Talk:Mosque

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
Former featured article Mosque is a former featured article. Please see the links under Article milestones below for its original nomination page (for older articles, check the nomination archive) and why it was removed.
Main Page trophy This article appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page as Today's featured article on July 27, 2006.
          This article is of interest to the following WikiProjects:
WikiProject Islam / Mosques  (Rated B-class, Top-importance)
WikiProject icon This article is within the scope of WikiProject Islam, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Islam-related articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.
B-Class article B  This article has been rated as B-Class on the project's quality scale.
 Top  This article has been rated as Top-importance on the project's importance scale.
Taskforce icon
This article is supported by the Mosques task force.
 
WikiProject Architecture (Rated B-class, Top-importance)
WikiProject icon This article is within the scope of WikiProject Architecture, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Architecture on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.
B-Class article B  This article has been rated as B-Class on the project's quality scale.
 Top  This article has been rated as Top-importance on the project's importance scale.
 
WikiProject Religion (Rated B-class, Top-importance)
WikiProject icon This article is within the scope of WikiProject Religion, a project to improve Wikipedia's articles on Religion-related subjects. Please participate by editing the article, and help us assess and improve articles to good and 1.0 standards, or visit the wikiproject page for more details.
B-Class article B  This article has been rated as B-Class on the project's quality scale.
 Top  This article has been rated as Top-importance on the project's importance scale.
 
Wikipedia Version 1.0 Editorial Team / v0.5 / Vital
WikiProject icon This article has been reviewed by the Version 1.0 Editorial Team.
Taskforce icon
This article has been selected for Version 0.5 and subsequent release versions of Wikipedia.
 
B-Class article B  This article has been rated as B-Class on the quality scale.
Taskforce icon
This article is a vital article.
edit·history·watch·refresh Stock post message.svg To-do list for Mosque:

Here are some tasks awaiting attention:
  • Article requests: Please add a section for "collective mosque" (Masjid Jami)
  • Verify: Please add reliable source for all of the information
Priority 1 (top)

Untitled[edit]

The Section on Largest Mosques uses a Tenplate of largest Cities in China - so the largest Mosque Section is not editable and has errors . I have no idea how to re do the Tenplate so that it can be edited —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.178.152.136 (talk) 13:30, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Talk:Mosque/Archive 1 | 6 April 2005 - 23 May 2006

1 Adding the Islam template 2 Small mosques' influence 3 Vandalism 4 Shoes? 5 Recent Major Changes 6 Men and women in the mosque 7 Proposal to move 7.1 Vote 7.2 Discussion 8 Featured 9 pics 10 Minarets 11 Major Improvements 12 Jame' 13 About.com - Dubious Source? 14 Islam Template at Top 15 NPOV and activity in mosques 16 Tahara link 17 Image caption 18 Some comments 19 Ownership 20 Minor issues with the article 21 Social conflict 22 Charity section title 23 Zeq's Additions 24 Problems with the "Styles" section 25 balance problem? 26 Feature on the main page?

Talk:Mosque/Archive 2 | 28 May 2006 - 21 February 2009

1 Cleanup Tag 2 What the sources say on women in the mosques 3 Non-muslims in Mosques 4 Non-muslims in Mosques (Part II) 5 Sister projects 6 Off Main Page Queue 7 Styles section 8 What About Now ? 9 Balance problem, part 2 10 Balance 11 Removal of {{pov-section}} 12 Sources 13 Removal of {{cleanup}} Template 14 Conversion of houses of worship of other religions into mosques 15 Mosque 16 Ahmadiyya Source 17 Reading between the Lines 18 Restoration 19 Great Mosque of Djenné 20 gap 21 Mosque in Muslim holy texts 22 Is this page hacked ? 23 Image quality 24 Weapons - Firearms 25 Finsbury Park Mosque and Islamist hatred 26 Muslim view of the Kaaba and al-Aqsa Mosque 26.1 POV and Ethnocentrism 27 Truth a Casualty Again 28 Mosques in the US 29 This Addition 30 Is the term Mosque disrespectful ? 31 Islamic Art and Architecture in the Mosque 32 Architecture / Pope 33 Racist news 34 picture 35 Fair use rationale for Image:Uthman mousq1.jpg 36 Too many pictures on this page? 37 Your article refers to Muslims as Terrorists! 38 Famous Mosques section inaccurate 39 For information 40 Minaret or not ? 41 Prayers 41.1 Not offering all 5 prayers 41.2 Contradiction ? 42 Pictures of Mosques 42.1 Suggestions for pictures 42.1.1 Minarets/Domes 42.1.2 Minbars 42.1.3 Architecture 42.1.4 Ritual purification 42.1.5 Calligraphy 42.1.6 Design/Patterns 42.1.7 Courtyard 42.1.8 Iwan 42.1.9 Interior 42.1.10 Generic 43 Possibily a Doctored Image. 44 A statement is missing 45 Change (Mosque in to Masjid)because we are muslims that's why we only call t Majid.


surau[edit]

"surau" redirects to this page but there is no information about "surau" here. Sheherazahde (talk) 19:05, 25 January 2010 (UTC)

Actually, the word "surau" comes from a Malay word, which means a smaller mosque that can be used for five daily prayers, but cannot used for Friday congregation sermons as well as i'tikaf, a period of retreat usually practiced in larger mosques.--Muhammad Mukhriz (talk) 08:18, 27 January 2011 (UTC)


"according to the Hadith Muslims must destroy all polytheist buildings of worship"[edit]

I could not find any reference for the statement: "according to the Hadith Muslims must destroy all polytheist buildings of worship."

Please forgive my ignorance but it would be nice to have some authentic reference.

Faisal (talk) 11:51, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

To be honest, due to the dubious authenticity of the Hadiths (I mean, they were written long after Muhammad’s death!) it may be untrue. I don’t know if it’s possible to get the Hadiths online like you can so easily with the Qur’an.--Frank Fontaine (talk) 18:31, 13 September 2009 (UTC)


Masjid[edit]

I just found that googling a WP:SET for mosque only had 2,470,000 hits whereas the same WP:SET for masjid had surprisingly more at 3,380,000 hits. I was looking at Mosque to see how it included the term, masjid , so that I could follow it. To make sure I was following previous WP:CONSENSUS, I checked the Talk:Mosque too but it was rather short, so I scanned the archives and found Talk:Mosque/Archive 1#Proposal to move and Talk:Mosque/Archive 2#Change (Mosque in to Masjid)because we are muslims that's why we only call t Majid. . They made sense to me even though I remembered an embryonic US and AU trend from mosque to masjid in the 1990's. I just wanted to do the SET to set it in the talk before making the changes I was planning. I know I should not have been surprised that masjid had already surpassed mosque in English since I knew that the top five List of countries by English-speaking population#List in order of total speakers contained OIC member, NG, and the two countries with OIC#Membership attempts, IN and PH but I still was nevertheless. That said, perhaps it is time to start using the more popular term, masjid , on English Wikipedia. As this has been contentious before, I invite consensus before planning action. Please articulate your POV.

Warmest Regards, :)--thecurran let it off your chest 09:28, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

I agree considering the correct term is Masjid. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.119.157.233 (talk) 22:50, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

70.119.157.233 (talkcontribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

I agree with masjid seems to me its the consenses and redirect mosque to masjid article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Islamuslim (talkcontribs) 03:55, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

MosqueMasjid — Muslims call it Masjid not Mosque Islamuslim (talk) 04:03, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

Requested move[edit]

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

No consenus to move. Vegaswikian (talk) 16:46, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

  • Oppose move. Google indicates that mosque is used more than masjid. A google search on English sources shows more instances of mosque than masjid (11.7 million to 6.0 million). Same with gnews hits (5.9 thousand to .8 thousand). And gnews archives hits (185 thousand to 35.1 thousand). And gbooks hits (24.2 thousand to 3.1 thousand). And google scholar -- 88 thousand to 16.4 thousand. Plus -- this is English wikipedia, so the English word is preferred to the non-English word.--Epeefleche (talk) 08:06, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

Consensus is to move to Masjid.Islamuslim (talk) 08:15, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

Ummm ... perhaps in Florida. Or in SPA-land. But not on Wikipedia. Not per Wiki policies. And not -- despite the misleading initial post -- by google searches. Because it is controversial, it should not be moved. I would also ask you to revert the list that you already moved, without consensus. Thanks.--Epeefleche (talk) 08:18, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

Three people against one is definatly a consensus believe it or not.Islamuslim (talk) 08:22, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

As to what constitutes that three, all I see are you, a Floridian SPA IP, and someone who did what I showed above was clearly an error-ridden google search. The vast majority of references on google, any segment that you look at, are to "mosque". And given that that is the English word, and this is English wikipedia, that is preferred.--Epeefleche (talk) 08:41, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

One of them concerns the term 'Mosque'. The term 'mosque' is derived from the Spanish word for 'mosquito'.Islamuslim (talk) 08:45, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

The above searches are on English language sources, not Spanish sources, if that is what you are referring to. If your comment has another point, I'm not sure I understand what you are trying to say. The spanish word for mosquito is ... mosquito. The Spanish word for mosque is "mezquita" -- something entirely different.--Epeefleche (talk) 08:51, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

One of them concerns the term 'Mosque'. The term 'mosque' is derived from the Spanish word for 'mosquito'.Its a derogatory term.Islamuslim (talk) 08:57, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

The Oxford English Dictionary indicates that mosque and mosquito have independent, separate roots. Knepflerle (talk) 12:59, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
  • Oppose. We should use the commonly understood English word as per WP:COMMONNAME. --DAJF (talk) 11:22, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
  • Common English usage is mosque, therefore we use it per WP:AT. Oppose, Knepflerle (talk) 12:53, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
  • Oppose Still April Fool's in some parts of the world. This RM discussion is ridiculous to the point of a prank. Mosquitos? If there was any seriousness to the nomination, I point to the reasoned arguments above. Ham Pastrami (talk) 02:05, 2 April 2010 (UTC)
  • Oppose Muslims often call it Mosque, when they talk in English, since this is English Wiki, let it stay that way.{moved location}Peaceworld111 (talk) 10:35, 2 April 2010 (UTC)
  • Oppose Ridiculous proposal. Every muslim I know (and there are lots here in the North West of England), talks about going to the mosque. Skinsmoke (talk) 01:17, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
  • Comment Some specific examples:
The Oldham Muslim Centre works actively to promote tolerance and understanding. Along with all the local mosques, we are a member of the Oldham Mosque Council; this binds together Muslims from different backgrounds and strands of Islam. from Oldham Muslim Centre
Mosque Database: Find a mosque in the database by entering the city/town/locale name (e.g Birmingham) or the first part of the postcode (e.g NW8). Or find a mosque by part of its name (e.g %Noor will find mosques with 'Noor' in the name) from Salaam Newsletter
A mosque is a place of worship for followers of Islam. Muslims often refer to the mosque by its Arabic name, masjid.The word "mosque" in English refers to all types of buildings dedicated for Islamic worship, although there is a distinction in Arabic between the smaller, privately owned mosque and the larger, "collective" mosque, which has more community and social amenities. from Islamic Directory
The Mosque is the focal point of a Muslim Community. It is far more than just a place of worship - it is a resource centre, where sections of the people come together for very different events. from Lancashire Council of Mosques
Skinsmoke (talk) 01:30, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.


'Mosque' and 'Mosquito'.[edit]

  • One of them concerns the term 'Mosque'. The term 'mosque' is derived from the Spanish word for 'mosquito'. Its a derogatory term.Islamuslim (talk) 08:49, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
  • I'm not sure why you are repeating yourself three times. Feel free to delete these two sentences of mine, and the preceding two entries you made, to make the lives of those trying to read this easier.--Epeefleche (talk) 09:05, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
  • The word "mosque" likeliest comes from Arabic "masjid" via its Egyptian Arabic pronunciation "masgid" and then transmission via French and Italian sailors etc. Anthony Appleyard (talk) 10:45, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
  • For completeness, "mosquito" comes from "mosca". "Mosque" and "mosquito" are not cognate - at best, they are false friends. 81.111.114.131 (talk) 09:43, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Should some mention of The Complete Idiot's Guide to Islam be made, so that people who have read it won't assume they have all the facts? Downstrike (talk) 05:21, 19 February 2011 (UTC)


Prophet's Mosque[edit]

Why doesn't the history section refer to the first mosque that was defined and created by and with the help of that prophet? Faro0485 (talk) 00:07, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

Number of mosques in the United States[edit]

The article says that there are 40,000 to 50,000 mosques in the United States, but there's no citation for that figure. The 2001 survey (cited elsewhere in that paragraph) only found 1,209 mosques in the US. The figure is presumably somewhat higher than 1,209 now, but I'd be surprised if it's more than 1,500. Can anyone come up with a reliable citation for the 40,000-50,000 mosques? 206.208.105.129 (talk) 14:30, 1 October 2010 (UTC)


Largest Mosques[edit]

Not sure if anyone noticed, but the table for the largest mosques links to largest cities in China if you click view. I don't know how to fix this. So here you go.

108.3.169.74 (talk) 01:57, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. Fixed. Materialscientist (talk) 02:07, 17 December 2010 (UTC)


Quba Mosque[edit]

It is known that the oldest mosque in the North Africa is at Khairouan, Tunisia. However, it is come to my opinion that the Quba Mosque should be included in the earliest History of Mosques (this article), because Masjid Al-Quba (or The Quba Mosque) has an imporant significance to the history of the construction of mosques since the Early Islamic Period in Mecca. What do you think? --Muhammad Mukhriz (talk) 04:15, 17 August 2011 (UTC)


Why is the Quba Mosque claimed to be one of the oldest, both here and in its own article, when the latter claims it was rebuilt in 1986? I can see that a claim that it is built on the oldest mosque site might stand up to scrutiny, but don't see how a claim that a 1986 building is the oldest is justified. — Preceding unsigned comment added by CWB001 (talkcontribs) 14:23, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

Ahmadiyya[edit]

Ahmadiyya is considered non-Muslim by most Muslims. Pakistani law prohibits them to call their place of worship a "Mosque" or "Masjid". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.17.107.167 (talk) 18:13, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

non-muslim in Moroccan mosque[edit]

Im not sure the guidebook referenced in this text is correct as I have just been welcomed into the mosque in Fnidaq (town near to Ceuta in north Morocco). I am female and look caucasian and clearly had issues arranging a headscaff, but none of these things seemed to bother the other women. They smiled and generally seemed not to mind my being there or getting the prayer movements wrong occationally. (the lady next to me showed me after prayer that my head should have touched the ground). However we could not speak a word of each others language so it is hard to know for sure if it is the norm for English girls who dont look muslim to be allowed in. Perhaps I ignorantly impossed myself and they were just too polite to throw me out? Its very untouristy here so I cant imagine its a common problem for this particular mosque. They certainly seemed to relish the opotunity to show me the ropes, for which I am most greatful. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.140.88.83 (talk) 18:48, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

Title change to Masjid[edit]

Google indicates that masjid is used more than mosque. A google search on English sources shows more instances of masjid than mosque (79 million to 75.4 million). Modeltookmodeltook (talk) 15:58, 29 August 2012 (UTC)

Doesn't sound plausible to me, but I'll let others who know more discuss it properly (but your etymology is junk, which doesn't fill me with confidence. Ah, but you had the sense to rewrite it). In the meantime I've reverted your change to Template:Islam - get agreemetn (or not) here first William M. Connolley (talk) 16:12, 29 August 2012 (UTC)
This is the English version of Wikipedia, and as such the term Mosque is probably more familiar to most readers. . . Mean as custard (talk) 16:14, 29 August 2012 (UTC)
Masjid, of course, is the proper title in Arabic, but not in English. English Wikipedia article titles use the appropriate English name, and since few English speakers would know that masjid is the Arabic word for mosque, it would be a poor choice of a search term target. See WP:COMMONNAME and WP:UE for the policy. By the way, there is no link between "mosque" and "mosquito." The former probably has its origins in an English pronunciation of masjid, and the latter is derived from Spanish and Portuguese, and ultimately from Latin (musca), which obviously predates Islam, so there is no derogatory implication. This has been discussed before; look farther up the page. Acroterion (talk) 16:15, 29 August 2012 (UTC)

Note that Modeltookmodeltook has now moved a large number of "X mosque" pages to "X masjid". I've raised this at ANI (Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#Mosque_moves) William M. Connolley (talk) 16:23, 29 August 2012 (UTC)

He's been blocked. Side note - mosque it should stay. GiantSnowman 16:33, 29 August 2012 (UTC)

Agree - It should be moved to masjid. 113.203.182.214 (talk) 16:38, 29 August 2012 (UTC)Per discussion at the aforementioned ANI thread, this is an IPsock of the original poster agreeing with himself.

Per WP:COMMONNAME, nope. --Kinu t/c 16:47, 29 August 2012 (UTC)

Request for comment[edit]

1328101993 Rename.png Proposal for removing prefixes "Islamic views on xyz"
I have started a request move to remove the prefixes Attached with the Prophets in Islam to there Names as in Islam. Like Islamic views on AbrahamIbrahim as it becomes difficult to search the topic. Please participate in the discussion at Talk:Page Thanks. --Ibrahim ebi (talk) 19:24, 14 December 2012 (UTC)

Not featured standard[edit]

This is definitely not up to featured article standard

  1. Many pictures used are of low quality
  2. The lead does not summarise the article, it jumps to the details straight away and is too short
  3. For such a key subject of Islam, this page is very short
  4. No diagram like we have on Kaaba
  5. Mosque#Social_conflict only mentions examples of modern day examples, nothing historical like other sections.
  6. Pictures plastered everywhere and some huge gallery for some reason.

There is some certainly good parts to this article, but I don't believe it's very comprehensive, or has a good lead or suitable media. Compared to other featured article, this is substandard.--Loomspicker (talk) 20:12, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

I was going to say much the same thing. I, a non-Muslim, came here due to a discussion about another article. I realized that I didn't know exactly what a mosque is. This should be the first sentence of this article. After skimming through the article I still don't know exactly what is a mosque and what is some other place of worship. BayShrimp (talk) 16:12, 20 July 2014 (UTC)