Talk:Largest prehistoric animals

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Articles for deletion This page was nominated for deletion on 6 November 2009. The result of the discussion was keep.

I think the largest gastropod ever is the [Campanile giganteum]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Campanile_giganteum

The largest gastropod ever is not Placostylus. It was link Campanile giganteum

Contents

[edit] Giant Short-Faced Bear 10ft at the shoulder?!

The Giant Short-Faced Bear did NOT stand 10ft at the shoulder. Someone must have confused the bear's shoulder height with its standing height. According to its very own wikipedia article the largest males would have been a maximum 5ft. 3in. (Although, even this is dubious considering the lack of citations for the article.) Anyway, at least for the meantime I'm going change the height to the far more realistic 5ft. 3in. at the shoulder.

- Oops, I forgot to sign... Gilly of III (talk) 15:42, 4 October 2009 (UTC)

Gah!!! I just read through more of the article and its full of mistakes and misinformation. Also, I just found out that the Giant Short-Faced Bear wasn't even the largest carnivore ever (Read "the largest carnivore extinct (and living)")in the first place, (at least of extant species) that would be the Elephant Seal. - How disheartening. I'm currently unsure as to which animal was the largest prehistoric carnivore. Anyway, whoever wrote this article needed to do more research. This entire article needs a massive cleanup in my opinion. Gilly of III (talk) 16:02, 4 October 2009 (UTC)

I wrote the article (or most of it anyhow) and I'm no expert on paleontology, so that's why I put the Cleanup tag on the article. If you find something wrong like that, go ahead and fix it. --The High Fin Sperm Whale (talk) 01:33, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Do we need this page?

A lot of it is just wrong - for example, it says the largest extinct whale was basilosaurus, but obviously some recently extinct baleen whales are going to be a whole lot bigger than basilosaurus was - this kind of thing will apply to any category where the biggest are extant; in other words, it really isn't interesting to make a list of the largest animals that are not extant. I think all the interesting information from this page is on or should be on Largest organisms. ErikHaugen (talk) 22:04, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

I've proposed it for deletion; please discuss here: Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Largest_prehistoric_organisms ErikHaugen (talk) 22:34, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Prehistoric organisms entries from Largest organisms

[edit] Mammals

  • Monotremes
The largest monotreme (egg-bearing mammal) ever was the extinct echidna species Zaglossus hacketti, known only from a few bones found in Western Australia. It was the size of a sheep, weighing probably up to 100 kg (220 lb). (note species placement uncertain due to lack of cranial material)
  • Marsupials
The largest belonged to the genus Diprotodon. These rhino-sized herbivores would have easily exceed 2 tonnes (4,400 lb), 3.3 m (11 ft) in length and 1.83 m (6 ft) in height.
The largest ever carnivorous marsupial to exist would have been the Marsupial Lion and the Saber-toothed Marsupial both ranging from 5 ft (1.5 m) to 6 ft (1.8 m) long and weighing between 100 kg to 160 kg.
  • Afroinsectiphilia
no entry
  • Artiodactyla
no entry
  • Carnivora
The extinct Giant Short-Faced Bear (Arctodus simus) may be the largest land carnivore in the order (as well as the largest bear) with an estimated average weight of 600-800 kg (1,320-1,760 lbs)[1].
Even larger were the extinct American Lion (Panthera leo atrox) and the Smilodon populator, a saber-toothed cat.
The largest member of canidae ever is the extinct member of Borophaginae, Epicyon, which has had two different measurements-one at 101 kilos (224 lbs), and one at 85 kilos (188 lbs).
  • Cetacea
no entry
  • Chiroptera
no entry
  • Cingulata
Much larger prehistoric examples are known, especially Glyptodon, which easily topped 2.7 m (9 ft) and 2 tonnes (4,400 lb).
  • Dermoptera
no entry
  • Erinaceomorpha & Soricomorpha
no entry
  • Hyracoidea
no entry
  • Lagomorpha
no entry
  • Perissodactyla
The largest land mammal ever was Paraceratherium or Indricotherium (formerly known as the Baluchitherium), a member of this order. It stood up to 5.5 m (18 ft) tall, measured over 9 m (30 ft) long and may have weighed up to 20 tonnes (22 tons) though mass estimates vary widely.
  • Pholiodata
no entry
  • Pilosa
The sloths attained much larger sizes prehistorically, the largest of which were Megatherium which, at an estimated average weight of 4.5 tonnes (5 tons) and height of 5.1 m (17 ft), was about the same size as the African Bush Elephant.
  • Primates
Gigantopithecus is the largest known primate ever, probably averaged 3 m (10 ft) tall and weighing 300 to 550 kg (700 to 1,200 lb). It lived from around five million years ago to about 300,000 years ago in the region of India and China.
  • Proboscidea
Most extinct species in the order Proboscidea, such as mammoths and mastodons, did not dwarf the modern African Bush Elephant. The Imperial Mammoth, standing up to 5 m (16 ft) tall, and Deinotherium, which may have surpassed 14 tonnes (15.4 tons) are generally considered the largest species. However, recent evidence shows that the largest mammoth ever was the Songhua River Mammoth[citation needed] of China. Mammuthus trogontherii and Deinotherium were also enormous, rivaling the Songhua River Mammoth in size.
  • Rodentia
The largest known rodent ever is Josephoartigasia monesi, an extinct species known only from fossils. It was approximately 3 metres (10 ft) long and 1.5 metres (5 ft) tall, and is estimated to have weighed around 1 tonne.[2] Prior to the description of J. monesi, the largest known rodent species was Phoberomys insolita. However, this species is known only from very incomplete remains and so its size cannot be estimated with any precision. An almost complete skeleton of its slightly smaller Late Miocene relative Phoberomys pattersoni was discovered in Venezuela in 2000; it was 3 m (10 ft) long, with an additional 1.5 m (5 ft) tail, and probably weighed around 700 kg (1,540 lb).
  • Scandentia
no entry
  • Sirenia
no entry (Hydrodamalis gigas being a modern extinction caused by humans dos not qualify as a prehistoric organism)

[edit] Reptilia

  • Squamata
The largest-ever member of the order was probably one of the giant mosasaurs, such as Hainosaurus, Mosasaurus, or Tylosaurus, all of which grew to around 15 m (50 ft). Some prehistoric snakes such as Gigantophis and Madtsoia are thought to have been as big as or bigger than anacondas and pythons, but the fossil remains are too incomplete for accurate determination of the size of the complete snake. They may be superseded by the 2009 discovery of the Titanoboa, a snake that scientists believe can grow to a length of 13m (42 ft) on average. The prehistoric Megalania prisca (or Varanus priscus) is the largest terrestrial squamate known, but the lack of a complete skeleton has resulted in a wide range of size estimates. Molnar's 2004 assessment resulted in an average weight of 320 kilograms (710 lb), and a maximum of 1,940 kilograms (4,300 lb) at 7 metres (23 ft) in length, which is toward the high end of the early estimates.[3]
  • Plesiosauria
The largest known plesiosaur was Mauisaurus haasti, growing to around 20 metres in length.
  • Ichthyosauria
The largest of these marine reptiles (extinct for 90 million years) was the species Shonisaurus sikanniensis, at approximately 21 m (70 ft) long.
  • Sphenodontia
no entry
  • Testudines
(Aquatic) There are many extinct turtles that vie for the title of the largest ever. The largest seems to be Archelon ischyros, which reached a length of 4.84 m (16 ft) across the flippers and a weight of 2,200 kg (4,500 lb).
(Terrestrial)A much larger tortoise survived until about 2000 years ago, Meiolania at about 2.5 m (8.4 ft) long and well over a ton.
  • Pterosauria
A dinosaur-era reptile (although not technically a dinosaur) is believed to have been the largest flying animal that ever existed: the pterosaur Quetzalcoatlus northropi. The maximum size of this soaring giant was believed to have been about 127 kg (280 lb) and 12 m (40 ft) across the wings.[4] Another possible contender for the largest pterosaur is Hatzegopteryx, which is also estimated to have had a 12 m wingspan.[5]
  • Dinosauria
See also: dinosaur size
Now extinct, except for theropod descendants, the Aves.
Scale diagram comparing a human and the largest known dinosaurs of the four suborders.
Size comparison of selected giant sauropod dinosaurs. Sauroposeidon (blue), Argentinosaurus (violet), and Amphicoelias fragillimus (red) size estimates are based on fragmentary fossil evidence.
All of the largest dinosaurs, and the largest animals to ever live on land, were the plant-eating Sauropoda. The tallest and heaviest sauropod known from a complete skeleton is the Giraffatitan which was discovered in Tanzania between 1907 and 1912, and is now mounted in the Humboldt Museum of Berlin. It is 12 m (38 ft) tall, and probably weighed between 30,000 – 60,000 kg (30 – 65 tons). The longest is the 25 m (82 ft) long Diplodocus which was discovered in Wyoming, and mounted in Pittsburgh's Carnegie Natural History Museum in 1907.
There were larger sauropods, but they are known from only a few bones. The current record-holders were all discovered since 1970, and include the massive Argentinosaurus, which may have weighed 80,000 – 100,000 kg (90 to 110 tons); the longest, the 35 m (112 ft) long Supersaurus; and the tallest, the 18 m (60 ft) Sauroposeidon, which could have reached into a 6th-floor window. Diplodocus hallorum (formerly known as Seismosaurus) was once thought to have been about 50 m (170 ft) long, making it the longest known vertebrate, but later reconstructions estimate the length at 35 m (115 ft).
Less well described finds may exceed this. Bruhathkayosaurus may have approached the weight of a Blue Whale, and Amphicoelias fragillimus would have been longer still, at an estimated 60m (200 ft), but considerably lighter. However, Bruhathkayosaurus is based on very poor material, and the only fossil of Amphicoelias was lost.
Size comparison of selected giant theropod dinosaurs
  • Theropods (Theropoda)

The longest and heaviest theropod is estimated to be the Spinosaurus, at 15 to 17.4 metres (49.2 to 57.1 ft) in length and a weight of up to 9 tons.[6] This is significantly more massive than other contenders such as the Giganotosaurus and Tyrannosaurus. Spinosaurus is notable for having been the largest terrestrial predator known to exist.

The longest and heaviest theropod known from a complete skeleton is the Tyrannosaurus specimen nicknamed "Sue", which was discovered in South Dakota in 1990 and is now mounted in the Field Museum of Chicago. It is 12.2 m (40 ft) long, and probably weighed 6,800 kg (6.8 tons).

The largest Cerapods were the hadrosaurids Zhuchengosaurus and Lambeosaurus laticaudus. Both species are known from fragmentary remains but are estimated to have reached over 15 m (50 ft) in length[7][8] and weighed over 23 tonnes (50,700 lb).[8]

  • Ceratopsians

The largest Ceratopsian was Triceratops. Triceratops is estimated to have reached about 8 m (26 ft) in length[9] and weighed 6.1 tonnes (13,400 lb).[10] The recently discovered Eotriceratops had a skull estimated to be longer than 3 m, and may have been larger than Triceratops.[11]

[edit] Aves

Moas, eleaphant birds and mihirungs don't qualify as they went extinct from human activity.
The largest carnivorous bird was the phorusrhacid Brontornis, an extinct flightless bird from South America which reached a weight of 350 to 400 kg (770 to 880 lb) and a height of about 2.8 m (9.2 ft).
The largest bird ever capable of flight was Argentavis magnificens, a now extinct member of the Teratornithidae group, with a wingspan of up to 8.3 m (28 ft), a length of over 3 m (10 ft) and a body weight of 80 kg (176 lb.).
  • Anseriformes
Dromornithidae (possibly)
  • Apodiformes
no entry
  • Caprimulgiformes
no entry
  • Charadriiformes
no entry (Great auk a human caused extinction so not included here)
  • Ciconiiformes
Most of the largest flying birds in the fossil record, including the largest, Argentavis magnificens, were members of the Ciconiiformes.
  • Coliiformes
no entry
  • Columbiformes
no entry (Dodo human extinction not included)
  • Coraciiformes
no entry
  • Cuculiformes
no entry
  • Falconiformes
no entry (Harpagornis moorei not included human caused extinction)
  • Galliformes
A prehistoric, flightless family, sometimes called (incorrectly) "giant megapodes" (Sylviornis) were the biggest galliformes ever, having reached 1.70 m (5.6 ft) long and weighed up to about 30 kg (66 lb).
  • Gaviiformes
no entry
  • Gruiformes
The largest ever gruiform was a species of "terror bird", highly predatory, flightless birds of South America: Brontornis burmeisteri. This species stood about 2.8 m (9.2 ft) and weigh up to about 400 kg (880 lb).
  • Passeriformes
no entry
  • Pelecaniformes
A pelecaniform of the late Miocene, Osteodontornis, was among the largest flying birds ever, at up to 2.1 m (7 ft) long with a wingspan of 6 m (20 ft).
  • Phoenicopteriformes
no entry
  • Piciformes
no entry
  • Podicepiformes
no entry
  • Procellariiformes
The largest-ever tubenose (though it is sometimes classified in the order Pelecaniformes) was the albatross-like Gigantornis eaglesomei, with a wingspan of about 6 m (20 ft).[12]
  • Psittaciformes
no entry
  • Pterocliformes
no entry
  • Sphenisciformes
At one time, possibly competing with the mammalian pinnipeds, a number of giant penguins existed. The largest is believed to be Anthropornis nordenskjoeldi, having reached a height of nearly 2 m (6.7 ft) and a weigh of up to 135 kg (300 lb).
  • Strigiformes
The largest owl known to have existed was Ornimegalonyx oteroi of Cuba, having measured over 1 m (3.3 ft) tall.
  • Tinamiformes
no entry
  • Trogoniformes
no entry

[edit] Amphibia

Before amniotes became the dominant tetrapods, several giant amphibian-like tetrapods existed. The largest known was the crocodile-like Prionosuchus, which reached a length of 9 m (30 ft).
  • Anura
However, the extinct Beelzebufo ampinga could grow to be 40 cm (16 in) long and weigh up to 4.5 kg (10 lb).
  • Caudata
no entry
  • Gymnophiana
no entry

[edit] Actinopterygii

Much larger bony fish existed prehistorically, the largest ever known having been Leedsichthys, of the Jurassic period. Estimates of the size of this fish range from 13.5 m (45 ft) to 30 m (100 ft), but a maximum size of 22 m (72 ft) seems most realistic.
  • Acipenseriformes
no entry

Anguilliformes

no entry
  • Atheriniformes
no entry
  • Aulopiformes
no entry
  • Batrachoidiformes
no entry
  • Beloniformes
no entry
  • Beryciformes
no entry
  • Characiformes
no entry
  • Clupeiformes
no entry
  • Cypriniformes
no entry
  • Cyprinodontiformes
no entry
  • Gadiformes
no entry
  • Gonorynchiformes
no entry
  • Lampriformes
no entry
  • Lepisosteiformes
no entry
  • Lophiiformes
no entry
  • Myctophiformes
no entry
  • Ophidiiformes
no entry
  • Osteoglossiformes
no entry
  • Perciformes
no entry
  • Pleuronectiformes
no entry
  • Salmoniformes
no entry
  • Scorpaeniformes
no entry
  • Siluriformes
no entry
  • Stomiiformes
no entry
  • Syngnathiformes
no entry
  • Zeiformes
no entry

[edit] Chondrichthyes

  • Carcharhiniformes
no entry
  • Lamniformes
An even larger lamnid, generally regarded as the largest predatory fish ever, is the Megalodon, Carcharodon megalodon, an ancient relative of the great white shark. It probably reached 18.2 m (60 ft) and weighed over 63 tonnes (70 short tons).
  • Myliobatiformes
no entry
  • Pristiniformes
no entry
  • Rajiformes
no entry
  • Squaliformes
no entry
  • Squatiniformes
no entry


As shown above there is little overlap in the material that is covered by the articles Largest organisms and Largest prehistoric organisms. The only entry for fish is mention of Carcharodon megalodon with no coverage of extinct groups! Here is what [organisms without prehistoric taxa] looks like. Largest prehistoric organisms has a wider range of coverage that largaest organisms, including completely extinct hight taxa such as trilobites, and including invertebrates which largest organisms does not cover at all. Neather goes into depth on Plants and so neather actually fully fills the oraganism part of the name. I have removed the entries from LPO that are not in the scope of the article, namely recent extinctions caused by man (Dodo etc...). There are a couple of enties from LO that are beter referecned and should be integrated into LPO. The easy way to handle these to articles is to remove the prehistoric entries from largest organisms and have links to the related sections in each article. In other words "see also:largest extinct mammals" and "see also:largest living mammals" links in the heading of each mammal section along with a short segment of prose explaining the overall biggest member the group ever. This also shows that there is a large amount of informatio that shuld be researched and included into the LPO article for many groups what are no covered at all.--Kevmin (talk) 21:35, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

This all sounds like a compelling case for merging the two articles. It can be divided by taxonomic categories if the result is too large. If you go ahead with your plan, though, please rename Largest organisms - right now it is about the largest organisms and you're proposing that it no longer be about the largest organisms. ErikHaugen (talk) 17:29, 9 November 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Fossil whales

This is an explanation for my edit today regarding the giant Pliocene rorqual. The cited source Deméré 2005 says of Balaenoptera sibbaldina that "its recognition as a valid taxon is suspect" because there's no type specimen. The material clearly indicates a blue-whale sized animal, though, so it warrants inclusion here even if the name is doubtful.Cephal-odd (talk) 17:00, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

[edit] December 6th, 2011 changes

I made some changes to the Dinosauria section, all of which I'll summarize bellow.
Sauropoda: Removed mention of Bruhathkayosaurus as there are no actual published size estimates and there's uncertainty as if it even was a dinosaur; Added Futalognkosaurus and Puertasaurus.
Therapoda: Removed this line "There is some controversy upon determining the largest theropod that ever existed due to preservational bias of fossils." as is a inherent problem of all taxa known from only fossil material and its inclusion exclusively on the Therapoda section is unnecessary; removed Deinocheirus as recent estimates from Gregoy Pauls puts it at 10m and only 2tonnes /Paul, G.S., 2010, The Princeton Field Guide to Dinosaurs, Princeton University Press p. 112/ as well as Utahraptor as is not in the intend of the section to show the biggest member of every branch or family within Therapoda but the largest overall.
Cerapotsia: Removed mention of the old estimate of Eotriceratops, it now has the more recent estimate of 9m. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mike.BRZ (talk • contribs) 04:38, 7 December 2011 (UTC)


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