Talk:Languages of Pakistan

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Question "what is the official language(s) of Pakistan" should be addressed at top--that's what most readers come looking for[edit]

I do find the huge variety of languages interesting, please don't get me wrong. But an encyclopedia article should cover the basics in the first couple of paragraphs, namely, what languages are used to conduct government business, and if there is controversy about this, a brief explanation of the positions. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.86.248.1 (talk) 00:48, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

English and Urdu[edit]

The summary lists Engligh as the national language, and Urdu as the official, then the details contradict it. 85.210.44.166 02:53, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

English / Urdu Debate[edit]

I extracted some POV debate content out of the article. It sounds hopelessly biased and even strange (complaining about learning English in English). If someone wants to clean this up, we can put back in that there is a debate, yadda, yadda, yadda --MarsRover 03:31, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Urdu[edit]

There is also a wide strong debate against Urdu by the staunch Pakistani nationalists led by the Pakistan Language Movement that; Should Urdu or Hindustani continue as our National Language? However their answer is No! and here is a very good reason why: Language is the most important aspect of culture, just like it is in England of the British Isles in the UK. It is the dominant feature in determining nationality in Pakistan’s Case or ethnicity in Bangladesh’s Case based on languages. It is the binding force that unites a people, and makes them distinct from others, especially the disparity between the formers Province of West Pakistan and East Pakistan administrative provincial regional state Entities of pre-1971. Language represents a people’s heritage and identity. However, the imposition of Urdu as the so-called ‘sole’ national language of Pakistan has been disastrous to the country ever since it's inception in 1947 evidently shown on the 1971 conflict of East Pakistan provincial region of a United Pakistan (UP) into a disastrous separate and unfortunate for Pakistanis a nation of a inevitable Bangladesh from hereto Pak-Territory in the partitioned eastern Bengal region of India pre-1947, only to be united by foreign rule i.e. Indian Empire Rajs of Britain.

English[edit]

There is also a wide general debate against the staunch Pakistani nationalists led by the Pakistan Language Movement that; Should English or Angraisè continue as our Official Language? However their answer is No! and here is the reason why: All the languages of Pakistan are oppressed, and the ruling elite Anglophones continue to deny them their rightful role they deserve as the official languages of Pakistan. Fifty years after the so-called jointly independence of India into Free Indias’ of (Bharat) & Muslim PAKISTAN from the U.K of Gr. Britannia and Ireland. The English Language continues to this day as the official language and graduates from non-English medium schools face a job market in the control of these colonial forces bent on the total destruction of all Pakistani languages. The fact is that in 1947 we inherited an elitist ruling class bureaucracy tenaciously clinging to power and owing allegiance to Great Britain alone and seeking a strengthening of Anglo-American interests and cultural subversion, the destruction of Muslim/Pakistani values and lifestyles throughout the country. The plain fact is that as long as English remains as the official language of Pakistan it will be difficult to create a vibrant national spirit or culture The status of a national language is meaningless; unless it is allowed to assume the role of official language or native languages of Pakistan, and as the medium of universal instruction within the country. Language is a potent force in the promotion of nationalism and national cohesion.

I agree with this totally.Well said.

————————————————————————————

No this doesn't belong in the article. What should be the national or official languages is not what the article is about. It's what languages are spoken in Pakistan 99.227.68.85 (talk) 21:05, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

Iranian languages?[edit]

Say there are more Pathans in Pakistan than Iran.Labelling Pashto and Balochi "Iranian languages" is clearly provocitive.-Vmrgrsergr 20:36, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Pashto and Balochi belong to the family of Iranian languages, a group of languages that stretches from Turkey to Tajikistan. The name is well established in linguistics, and is not provocative at all. —Angr 14:21, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Edit tag[edit]

Don't have much to say for this one. It's not too bad, but some parts of the article (especially near the bottom) need some work, preferably by someone with knowledge of the subject so mistakes aren't made in the content. It's generally understandable but doesn't flow well to an English reader. Brutannica 22:13, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

I will see what I can do about it.-Vmrgrsergr 03:05, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

Whats with the Map???[edit]

why is a map of all of South Asia here? this is a Pakistan specific article and should contain a map of Pakistan only!

If its about the lexical similarities of languages spoken in Pakistan then a wider map stretching from Iran, Central Asia, Afghanistan all the way to Tibet should have been included.

Please put a Pakistan specific map for this article as many are easily available.


Can you suggest a map if they are easily available? Preferable with the legend in English (not in German). MarsRover 23:25, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Ethnologue[edit]

It looks like large portions of this article were taken directly from the copyrighted Ethnologue article on Pakistan. Pretty much all of the content from Ethnologue will have to be deleted to avoid a copyright violation. --Metropolitan90 (talk) 14:11, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

Unsourced figures[edit]

The article says 50% of Pakistanis "have a basic understanding of English" or something to that effect. It also says 70% of Pakistanis can understand Punjabi. Where did these figures come from? Because I as a Pakistani find this doubtful. I would say about 30% of Pakistanis can speak functional English and only 50% can understand Punjabi. However since this is conjecture, I am not going to insert it into the article. But it seems someone put figures into the article based on personal 'observations' with no reputable source cited. Someone needs to cite these figures or remove them --Zaindy٨٧ 10:35, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

Agreed. Done. Poloplayers (talk) 16:41, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

Chitral language survey[edit]

If anyone is really serious about this, a bunch of pdfs over here: http://www.sil.org/sociolx/pubs/ssnp.asp seem very informative on a subset of the subject. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.78.116.237 (talk) 19:35, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

Some reorganization ideas[edit]

A few possible ideas that occurred to me (not sure whether I completely agree with them or not):

  • Add a main article link at the top of each of the languages described by a paragraph or more.
  • Change the link in the table to point to the section of this article
  • Coordinate the organization of the infobox and the article: Official, Provincial, Regional, Other
  • Move Seraiki from 'Provincial' to 'Regional' languages. It is a major language with no province.

Anyone have any comments about these ideas? YBG (talk) 04:47, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

I agree with all your points. Saraiki has been moved under the head of "Regional Languages" Poloplayers (talk) 16:40, 14 April 2010 (UTC)


"History" section is redundant[edit]

The "History" section is redundant as it is half-heartedly repeating what is already stated under each language sub-section. When each language has its own sub-section, there is no need for a "History" section, which is not even providing the history of the languages property. All information pertaining to a language should go under the respective language sub-section.

Poloplayers (talk) 16:52, 14 April 2010 (UTC)


Insertion of incorrect data[edit]

User 119.153.154.4 is repeatedly inserting incorrect and inflated data (backed up by no source whatsoever) on the number and percentage of Saraiki speakers under the Language Demographics section. The 1998 census and previous censi cannot be changed to suit your personal belief on what the numbers should be. Consider this a first warning. Repeated violations will be reported as vandalism. If you intend to change a figure, then back it up with a credible source, otherwise refrain from doing so. This link will take you to the OFFICIAL GOVERNMENT OF PAKISTAN DEMOGRAPHICS STATISTICS ON LANGUAGES: http://www.statpak.gov.pk/depts/pco/statistics/other_tables/pop_by_mother_tongue.pdf Poloplayers (talk) 14:39, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Capitalization of headings[edit]

The Wikipedia style for capitalizing headings is to use "sentence case" instead of "title case", e.g.,

Important things to know about this subject

not:

Important Things to Know About This Subject

This may be unfamiliar to many editors who believe that or have been taught that "title case is the right way to capitalize headings". It isn't the "right way", it is one style. Wikipedia has, for better or worse, chosen to follow a different style, i.e., capitalize the heading the same way you would capitalize any sentence:

  • capitalize the first word,
  • capitalize any proper nouns (people, places, organizations), and
  • begin all other words with lower case letters.

See WP:MSH for more information. Ground Zero | t 15:06, 18 April 2010 (UTC)


persian and turkic languages cultural languages ???[edit]

I decided to put the accuracy tag on the article because I don't find this claim that Turkic and Persian languages are part of Pakistani culture. I'm willing to accept this claim but it should be backed up by some points. Are there any written records of Turkic languages in Pakistani museums such as literature or other? Or anything of significance? There is not single Turkic language spoken in Pakistan.

As for Persian it is not spoken by Pakistanis as a native language. Some people learn it but it is not considered a local language.

Also this claim that Brahui is of unknown origin also seems incorrect when most people have established it's a dravidian language though very distinct from other dravidian languages. Unless people claiming it's "unknown" origin can give some evidence. Please discuss. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.227.68.85 (talk) 20:55, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

Persian and Turkish is our cultural languages as the Turkic people established rule in region of modern Pakistan. They settled here and spoke Persian in court and government, and among themselves Turkish. Greek and Latin are still taught as classical languages in many schools in western countries. While the British colonial government ended the teaching of Turkish, Persian and Arabic while introducing English to cut off links to Middle East and Central Asia.
Some linguists are questioning the origins of Brahui. Brahui is a Dravidian language and they migrated around 1000 AD from Central India and settled in Balochistan. This has been mentioned to balance all view points. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.117.182.54 (talk) 00:40, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

Saraiki Language[edit]

In language map of Pakistan Saraiki is not shown. Kindly it may be shown. Map of Sindhi and Punjabi are shown but map of saraiki is not shown. Dialects of Sindhi and Punjabi are written but Dialects of saraiki are not written. When I wrote these these are removed. I think that these are removed by mistake

Not removed by mistake, you need to discuss these things first. And "discuss" doesn't mean just posting some huge chart that is inappropriate here. --Taivo (talk) 03:23, 30 October 2012 (UTC)

Saraiki be added in map of languages of Pakistan, Please. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 182.186.8.237 (talk) 11:10, 30 October 2012 (UTC)

As sindhi and punjabi are with map and dialects. Saraiki be treated same. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 182.186.8.237 (talk) 11:07, 30 October 2012 (UTC)

Language Map of Pakistan

This map is absolutely wrong, Saraiki must be added in this map. Saraiki is the largest language of pakistan. File_talk:Pakistan_ethnic_map.svg .Kindly upload this First map. http://thepolyglotexperience.blogspot.com/2011/01/pakistan-language-map.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 182.186.17.238 (talk) 01:42, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

That's an inferior map, and you have not demonstrated that the Saraiki are ethnically distinct from the Panjabi. — kwami (talk) 16:32, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

Sariki are ethinically distinct from punjabi.Sarraiki-language-and-ethnic-identity-by-dr-saiqa-imtiaz-asif

This article isn't about ethnicity, it's about language. --Taivo (talk) 11:25, 2 November 2012 (UTC)

Yes this article is about language. I wrote this due to kwami. Saraiki is a language so in map Saraiki language be shown also. I hope that this will be done soon.Language map of Pakistan — Preceding unsigned comment added by 182.186.118.43 (talk) 10:21, 4 November 2012 (UTC) Saraiki must be shown in map.10:37, 16 November 2013 (UTC)182.186.6.80 (talk)


It is confirm that Saraiki is a language. Also Jhangvi dialect is dialect of Saraiki. This article is redundant with the Riasti dialect, Shah puri dialect, Multani dialect, Multani language, Thalochi dialect, Thalochi ,Derawali dialect articles. I suggest merging these articles , as the all these are same. And also be Redirected to Saraiki language. Kindly See these External Links

Department of Saraiki, Islamia University, Bahawalpur was established in 1989[1] and Department of Saraiki, Bahauddin Zakariya University, Multan[2] was established in 2006. Saraiki is taught as subject in schools and colleges at higher secondary, intermediate and degree level. Allama Iqbal open university Islamabad,[3] and Al-Khair university Bhimbir have their Pakistani Linguistics Departments. They are offering M.Phil. and Ph.D in Saraiki. Five T V channels and Ten Radio Stations are Serving Saraiki language.182.186.4.140 (talk) 15:14, 17 November 2013 (UTC)182.186.99.164 (talk) 02:44, 24 November 2013 (UTC)182.186.80.221 (talk) 15:38, 27 November 2013 (UTC)

Dialects[edit]

This article is an overview of the languages of Pakistan. We don't need to list every dialect of every language and every city in which every dialect is spoken. That's what the links to the articles are for. Please read WP:content fork. — kwami (talk) 06:11, 14 January 2013 (UTC)

Problem with User:Robinuthapa[edit]

What is going on here? Robinuthapa is continuously adding information which I do not think is suitable. Please see the page history. I want to get the opinions of others.

—Syɛd Шαмiq Aнмɛd Hαsнмi (тαlк) 18:41, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

A biased and incorrect Map of Langauges of Kyhber Pukhtunkhwa[edit]

Map being used in various articles pertaining to languages of Khyber Pukhtunkhwa is incorrect and biased. It is showing tank as Seraiki speaking which is incorrect as majority of people in Tank speak Pashto. It is showing Karak as Hindko speaking while we know that almost 99% of the population of Karak is Pashto speaking Khattak. It is showing battagram as hindko speaking while we all know that most of the people in Battagram speak Pashto. Similarly, it is showing Shangla as hindko speaking, which is incorrect as most of the people their also speak Pashto. Finally, it is showing Toorghar district as Hindko speaking while we know most of the people their also speak Pashto. I think all this show biasness or incompetence on the part of the person who included that Map. Furthermore, it should also be noted that the map fails to show that most of the people on western side of Mansehra and Haripur speak Pashto, while most on western side of D.I.Khan also speak Pashto. I feel that the Map has grossly exaggerated the number of speakers of other languages. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tigerkhan007 (talkcontribs) 17:08, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Provincial Languages[edit]

  • Province Punjab = Punjabi
  • Province Sindh = Sindhi
  • Province Balochistan = Balochi
  • Province Pakhtunkhwa = Pakhto

Is there any further need to justify why the are called Provincial languages. Macedonish (talk) 04:24, 18 November 2013 (UTC)

    • According to text book published by Punjab text book board Lahore all the languages are regional languages. so these be written regional languages.182.186.101.221 (talk) 15:46, 21 November 2013 (UTC)

In province of Punjab majority language is Punjabi approx 76%.[4] In province of KPK majority language is Pashto approx 74%.[5] In province of Sindh majority language is Sindhi (approx 59%).[6] In province of Balochistan majority language is Balochi (approx 59%).[7] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 39.32.251.122 (talk) 15:52, 26 November 2013 (UTC)

IS ANY BODY READY TO USE TALK PAGE AND DEVOLP CONCENSUS ? I DONT THINK SO 39.32.102.184 (talk) 17:47, 27 November 2013 (UTC)

Exaggerations Reverted[edit]

Pashto[edit]

Pashtun communities in the cities of Karachi, Islamabad, Rawalpindi and Lahore. Karachi is one of the biggest Pashto speaking city in the world although the Pashto speakers constitute only about 25% of the city's population. but as per census it is 11.5 % 39.32.251.122 (talk) 15:47, 26 November 2013 (UTC)

Sindhi[edit]

Sindhi is spoken as a first language by 15.5% of Pakistanis, mostly in Sindh, parts of Balochistan, Southern Punjab and Balochistan. while as per census it is 13 % and spoken in Sindh only

IS ANY BODY READY TO USE TALK PAGE AND DEVOLP CONCENSUS ? I DONT THINK SO 39.32.102.184 (talk) 17:48, 27 November 2013 (UTC)

Instead of edit warring and shouting here, you should log in from your primary account (.i.e. LanguageXpert (talk · contribs)) and file an unblock request. -- SMS Talk 18:47, 27 November 2013 (UTC)
Smsarmad First i am not shouting and I dont see wikipedia as sock hide and seek game so not interested in your sock hunter attitude. Wikipedia provides information to the people around the world so our objective is present correct information. So if you have solid arguments and reliable sources then you are justified to revert my edits. Coming to the point. Lahore one of the oldest city in the indo pak and capital of Pakistan 56 % Population Province Punjab has a population around 9 Million accumulated over the centuries. Then how Pashtun accumulated by magic to 7 million in Karachi in last 30 years. Even a child can understand such baseless and childish claims. As as per census it is 11.5 % of Karachi and third not the second biggest language of Karachi. So there is no need to revert my edits on Karachi article and in this article. Similarly Quetta is a multi ethnic city comprising of Pashtun Balochi Barahvi Punjabi Hazara etc people but you reverted it with edit that pashto is language of majority in quetta but my dear census figures clearly show that quetta is a multi ethnic city. Similarly Sindhi as per census it is 13 % not 15.5 %. Please also refer above section to my arguments to Provincial Language. Let us behave like User KWAMIKAGAMI who is very good professional.39.32.102.184 (talk) 15:42, 28 November 2013 (UTC)
Writing in All Caps while in a discussion at internet is considered as "Shouting". If you "dont see Wikipedia as sock hide and seek game" then may I ask you why have you been creating all these socks? Your behavior doesn't suggest that you consider Wikipedia an encyclopedia, neither you seem to be here building it or are willing to follow the rules here. Though I have no side to take in this content dispute but how one can expect any positive outcome of a discussion with someone who has a POV to further and doesn't follow the Wikipedia's policies. That is why I suggested you to start following rules and ask for an unblock instead of Block evasion. -- SMS Talk 17:53, 28 November 2013 (UTC)
You can not presume that I am negative. No human is perfect so like any human me and you can be positive or negative depending on circumstances so do not make wrong presumptions and stop being Personal on Wikipedia. More mature attitude is to focus on which content is correct or incorrect on wikipedia articles based on reliable sources. so that we conserve our energies towards common goal of true and fair view. So keeping in view this section and above section make the amendments in the article if you do not have any confusion about them. 39.32.90.69 (talk) 16:34, 30 November 2013 (UTC)


Sindhi language[edit]

Please explain as to how the Sindhi language has been sectioned into 'Urban and Rural' in Sindh province (without citation either)? Where is the source to estimate number of speakers of 'Urdu & Sindhi' languages? Please remove this bias 'statistics' without citations. SarfarazLarkanian 11:34, 12 March 2015 (UTC)

Writing Systems image is incorrectly identified as Sindhi[edit]

In the writing seection, there is an image captioned "The earliest Sindhi manuscripts written during the Abbasid Era". This is incorrect. The language is Arabic and that same image has been used in articles on Arabic script. I suggest the image be removed. --Zohair Ahmad (talk) 04:19, 25 August 2014 (UTC)

  1. ^ http://www.iub.edu.pk/department.php?id=26
  2. ^ http://www.bzu.edu.pk/departmentindex.php?id=33
  3. ^ Cite error: The named reference aiou.edu.pk was invoked but never defined (see the help page).
  4. ^ http://www.census.gov.pk/MotherTongue.htm
  5. ^ http://www.census.gov.pk/MotherTongue.htm
  6. ^ http://www.census.gov.pk/MotherTongue.htm
  7. ^ http://www.census.gov.pk/MotherTongue.htm