Talk:Kingdom of Asturias

Recent issues

Is it correct to say that it was an indigenous rebellion of Astur or Cantabri peoples? The name Alfonso is Gothic, as are names like Bermudo, Favila, and Fruela. It seems that the Hispano-Roman people may have rebelled under the same old banner of the Visigothic nobility as they had been subject to for hundreds of years. Srnec 17:38, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

This month has ended the second campaign of the archaeological dig of La Carisa, Lena. This site (in a mountain pass) has remnants of military camps of two different periods: the first goes back to the Roman conquest times, and shows that Astures had a bigger organization and coordination than previously thought.It is well dated due to the coins found. The second is from centuries VII or VIII (according to C-14 findings). It is, following scholars, whether the rest of a fortress to protect Asturias (and astures) against Wamba´s Visigoths, or the first defences against Moors (well before Covadonga). Anyway, this remnants have proven to be of the Astures type rather than the Goth.--Xareu bs 06:51, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Asturias is also a predecessor of Portugal

Asturias is also a predecessor of Portugal, for that reason I'm adding the History of Portugal template and relevant categories. The Ogre 17:12, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Two strange sections

Can someone fix the "Christian spirituality: Milleniarism and Jacobean cult" section and the "Among the mists of myth..." sections? They're empty --AW 20:45, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Ready section: Christian spirituality: Milleniarism and Jacobean cult

I have translated the section "Christian spirituality: Milleniarism and Jacobean cult". As my English is too poor, I would be grateful if someone could correct my mistakes, and moreover, improve the style of redaction in order to make it pleasant to English-speaking readers.

Fmercury1980 17:41, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

I will take a look at this when I get a little more time. Thanks for translating all of this! Hiberniantears 18:54, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Images

I am preparing to do some copyediting, and for the meantime am removing some images from the religion section as they are not really do not add much to the article... Perhaps one or two of them will be sufficient. Rather than get rid of them, I am placing them here until I finish the copy edit, at which point we can look at what fits. The images are:

The Angel of the Fifth Trumpet: "And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit" (Revelation, 9.1)

"And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet, and decked with gold and precious stone and pearls, having in her hand a golden cup full of abominations, even the unclean things of her fornication, and upon her forehead a name written: «Mystery, Babylon the Great, the mother of the harlots and of the abominations of earth.»" (Revelation, 17.4-5)

"And there appeared a great wonder in Heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars: And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered. And there appeared another wonder in Heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads" (Revelation, 12.1-3)

The opening of the Sixth Seal: "And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood" (Revelation, 6.12)

"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty." (Revelation, 1.8)

"And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called «Faithful» and «True», and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God." (Revelation, 19.11)

Thanks! Hiberniantears 13:23, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Mythology

That section looks like a big problem. First, why are there pictures of Germany and Scotland? (And when did get buried in my ancestral homeland, I thought he was buried on an island of apples, Avalon). This discussion of related myths should be contained in the King Under the Mountain article, simply stating Fruela is such a person and perhaps a related geographical feature should be enough. The whole tone seems very unprofessional for example "Moreover, the Covadonga area is plenty of astonishing stories, like the one which states that -over the place where today Enol and Ercina lakes are situated- there was once a shepherd village that was visited by Hail Mary,". State the stories, don't describe them as astonishing, mythological stories are very commonly, otherwise they would be real stories. And I think Hail Mary is a prayer, not a person. Calling her simply the Virgin later, without giving her proper full name, the Virgin Mary, is slightly confusing, consistancy is good. Just some stuff to consider for your finished product after translation. Anyone who suggests to me to be bold should be aware, I'm not bold and my caring of this subjext ends here —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.17.155.35 (talk) 01:01, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps the tone of that section sounds unprofessional because English is not my mother tongue. If you want to move some of the contents of the section to the article "King under the mountain", I have no problem. There are many stories related to King Arthur: One of them tells he was brought in Avalon, but another legends (who were collected by Sir Walter Scott) state that he still lives under the Eildon Hills (SW Scotland). Fmercury1980 13:52, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

Incompatibility

I've detected a possible error in section "Legado", in article es:Reino de Asturias, where it says:

En el primer parlamento de la historia de Europa[42] , las Cortes de León de 1192

In es:Cortes de León de 1188, it states:

En estas primeras cortes se incorporan representantes del estamento popular, los ciudadanos. Dicho modelo se incorporará más tarde en Castilla y Cataluña, y seguidamente al resto de Europa.

Which suggests these were the first ones. Can you please help in determining where is this is an error or a misinterpretation? Please reply at es:Discusión:Reino de Asturias. Nuno Tavares 21:12 10 feb 2008 (UTC)

Flag and Coat of Arms

Those flag and Coat of arms aren't right. The only thing known right now about Asturian Kingdom's symbols is that the Cruz de la Victoria (Victory Cross), was the Kingdom's symbol, but if you read the chronicles from the Kingdom you'll never find anythig about a flag and a Coat of Arms, with one exeption, in one battle leaded by Ramiro I of Asturias, and the flag was white with a red cross, like the English flag, but with the right side in angle. in fact, the person that made the flag and coat of arms that you show is from Valencia and was just he who decided that color. The first Asturian Official flag ever known is in 25th May 1808, with the Asturian Soberany Declaration, and the flag was like the present one (blue and the yellow cross) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Lasturianu06 (talk • contribs) 19:01, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

Drought and famine in the valley of river Duero

Hi, I would like to ask you if you know something about drought and famine in the valley of river Duero in 751 – 756. These events were possible reasons why Muslims left this territory. I have got only one source about this fact. Can you help me? Thank you, Niccolo 88.102.231.207 (talk) 20:09, 23 October 2008 (UTC)

Translation of "Evolución Histórica"

I translated several paragraphs of the Spanish article's section titled "Evolución Histórica". I intend to translate the five subsections in the coming weeks. I merged most of the passages about Pelayo and the Astur revolt into the new translated paragraphs. I deleted a couple of sentences to avoid repetition. Trsg (talk) 04:14, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

Arms and the Flag of the Kingdom of Asturias (Sources)

This flag and this coat of arms never were asturian symbols, see:

(Spanish) Jovellanos y el escudo de Asturias (con un breve apunte astorgano) Autor: Juan José Sánchez Badiola /Jovellanos and the arms of Asturias by Juan Jose Sanchez Badiola.

It was the Coat of Arms wrongly attributed to the Prince and the Principality of Asturias (Spain) in 15th through 18th centuries, as proved Gaspar Melchor de Jovellanos, author, philosopher and main figure of the Age of Enlightenment in Spain. This Coat of Arms appeared in printed books and maps, even It was included in the Encyclopédie of Denis Diderot. In a report about a ensign for the Regiment of Asturian Noblemen Jovellanos said the symbol of Asturias is the Victory Cross and it should be incorporated in these ensign.

This is the present Coat of Asturias Law:

• (Spanish) [1]

The present Asturian Arms regulation said: “...the arms of asturias consisted of a field of azure with the Victory Cross of Or… as said Jovellanos and the heraldist Ciriaco de Miguel Vigil”. So Asturias never had a gules coat of arms and a red or Crimson flag.

The first regulation for the Asturian Coat of Arms was an Act of the Provincial Diputation of Oviedo of 21th October 1857.

The asturian and the early leonese monarchs used the Victory Cross as symbol in a pre-heraldic period, but it wasn’t in a coat of arms, flag or standard. King Ramiro I of Asturias (c.790–850) used a white flag with a red cross in the pre-heraldic period.

• For these reasons I recomended to deleted File:Flag of the Kingdom of Asturias.svg, File:Hocsigno.JPG and File:Escudo del Reino de Asturias (Modelo de la Bandera).svg

I recomended as Kingdom of Asturias symbol if it would be necessary. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.79.192.228 (talk) 19:44, 25 July 2009 (UTC) --Proof02 (talk) 18:50, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

Beatus

A large section of the article Beatus de Liébana "History of the Kingdom of Asturias" may be more relevant here.--Felix Folio Secundus (talk) 15:07, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

Preheraldic Emblem

I put the image of the Asturian Cross used as preheraldic emblem. The Kingdom didn't have a coat of arms and a flag excep the royal ensign of King Ramiro. I need a hand to put the caption Preheraldic emblem or Emblem of the Kingdom of Asturias because it isn't a Coat of arms, a heraldic emblem. Thanks you.

I'm sorry for my English --83.54.158.147 (talk) 19:52, 24 June 2010 (UTC)