Talk:Meiji period

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Miscellaneous[edit]

Resolved: Confusion cleaned up, with source.

The sentence, "When finally granted by the emperor as a sign of his sharing his authority and giving rights and liberties to his subjects, the 1889 Constitution of the Empire of Japan (the Meiji Constitution) provided for the Imperial Diet (Teikoku Gikai), composed of a popularly elected House of Representatives with a very limited franchise of male citizens who paid 15 in national taxes, about 1 percent of the population, and the House of Peers, composed of nobility and imperial appointees; and a cabinet responsible to the emperor and independent of the legislature," is confusing because "15" is unclear. Fifteen percent? Why is this only one percent of the population?

I agree with whoever wrote the above that there seems to be at least one word missing. Should it be "15 yen" or "at least 15 yen" perhaps? --Historian 09:16, Dec 2, 2004 (UTC)
I have found the source of this quotation on the web here. It does indeed say "¥15" as I thought. I propose that the word "yen" be added to the text. --Historian 05:57, Dec 3, 2004 (UTC)
And here is the clincher. The Japanese version of wikipedia talks about 15 yen.

See here (in Japanese). So I am going to change the main text and remove the dispute tag. --Historian 10:49, Dec 3, 2004 (UTC)

Era vs period[edit]

Resolved: Article stable at new name for almost 8 years.

I moved the article from Meiji Era to Meiji period, and changed the article accordingly. I don't know which is more correct, but the other periods are called periods on wikipedia and google shows "Meiji period" in slightly wider usage than "era". ~leifHELO 01:03, Dec 30, 2004 (UTC)

Politics or ideology?[edit]

I'm by no means an expert on Japanese history, but from my reading I find this account a bit uncritical of the actions of the oligarch-politicians of the Meiji era. For example I would argue that to properly deal with the movement for a representative assembly, or the minken popular rights movement, you'd have to deal with how far and for whom 'popular rights' was mainly ploy for achieving political power rather than disinterested idealism. For example, many were easily bought off and coopted into government. The minken movement was temporarily abandoned in April 1874 when these outsiders were extended a carrot of participation.

It should also be made clear that when mainstream Japanese political thinkers at this time talked about giving representation to 'the people', while they might have meant to imply an organic nature and a national destiny in a similar way to the European nationalist tradition, they were politically referring to the shizoku, the noble estate. They often criticised the 'common people' for their ignorance and moral character.

I'd recomend P.Varley, Japanese Culture (New York, 1984)

H.Wray and H.Conroy (eds.), Japan Examined: Perspectives on Modern Japanese History (Honolulu, 1983( --Rich Shore 14:10, 8 Mar 2005 (UTC)

This complaint is now over 7 years old. Has this issue been satisfactorily resolved? — SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ɖ∘¿¤þ   Contrib. 10:46, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

Pictures needed[edit]

Resolved: Article has 5 illustrations, as of 2012-10-23.

As in subject. Can we have some? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 22:42, 16 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Rewrite[edit]

Unresolved: The "Society" section remains a section-stub after 7 years with almost no information on arts & humanities topics.

I tried to add some structure to the text. It looks like we have a lot of information on the founding of government, and fewer to zero information on the rest. Society can barely be called a stub. Art, literature, religion is nonexistant. Foreign relations completely lacks but at least there is a seperate article about it. The Meiji Restoration needs its own section. -- Mkill 17:41, 29 October 2005 (UTC)


In reference to the foreign relations section, I would like to request that somebody put in how the Japanese reacted and responsed to Christianity in this era. Since Christianity had a strong voice in western powers at this time, it should be included in foreign relations or even have it's own section. However i don't know if it's even mentioned in this article.

Era beginning[edit]

Resolved: Clarified as 1868.

Did the era begin in 1867, or 1868? This article contradicts itself. Brutannica 23:41, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Requested move[edit]

Resolved: Article stable at "period" name for almost 8 years; no consensus to revert to "era".
The following is a closed discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the debate was no consensus. Patstuarttalk|edits 04:17, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

  • Meiji periodMeiji era —(Discuss)— A Japanese era (年号 nengō) is a way to announce dates in Japan. A period (時代 jidai) is a long period of time (more than one hundred years long) like, for example, what we call "Middle Age" or "Renaissance" in Europe. Meiji is an era, coinciding with the reign of Emperor Meiji, not a period. —Švitrigaila 16:33, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Survey[edit]

Discussion[edit]

Add any additional comments:
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

After the vote...[edit]

Excuse me to answer so late. The vote is now closed and it's to late to react, but I must. I strongly supported the move. Meiji is an era (nengō) by definition. And incidentally, it can be considered a period (jidai) too, but only incidentally. ... Švitrigaila 12:58, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

Agreed. we've already wasted enough time on this, and there is even a vote on the subject that has concluded. You have said a lot about the concept of periods in general but nothing at all about the practice in question. Although the term Meiji era exists, and is used in some contexts, when historians divide Japanese into periods the overwhelming convention is to use "Meiji period" for the period immediately following rule by the Tokugawa shogunate between 1868 and 1912, even though it also happens to be an era. Let it go already, and let's all move on to something more useful.-Jefu 23:12, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

Education[edit]

Unresolved: Article still lacks information on this important subtopic, three years later.

Is there room for a paragraph on the introduction of compulsory education, or is the matter dealt with more fully on another page?andycjp (talk) 11:53, 23 March 2009 (UTC)

This should go in the section-stub called "Society". — SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ɖ∘¿¤þ   Contrib. 10:13, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

Meiji era in popular culture[edit]

Resolved: No support for adding a pop culture/trivia section in over three years.

How about one of these sections? It would be interesting to see a list of works set in the Meiji era. --217.76.87.120 (talk) 11:29, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

Um, no, it wouldn't. That's not what Wikipedia is for. And "a list of works" isn't even what "In popular culture" sections are for (they are for concise annotation of some exemplary and genuinely notable cases of influence of the subject on popular culture, and not all articles here, by any means, need such a section. — SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ɖ∘¿¤þ   Contrib. 10:30, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

Rurouni Kenshin[edit]

Resolved: Linkspam removed.

Why is this listed in the "See Also" section? From what I know about it it's simply a manga that has some historical underpinnings. If a popular culture section is included then this would be pertinent, but it is not another historical source of information. Looking for input as to why this is listed. Robin.dave (talk) 19:51, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

I removed it, as it is not appropriate for the "See also" section, and borders on spammy/promotional. If we listed every piece of fiction set roughly in this period, we'd have thousands of entries in the "See also" section. — SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ɖ∘¿¤þ   Contrib. 10:13, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

Arts and humanities[edit]

This article is missing all information about the insanely influential Meiji period art, which (through influencing Art Nouveau almost as much as Arts and Crafts did) helped define modernity in art and design. It was also, in turn, reflexively influenced by Nouveau and, later, early Art Deco. The "Society" section is also devoid of all other humanties information – literature, philosophy, poetry, music, film and other arts, education, etc. Given the enormous impact of Meiji art, and the intensive cross-polination it represents between East and West, the omission borders on the absurd. — SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ɖ∘¿¤þ   Contrib. 10:13, 23 October 2012 (UTC)