Talk:Marylebone station

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Platforms[edit]

Is it me, or does the station only have four platforms? Sure it did last week... I have no idea when they shut the two, but i think they are planning to reopen them. Harris 23:45, 14 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Stations[edit]

I fail to see why what should be separate articles on the tube and the overground railways are merged into a single WP article here; they have different histories, different owners, etc. Cross-linked, certainly, but should be separate; for a start the route box is for one only! --Vamp:Willow 11:22, 28 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Firstly, for reasons of consistency with the other London terminal stations. Of these all but Charing Cross and the Kings Cross/St Pancras complex have merged station articles, as do most non-terminal joint stations. Both the two exceptions are, I suspect, because the relationship between the LUL and NR stations is not 1:1; Kings Cross and St Pancras NR stations share one LUL station, and the author of the Charing Cross article thinks Charing Cross NR station links to two LUL stations (Charing Cross and Embankment) although I'm not totally convinced by that.
Secondly, because Marylebone is a single building. The LUL platforms are accessed via exactly the same concourse as the Chiltern Trains platforms; the two ticket offices must be all of 20 feet apart.
Thirdly, it seems perverse to have a merged article for Waterloo, with four distinct station sections (Mainline, East, International and Underground), and two seperate little articles for tiny Marylebone. Two different histories can easily be accomodated in one article; and frankly how much history is there to the Bakerloo line platforms at Marylebone.
Fourthly, there is no reason why the route box cannot cater for the whole station. This is already commonplace at LUL stations served by more than one line. OwenBlacker (and possibly others) has started creating route boxes for London NR stations; see Farringdon station for an example of a LUL/NR station with a route box covering both sets of services. I imagine this will eventually roll out across all London NR stations.
--Chris j wood 19:55, 28 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Location[edit]

Is Marylebone station located in Marylebone or Lisson Grove? Simply south 19:48, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Location[edit]

Can people help develop the location portion of the article similar to that in the page for Paddington, maybe mentioning Lord's, Regents Park and Madame Tussads? Ironman1503 9 August 2008, 11.16 (UTC)

Not sure about this[edit]

"Chiltern trains made the station the terminus for a new intercity service to Birmingham's Snow Hill station" - as mentioned by several people on uk.railway today, Marylebone-Snow Hill through services were running before privatisation: 1993 seems to be the start date. Not as frequent as today, to be sure, but they were there. 81.159.57.7 (talk) 17:56, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

Regions[edit]

"Long-distance trains from Marylebone began to be scaled back from 1958 after the line's transfer from BR's Eastern Region to the London Midland Region". I have a problem here. It is true that at Nationalisation, Marylebone, being an ex-LNER station, was placed in the Eastern Region. It's also true that in 1958 it was transferred to the London Midland Region. My problem is that the text suggests that this was a direct transfer; however, according to two sources, it was WR-LMR:

  • Cooke, B.W.C., ed. (March 1958). "Notes and News: B.R. Regional Boundaries Adjustments". The Railway Magazine (Westminster: Tothill Press) 104 (683): 210–1. "Further adjustment of the boundaries between the Regions of British Railways came into effect on February 1. In the London area, the Western Region has relinquished to the London Midland Region the former Great Central main line from Marylebone to Northolt Junction, and Neasden to Harrow South" 
  • Bonavia, Michael R. (1981). British Rail: The First 25 Years. Newton Abbot: David & Charles. p. 57. ISBN 0 7153 8002 8. "Marylebone station was first designated Eastern Region and fitted with blue Regional signs; then it was transferred to the Western Region, and completely re-signed in chocolate, and finally transferred to the London Midland, and re-signed in red!" 

Bonavia uses the word "finally" because he was writing before the transfer from LMR back to WR on 11 October 1987.

Thus, what we lack is the ER-WR transfer, which must have happened before 1958. --Redrose64 (talk) 14:22, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

I had no idea it was ever part of the WR. Mac Hawkins in "The Great Central then and now" makes no mention of it: he just says "Following nationalisation and the subsequent transfer of the system in 1958 to the London Midland Region ...." (p.10), which seems to imply that he thought it went straight from ER to LMR. But Hawkins is not everywhere entirely free of errors, and your Railway Magazine quote seems likely to be reliable. On the other hand, Eastern Region of British Railways says "In a major national boundary change in 1958 the former Great Central network except those lines in Yorkshire and Lincolnshire transferred to the London Midland Region ...", an assertion for which however it cites no source, indeed that article entirely lacks sources. Western Region of British Railways doesn't say anything about Marylebone or the Great Central, but then it doesn't say a great deal about anything. I wonder if the WR phase was only fleeting. Perhaps the answer is to be found elsewhere in your large pile of magazines! A way of checking might be to look in an issue of, say, 1957 and see which section of the regional news columns contains information about Marylebone services, and work back or forward from there. Alarics (talk) 16:39, 24 June 2010 (UTC)
The Jan 1958 issue (p. 13) states "Some adjustment of these regional boundaries were made almost at once [1948] ... rather more extensive changes were made in 1950, and what are expected to be the final adjustments are now in progress". So, I've pulled out the 1950 issues, after that I'll try late 1949. Failing that, 1951 onwards. --Redrose64 (talk) 16:55, 24 June 2010 (UTC)
Got it, and it's pretty detailed.
  • "Revision of Regional Boundaries of British Railways". The Railway Magazine (Westminster: Tothill Press) 96 (587): 201–4. March 1950. 
Omitting the bulk of the list, we have:
The Railway Executive, with the concurrence of the B.T.C., is making certain adjustments to the boundaries of the six Regions of British Railways. These adjustments, which come into operation on April 2, are being made with the object of simplifying supervision, reducing administration costs, and avoiding duplication.
  • Eastern Region to London Midland Region
    • The former Great Central line: Quainton Road (exclusive) and Ashendon Junction (exclusive) to Heath (Derbyshire) (exclusive)
    • Hazlehead Bridge to Manchester London Road, and to Manchester Central via Fairfield Junction and Levenshulme South
    • Metropolitan and Great Central line: Rickmansworth (inclusive) to Quainton Road and Verney Junction
  • Eastern Region to London Transport Executive
    • Metropolitan and Great Central line: Harrow to Rickmansworth (exclusive) and Watford
  • Eastern Region to Western Region
    • Marylebone to Northolt Junction
    • Neasden to Harrow (exclusive)
A map on pp. 202-3 shows that the regional boundaries seem to have been drawn in such a way as to avoid the lines of one Region crossing those of another, except, curiously, in the Birmingham/Wolverhampton area. It then states:
The existing operating arrangements for trains and traffic working will be preserved, including the existing operating and motive power districts, divisions and regions. ... Former L.N.E.R. (G.C.) line from London, Marylebone to Manchester, London road, will continue to be operated throughout by the Eastern Region, although the line in part will come within the revised boundaries of the Western, London Midland and Eastern Regions.
This means, that between April 1950 and January 1958, a train from Marylebone to Manchester (via Aylesbury) started off in the Western Region, changed to London Transport at Harrow, to the LMR at Rickmansworth, to the ER at Heath, and back to the LMR at Hazlehead Bridge, but was operated by the ER. --Redrose64 (talk) 17:56, 24 June 2010 (UTC)
More details on the 1958 Regional boundary changes, including a map, in the April 1958 issue (pp. 233-6) where the new WR/LMR boundary point is noted as "Northolt East Junction down distant signal". --Redrose64 (talk) 13:47, 11 July 2010 (UTC)

Well done. I've recast the relevant bit of the article accordingly, but you may like to tinker further. Actually I think a fair bit needs doing to this article and I will come back to it in due course. Alarics (talk) 19:42, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

Pronunciation[edit]

The pronunciation from what I've seen on the internet is disputable... here it's pronounced "Mar-li-bone", but certain internet forums, and my pronunciation suggests it should be "Marry-le-bone". Can this be added to the pronunciation key as and when anyone can research this in detail? Richard n 22:43, 3 August 2012 (UTC)

I'm fairly sure that "Mar-li-bone" is the correct traditional pronunciation (certainly it is what I have grown up with), though I have heard "Marry-le-bone" more frequently in recent years, which I assumed was due to people mispronouncing it based on its spelling. I guess we need to find some reliable sources for the pronunciation. BabelStone (talk) 22:56, 3 August 2012 (UTC)
Remember, it is an area of London (and the name of a main road), not just a railway station. People who live or work there have traditionally tended to pronounce it "Marlybun", in my experience, but people from elsewhere tend not to know this, and pronounce it more like it is written. In a case like this, I do not really think you can say that there is only one "correct" pronunciation. -- Alarics (talk) 06:30, 4 August 2012 (UTC)
Couldn't both be added? Simply south...... cooking letters for just 7 years 20:30, 25 September 2013 (UTC)