Talk:Jeu de paume
|WikiProject Tennis||(Rated Start-class, Top-importance)|
|This article is part of the "Olympic events" set of articles nominated for Version 0.7. Discuss this nomination, or see the set nominations page for more details.|
|This article was nominated for merging with Real tennis on February 2010. The result of the discussion was no consensus, so no merge.|
I am confused. In its article, jeu de paume is played by handpalm. But Real tennis is the original racquet game. They can't be the same! -- Error 01:15, 29 Aug 2003 (UTC) After researching the origins of ping pong, I found out that England is not a factual orgin of ping pong. Thus, reading this article about Jeu de Paume, it seems that there is a very strong connection with ping pong and Jeu de Paume "game of the hand." Any help with this connection is greatly appreciated.
- Jeu de paume, as the name implies, started without racquets. Racquets were an historical development to the game. It started with bindings, then gloves, then sticks, and finally a netted racquet. For a long time the racquet was optional, and a racqueted player would face one without a racquet. Frankly, I am not really sure why there are separate Wikipedia articles for real tennis and jeu de paume. -- As for "ping pong," that is a trademark, and for legal reasons the sport is usually called table tennis. I have always heard that it started in Victorian England, but see that article for its history. — Eoghanacht talk 17:36, 11 October 2005 (UTC)
The confusion about Jeu de Paume versus Real Tennis is widely spread. Jeu de Paume is played by hand. It still is in the north of France and some regions in Italy (Pallapugno). JdP is not only a precursor of (real)tennis but also of Frisian handball (The Netherlands), Jeu de Balle or Jeu de Pelote (Belgium), (Pallone) (Italy), and Valencian pilota. B. 11:44, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
This article still needs work. Real Tennis (aka Court Tennis) is called Jeu de Paume in France at the three clubs that have courts (Paris, Fontainebleau, Bordeaux). There is also the Jeu de Paume Museum, which is housed in an old Court Tennis court. This article is confusing because there is an image of people playing Court Tennis (aka Jeu de Paume) with rackets while the body suggests the game is played without rackets. I would suggest that the article be changed or merged with Court Tennis (or Real Tennis) and a note be added about how the game was originally plyed with hands.
- For B. : Jeu de paume was played with hands at the beginning, but it is played with rackets at least since the XVth century. And, IMHO, it is hard to say which game, in history, was the precursor among pelote, jeu de paume and other "jeux de balle" (small ball games). Probably all derive from a common root, but who knows where it comes from?
Gwalarn, I believe when Eoghanacht referenced the trade mark, he was talking about "ping pong" not "jeu de paume." I also believe that this article should be merged with Real Tennis. Caboogie (talk) 00:14, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
I think this should not be merged with another article. It is still played today, separately from tennis. One can read "Le jeu de paume aujourd'hui" (the JdP today), in the French article. It is still played (well, not by billions), and there is a world cup each year since 1740 (which makes it the oldest international sports trophy in the world, older than the America's cup).--Hehiheho (talk) 09:38, 21 December 2009 (UTC)
- Oppose merge The article treats a subject that is not, in fact, tennis, but something more like handball which latterly became tennis. Since the game had its own distinct handball identity, it can carry an article by itself. The article also usefully discusses the Serment du jeu de paume painting as well as the Galerie nationale du Jeu de Paume. The article stands on its own feet as a clearly distinct treatment. Incorporating it into tennis would be an error of categories. — O'Dea (talk) 07:23, 28 March 2011 (UTC)
- Comment I am going to close this old merge proposal, taking into account the discussion from both Talk pages. There is no concensus, so no merge.MakeSense64 (talk) 14:32, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
- No, it is a substantive (a noun) ; it means the face inside a hand ("palm"). It must be written with a capital letter when refering to the numerous locations where there were "jeu de paume" courts. In French, it is improper to write it with a capital when refering to the game. But because the sites are more famous than the game (which has nearly disappeared), the "P" in capital letter tends to be the usual form, see the official site of the French federation. Which doesn't pay much attention on correct spelling: on its site you can see "Comité Français" ("F" with a capital is completely wrong!) Gwalarn (talk) 13:11, 7 January 2008 (UTC)