysis of the extent that commercialization and marketing in Western society wields the perception of shame and humiliation i.e. "if you don't have an SUV, you're a sissy man" or "if you don't buy this diet product you'll be fat and ridiculous to everyone else" etc.

Humiliation also seems to play a large role in "reality television"--the competitions between people seem to have something to do with this very perfected persona that conforms to specific gender, race, class norms. --Erin1983 02:28, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

Humiliation in animals[edit]

Tho it's not a crime, do animals feel shame/humiliation? If so, can someone write an article on it?--sin-man 10:19, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

The "Social Defeat" Approach[edit]

Hello contributors to this issue,

I think the "Social Defeat" approach can contribute to improve the understanding of human aggression issues, like humiliation, bullying and others. Please read the "stub" i wrote in WIKIPEDIA:

Social defeat

Thank you for your attention,

Alberto

Humiliation versus Embarrassment[edit]

I am uncertain about the difference between humiliation and embarrassment, and was curious to know if it would be better to combine the humiliation page with the embarrassment page. The page that focuses entirely on humiliation is vague and unhelpful and does not stand well on its own anyway. If, however, there is a difference between humiliation and embarrassment, then I think it would be helpful to discuss this topic on the humiliation page.

Examples in which I use for the differences between Humiliation and Embarssassment in the BDSM lifestyle.

The opinions expressed in this article are Boundlady's only, based on personal experiences and discussions with other submissives. She has used "he" for dominants, "she" for submissives, those pronouns are interchangeable for all forms of BDSM relationships.


Humiliation

When we look at Webster's, humiliation is explained as "injuring the dignity or pride of <somebody>". Many people I have asked about their opinion on humiliation have told me the same thing. They see it as something bad, something that hurts the humiliated party, and something that is done spitefully. And I have heard that not only from "vanilla" people, but also from people who are in the scene.

Of course that made me think, and it made me try to come up with a way to explain what humiliation means to me. I am not into being hurt emotionally, I am not into my dignity being injured, and I am not into being treated like dirt. But I am into humiliation. So there is a difference.

What is humiliation?

When I say humiliation I am talking about Safe, Sane, Consensual Humiliation Play. To me it is the essence of D/s play. Looking at the things we do makes me think that every submissive is into humiliation to some extend, some very little, some a lot. Boundaries of humiliation are the ones that are stretched the most, with many participants not even realizing that what they are doing is a humiliation scene. Looking at my relationship with my Master from a vanilla point of view, I am humiliating myself by calling him "Master". But I don't care about that, I get satisfaction from my submission to him, from his pleasure in hearing me call him Master.

Humiliation comes in many forms. Most of us like spankings. To us it is obviously not humiliating, but if someone vanilla were to watch it they would most likely think "wow, how humiliating". So, to a very small extend, it is a humiliation scene. Being called names, like slut, whore, little girl is humiliation. Being pranced as a ponygirl or led as a puppy in front of an audience is humiliation. Being tied to a table with your butt up in the air is humiliation. Being watched going to the bathroom is humiliation. Golden showers, bondage, fisting, caged, fingered in public at the dinner table till you climax, being told to open your blouse another button while you feel all eyes are on you, holding open your pussy lips while you masturbate and your Master watches, being bound with your wrists above your head at a play party and left … all these things to me fall under the heading of humiliation. A humiliation scene can be something really simple, or something really extreme.


Embarrassment and Humiliation, what's the difference?

This is another question where I hear different opinions all the time. To me embarrassment is a bad thing. It is a result of bad humiliation. I get embarrassed if someone says something to me about my bodysize, I get embarrassed when I trip and fall in the street … it is a result of being humiliated or humiliating myself non consensually. I have been thinking about what creates that difference, and I think it has to do with the aspect of deniability. If Master calls me his whore I get wet, but if I really was a whore I might get upset, embarrassed that he mentions something like that. I know that I am not a whore, or a slut, so he can use these things in our humiliation play. If he were to call me a fat cow I would be upset and hurt, I am a little overweight so I don't have that deniability anymore - "maybe he really does think I am a fat cow .. maybe I am a fat cow … oh my god, he thinks I am fat" - embarrassment and hurt would be the result. There is no deniability, I know I am overweight, I am sensitive about that issue, and that makes it a bad thing to use in a scene.


Humiliation? But I like it!

One question always comes up in humiliation discussions. "How can it be humiliation if I like it?"


A scene where a dominant orders his partner to drop naked to the floor, crawl across the room to his side, lick his feet, and bark like a dog would appear extremely humiliating to an observer, while the submissive would just feel turned on. She might not feel humiliated at all, after all, this man is her Master and there is no need to feel embarrassed in front of him.


This form of play is called humiliation play, but the submissive that enjoys it usually doesn't have the feeling of being humiliated, she is just turned on. Isn't this the same thing as a whipping scene, where an observer might say "Ouch, that's got to hurt", while the submissive who enjoys a whipping does not feel like she is being hurt, she just feels extreme sensation and a great turn-on?


I think it is only humiliation as I am discussing it here, SSC humiliation play, if the submissive likes it. She might not like it right then and there, but if, in the long run, she likes what happened, then it is a humiliation scene. Just like a flogging in BDSM is only a "good thing" if both partners like it … at least in the overall scheme of things. A lot of things my Master does to me I do not like while they are happening … for example I hate for him using the quirt, and I hate crawling around on the floor picking up magnets with the nipple clamps on my nipples … but in the overall picture I love those things. I love that fact that he can make me do nasty things for him, I love the fact that I am able to stand there and take the quirt if it pleases him to whip me with it. I love the pleasure and the pride on his face if I have done something that was hard for me to do … if I have done it just for him, just because I am his submissive, not because it was so much fun to do.

On the other hand, if something is done that the submissive can not deal with emotionally then I don't call it humiliation, I call it abuse. Just like whipping someone who could not deal with a whipping, who does not want to be whipped, who does not get any enjoyment out of being whipped during or after the scene in my opinion would not be a SSC S&M scene, it would be abuse. We all have physical and emotional limits, and they have to be respected. Sooner or later limits surely can be pushed, but it has to be done at a speed that works for the submissive. It has to be done when the time is right, when the trust is established to go that extra step.


Humiliation and Subspace

Humiliation puts me into subspace like nothing else. Doing things for my Master that I would not do for anyone else is an awesome feeling. It puts me where I want to be, at his feet, being humble, being submissive, giving up my pride and dignity for him … for a short period of time. It is that "I would do anything for him" feeling, that "he truly owns me" feeling.


When he softly whispers in my ear "Only a real nasty girl would get that wet from a whipping" I'm just gone, it's over, I'm his. I become lost in his power and control over me, I am nothing but his little girl to do with as he pleases.


I find that there are two different things that are called subspace. For me, the space I go into during a humiliation scene or any type of mental scene is the subspace that is important. The deep feelings of total submission I get when he looks at me, when he talks to me, when he touches me, when he makes me his … that to me is subspace. And nothing can get me there like a humiliation scene, a scene where he puts me in a lower place, a place where I feel I belong during that time. The endorphin high of a whipping is very different, it is a place where I go during a heavy physical scene, but I can only go there if I am in that mental space first … if I feel submissive, if I want to take his pain because I am his to do with as he pleases. Maybe I feel this way because I don't see myself as a masochist, I accept pain because it pleases him to give it, and accepting it for him makes makes me feel good.


Important points to consider


There are some things that you need to remember when getting into humiliation play on a deeper level. Know your partner. I believe that heavy humiliation play can not be done with a casual partner. There is too much at stake. When playing with humiliation we are playing with people's emotions and with their minds. Before getting into a scene that involves humiliating someone you have to know as much as possible about your partner, and your partner has to know you. Childhood memories, religious beliefs, bad experiences … all those things can surface during a heavy scene and spoil it. The level we go to in our humiliation scenes changes all the time, our play gets heavier the longer we have been together.


· A safeword/safesignal is extremely important. Old memories have a habit of resurfacing when they are the least expected. The scene might have to end; reassurance that it is okay to safeword will be needed. In a humiliation scene the submissive's emotional health is at stake … there should not be any room for "I'm the dom and if I want to do this I can". A limit that can not be crossed today might be crossed tomorrow, but forcing the issue in these types of scenes can ruin the relationship. Sometimes a trigger comes up so fast that the submissive is unable to safeword , but usually her incoherent crying is a pretty good sign that something is wrong. At least that's what happened with me when we hit such a trigger.

· Aftercare. Never as important as it is after a humiliation scene. Hugging, cuddling, talking … making sure she knows that he respects her as a partner, that she gets just as much respect back as she gives. Making her feel and hear that he knows who she really is, and what she is giving him with her submission. Letting her know that she is just as important as he is, that she is not any less in his eyes for lowering herself for him, for allowing him to put her into this humble place. Bringing her back up stronger and taller than she has been before.

Humiliation is a wonderful tool to use in our lifestyle. It is also something that is easily abused, and sometimes the boundary between SSC humiliation play and abuse becomes blurred. A good rule of thumb is this:


If it doesn't feel right then chances are that it isn't right. Trust your gut feeling, and if your gut feeling tells you that something goes too far, then it probably does go too far and it would be a good idea to stop. There is always tomorrow to push a little further.


Page Protection[edit]

Does anyone know how to protect a page? There is a comic strip that was syndicated to newspapers across the United States today that directly referenced this Wikipedia article. It is only shortly after 12:00 noon on the east coast and 9:00 AM on the west coast, and already multiple editors have vandalized this article. I am not very familiar with Wikipedia. How do you request an article be protected? Claffey27 (talk) 16:23, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

There doesn't seem to be need to protect the page. I removed the mildly amusing image and the contributor has to deal with the copyright violation notice on the image. A random image doesn't seem to improve the article much anyway. -- SEWilco (talk) 04:29, 3 April 2009 (UTC)
To Claffey; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Editor_assistance/Requests. Lots42 (talk) 06:56, 3 April 2009 (UTC)
I was on vacation when I saw that comic strip, and I thought to myself, "I just bet someone will have tried to imitate the idea." I didn't have access to a computer to check, though.
I thought that comic strip was quite funny. Probably the exact same as the majority of vandals on wikipedia - just juveniles and sophomoric humor.Somebody or his brother (talk) 00:36, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

There's another direct reference in one of today's widely syndicated comics: http://zitscomics.com/comics/february-26-2015/

Merge with Stultification[edit]

There is no encyclopedic difference between humiliation and stultification, therefore Stultification should be merged here. Neelix (talk) 21:23, 28 June 2011 (UTC)

  • Oppose They are quite different. Humiliation is ridicule or a blow to pride while stultification is the inculcation of foolishness or ignorance. For example, watching television is commonly said to stultify by its feeble content and passive nature — it is an intellectual pablum. But this is not normally considered to be humiliating. Warden (talk) 21:38, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
Understood. I have withdrawn the merge suggestion. Neelix (talk) 19:05, 3 July 2011 (UTC)
  • That's why I have removed the text in brackets: (also called stultification). Ulisp (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 20:58, 25 July 2012 (UTC)