Talk:Kontinental Hockey League

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edit·history·watch·refresh Stock post message.svg To-do list for Kontinental Hockey League:
  1. Create roster templates for all teams
  2. Upgrade remaining teams to new infobox format
  3. Priority to expand the Ak Bars, Salavat, Dynamo, and CSKA articles

Official KHL names & common use[edit]

I made this list a while back for reference purposes to see how teams officially present their names in both Russian and English, since there are a lot of variations online due poor translation or westernization of the name format/syntax.

Bobrov[edit]

HC Dynamo Moscow:

HC LEV Praha:

Dinamo Riga:

HC SKA:

HC Vityaz:

HC SLOVAN Bratislava:

HC Donbass:

Tarasov[edit]

CSKA:

  • Official site RU: Professional Hockey Club CSKA, CSKA (note: Moscow is never mentioned in the official team history)
  • Logo: CSKA

HC Spartak Moscow:

HC Severstal:

HC Dinamo-Minsk:

HC Atlant Moscow Oblast:

HC Torpedo Nizhny Novgorod:

HC Lokomotiv:

Eastern[edit]

HC Barys:

NHC Metallurg:

  • Official site Russian: Novokuznetsk Hockey Club Metallurg, NHC Metallurg; HC Metallurg (Novokuznetsk),
  • Official site English: Metallurg Novokuznetsk (url)
  • Official Facebook: Metallurg Novokuznetsk (url), HC Metallurg (Novokuznetsk) [RU]
  • Official Twitter: HC Metallurg Novokuznetsk
  • Logo: Metallurg Novokuznetsk

HC Sibir:

HC Admiral

  • [http://hcadmiral.ru Official site (Russian): hcadmiral (url), "Hockey Club Admiral / Primorsky Krai" (translated)


HC Traktor

New![edit]

KHL Medvescak

Team names: the (hopefully final) discussion[edit]

The issue of the team names (i.e. "HC Sibir" vs "Sibir Novosibirsk" etc) has been discussed many times on individual team pages (e.g. Talk:HC Sibir Novosibirsk), but interstingly, never here. I think it is time that reach a consenus on a consistent team name format and then follow that on all KHL-related pages. My proposition: all team names follow the format <nick name> <city>, e.g. "SKA Saint Petersburg" or "Dinamo Minsk". The alternative would be the rather eclectic mixture of team name formats as proposed mainly by Lvivske (see above). Wild8oar (talk) 08:07, 20 October 2013 (UTC)

Just a few examples of websites using the "standardized" format: en.khl.ru (a very relevant point), eliteprospects.com, eurohockey.com. Wild8oar (talk) 08:34, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
I would simply use these names: en.khl.ru. Jirka.h23 (talk) 09:54, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
I totally agree to your proposal--ChelseaFunNumberOne (talk) 10:55, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
Firstly, using eliteprospects or eurohockey as sources doesn't fly, as they just pick and choose as they wish. Hockeydb on the other hand, inverses the names to make them more north american. The reality is the teams themselves don't use that format and that's the issue here. Using en.khl.ru as a source is fine, but bear in mind they couldn't even get the real name to the MHL right, it's often just poorly translated or rushed. How do the teams unquestionably, officially refer to themselves in English? Well I've compiled all the refs above. What I want to avoid here is using "common use" as for team names when we're the ones who invented common use, we shouldn't be influencing these unofficial nicknames into general English usage at all.
Here are some examples of issues that can arise: HC Donbass calls themselfes 'HC Donbass' in all English language use down to their English logo; yet some sites want to call them 'Donbass Donetsk' to 'Westernize' the name. Then we have HC Vityaz who moved from Chekhov to Podolsk, yet this line of thinking changed "Vityaz Chekhov" to "Vityaz Podolsk" even though the team officially never changed their name, logo, materials, etc. - they were always HC Vityaz. We shouldn't be influencing or making up fake names to suit our feels.--Львівське (говорити) 21:11, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
I would go with what en.khl.ru/clubs/ says. -DJSasso (talk) 18:00, 21 October 2013 (UTC)
...and ignore the English language official sites for the teams, their media guides (if any), etc.?--Львівське (говорити) 18:55, 21 October 2013 (UTC)
I agree that using the official English-language team names as supplied by en.khl.ru is the proper answer. Dolovis (talk) 20:25, 21 October 2013 (UTC)
Just to point out since I'm doing more looking, but the en.khl site calls Vityaz "Vityaz Moscow Region" (but says they're located in Chekhov, so it's wrong too) but the russian version of the page calls them "Vityaz (Moscow)"; meanwhile their official site calls them HC Vityaz and their social media uses "HC Vityaz Podolsk". I think, more than anything, this shows we need to look at things on a case-by-case basis and not just the en.khl.ru site as a sweeping solution.--Львівське (говорити) 23:59, 21 October 2013 (UTC)
But here we have exactly the problem: so what would we do in the Vityaz case? I think Lvivke's collection of case-by-case studies only shows that it leads to nowhere. Instead, it would require 28 sometimes quite arbitrary decisions. Better to stick with one source, and there I see no other choice than en.khl.ru. Wild8oar (talk) 05:31, 22 October 2013 (UTC)
Actually, on most of the collection examples the team's have it set fairly unanimous (namely if they use HC or not as a prefix), especially if they have an English language website.--Львівське (говорити) 07:26, 22 October 2013 (UTC)
I am sorry, but when I look at your list, I see mostly problematic/ambigous cases. They will 1) require too many decisions which will often be arbitrary and 2) are almost impossible to maintain/keep up to date. Wild8oar (talk) 09:06, 22 October 2013 (UTC)
I agree with you Wild8oar. I've been arguing in favor of this for years. (saint0wen (talk) 03:34, 24 May 2014 (UTC))
I currently see 5 users in favor of en.khl.ru and 1 (Lvivske) for a case-by-case analysis. I don't know if there will be more new arguments. Wild8oar (talk) 09:06, 22 October 2013 (UTC)
I am more in favour of the case-by-case analysis as well since the teams' administration knows better than the KHL how to call their team. This is similar to the problem of the English naming of the MHL - the KHL calls it the Youth Hockey League, while the league itself calls it the Junior Hockey League. In my opinion JHL should be used. More on the issue here. --IJK_Principle (talk) 23:42, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

My preference would be to use the names provided by the KHL website as well as the official websites of the individual teams. The process for naming the teams should be objective, not subjective. --Hockeyben (talk - contribs) 02:13, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

How about this as a solution: Use KHL English site only for teams that have no established English language policy/site. Teams like CSKA who only conduct themselves in Russian and never in English, go with the KHL site; but teams like Lev Praha (not 'Lev Prague') and HC Donbass who have English sites, merchandise, stores, logos etc. allow the team's official policy on the matter take precedence. --Львівське (говорити) 20:19, 7 December 2013 (UTC)

I agree with говорити. --stclaus

Join league year[edit]

I noticed that user Chelsea changed the years in the table to 2008 for every team, other users have previously wanted to keep the year the team joined the league, with the KHL acting as a successor to the RSL and Soviet leagues. Anyone have an opinion on this?--Львівське (говорити) 20:19, 7 December 2013 (UTC)

All-time team records[edit]

It would be nice to maintain the teams in the table ordered by their championship results (i.e. by the number of times a team finished 1st, then 2nd, then 3rd etc.), so that all-time performance can bee seen. It makes sense to carefully calculate position for a team to determine its place in the table. 2601:9:1B80:281:DDFA:72D:B918:9A3F (talk) 17:20, 5 March 2014 (UTC)

The question is more, how the teams should be ordered? I tried (my edit yesterday) with a point system (Gagarin Cup 16pts, finalist 8, semi-finalist 4, quarterfinal 2 and first round 1 point). Another option would be a system like with the olympic medals (first number of wins, then number of finalists etc). Or some kind of "all-time standings" with just the points accumulated in all seasons. But with the current ordering I cannot see any system. E.g.: why is Amur ahead of Lev? Wild8oar (talk) 15:12, 6 March 2014 (UTC)
I would vote for the medal system (first criterion is nr. of wins, then finals, then semifinals, etc)... ~Stclaus 21:48, 6 March 2014 (UTC)