Talk:NHL Entry Draft

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List of drafts[edit]

I noticed that in the list of drafts it jumps from 2006 to 2008. Is there any reason for this? Where is 2007? Masterhatch 17:02, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

Might just be because whenever that part was last edited, whoever did it already knew the '08 draft will be held in Ottawa. Maybe the place of the 2007 draft wasn't known. Bigdottawa 13:25, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

Fair use and copyright violations[edit]

The following was just posted to Wikipedia:Copyright problems in the "Fair use claims needing a second opinion" section:

  • NHL Entry Draft (history · last edit) This page itself is not a problem, but all of the XXXX NHL Entry Draft pages from 1963 to present linked from this page make extensive use of team and university logos. (Didn't want to list 30+ pages here individually.) I hate to be a spoilsport and suggest the removal of someone's hard work, but this does not even come close to meeting the requirements for use of these fair use images. Use of logos, I believe, is more or less restricted to use in articles about the specific organization that owns the logo. While I see the aesthetic value of using these logos on said pages, I don't believe it's legal. Hope this is the right place to raise the question; I'll also be posting this to NHL Entry Draft to alert interested editors of the potential problem.
I'm posting this here so anyone interested has a chance to comment. B.Rossow Talk|Contr 13:10, Saturday [[April 8]] [[2006]] (UTC)
I agree. Yes aesthetically pleasing, but not appropriate with regard to fair use. They should go from those pages and be used on team articles only. Mark83 14:18, 18 April 2006 (UTC)
Given no objections, I am in the process of removing the logos from said pages. If someone wants to help, that would be great as it's a somewhat tedious project.  B.Rossow talkcontr [[Tuesday]], [[April 25]], [[2006]] @ 14:40 (UTC)
Well hold up, because I have HUGE objections over this. Nevermind the countless hours spent on finding logos for all the drafted players, but these logos do exactly what the fair use says they can be used for: to illustrate the corporation, sports team, or organization in question. What's the problem here exactly? Now who's going to spend the countless hours re-inserting the logos? Bigdottawa 11:54, 26 April 2006 (UTC)
First of all, the proper time to object would have been three weeks ago when this was posted for discussion. Second, the use of the logos in this manner is most assuredly not fair use. It is purely aesthetic, not at all critical to identifying the team in question. The fair use notification in the copyright tag is not accurate when it suggests, at least to some, that ANY use of the logo is fair use as long as it's illustrating the subject. That's not what fair use law says (and having taught fair use in workshops for nearly a decade, I'm rather familiar with fair use doctrine). Fair use applies when the use of copyrighted material (in this case, an image) is integral to demonstrating the subject. This is not the case here; the team name alone defines the subject without ambiguity and the logo, while visually pleasing, is without question not necessary in further identifying the team. So to answer your last question, no one will be spending countless hours re-inserting the logos because doing so would be a violation of U.S. and international copyright law. Sorry.  B.Rossow talkcontr [[Friday]], [[April 28]], [[2006]] @ 17:56 (UTC)
If the copyright tag on this site CLEARLY states logo's can be used to illustrate the sports team, which is what the logos on the draft page or doing, then the logos on the draft pages are perfectly okay, according to the copyright tags on Wikipedia. I'm sorry if I didn't bring up my objections weeks ago, but I don't use the site every day, so I didn't catch it then. And someone should definitely re-insert the logos, because there use is in line with what the copyright tags state. Bigdottawa 14:38, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
The copyright tag is not intended to be all-inclusive in its explanation. Further, the coyright tag is user-edited and does not convey official, complete Wikipedia copyright policy. You clearly do not understand fair use law and, regardless of how you interpret the [incomplete] copyright tag, the use of these logos in this manner is without question a copyright violation. Reinsertion of the logos would be a direct violation of international copyright law and could expose Wikipedia to unnecessary liability issues. You really should do some reading about fair use and not just rely on a condensed version in a copyright tag.  B.Rossow talkcontr [[Sunday]], [[April 30]], [[2006]] @ 15:28 (UTC)
If you're going to remove the logos from the Awards section of each season, then you should have replaced it with the team name of the player who won the award...scsgoal31 03:18, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
Ok, it's not as bad as I thought, it was only the last few seasons that logos were used...remembering what team the player was on at the time shouldn't be a major issue...I'll see what I can do about putting them in the format of the 01-02 season and prior.

Table out of date[edit]

The Player Numbers By League Summary is out of date - hasn't been updated since the 2003 draft. I've put a template up, hopefully it can be fixed. BoojiBoy 21:28, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

Steals[edit]

I've changed the "draft steal" from Dominik Hasek to Dino Ciccarelli. My reasoning is that I'm not sure that Hasek can be considered a steal - he was a total shot in the dark because he was playing in Czechoslovakia at the time and was not considered likely to defect to the West. I don't think that you can say that the Blackhawks "stole" him merely because the Berlin Wall fell six years later. BoojiBoy 15:02, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

Supplemental Drafts[edit]

  • I was wondering if anybody knows anything at all about the supplemental drafts. I am particularly looking for draft dates and locations, but I am under the impression that they were at the same locations. As of now I can confirm that '93 and '94 drafts were in the same location as the main draft from here, but as I said I am not sure the dates are the same but I would have to assume they are. Right now I am in the midst of doing the grunt work of just getting the information onto the supplemental draft pages and I plan to be done all the drafts within the next few days. MBob 00:27, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

Draft Lottery?[edit]

I don't know enough to do it myself, but I think the Lottery should be mentioned in this article TheHYPO 14:07, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Now added, along with the rest of the draft seeding procedure. — Lomn 18:45, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

2009 in Montreal?[edit]

Where was it officially announced that Montreal was hosting the draft in 2009? I see the link to the article on canadiens.com saying that they are BIDDING on the 2009 Draft within the 2009 NHL Entry Draft page, but I find nothing on the internet to support that they are OFFICIALLY hosting it.

busts and steals removed[edit]

Per WP:V, et al, I've removed the entire busts/steals section. Its a wholly unsourced subjective list. Should worthwhile sources emerge, I see nothing wrong in principle with the section returning, but I think it's important not to let it devolve back into another overlong list like the article is unfortunately already saddled with. For those interested in re-adding the section, here's the diff of the lists at the time of my removal. — Lomn 18:50, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

compensation?[edit]

does anyone know if there any financial compensation to drafted amateurs former minor league teams?

(ie: when Sidney Crosby was drafted to the NHL, did his junior team the Rimouski Océanic receive any financial return?) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.156.95.254 (talk) 22:05, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

Extremely late answer here, but no, I can't imagine that they would. The draft is a strictly internal NHL agreement, and the only parties bound by a draft choice are the 29 NHL franchises that didn't draft the player. As for when the player actually signs an NHL contract, that is a different matter of course. If the player is still under contract with another club, that club is in a bargaining position because it could simply refuse to release the player from the contract, and sue him for breach if he leaves the club anyway. While most clubs aren't too keen on actually prohibiting their players from taking a chance like this, they will certainly demand remuneration. There is a general contract between the NHL and the IIHF currently under renegotiation (and contention, as some European clubs feel the figures are too low), but I don't know if the Canadian leagues would be covered by that. If the player is not under contract, I don't think any such demands can be made (compare the soccer situation: Bosman ruling and Transfer (football)#FIFA's solidarity mechanism). —JAOTC 10:09, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
I know that when a Swedish player moves to NHL, his Swedish club(s) is paid $225000 as per a signed agreement between NHL and the Swedish hockey league. In return, any player has the right to break off his contract if he gets signed to an NHL club, the club cannot refuse the transfer. I would assume there are similar agreements with many other leagues. MatsT (talk) 10:13, 13 July 2011 (UTC)

Reason for lottery[edit]

To most of us, it's probably kind of obvious why the lottery takes place, but it could certainly be covered in some detail. How common was it, for instance, for teams to actually be accused of throwing games for draft purposes? I vaguely recall that this might have been one of the reasons that Eric Lindros didn't want to sign with the Nordiques, but I'm certainly not sure about that... —JAOTC 10:09, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

I can't cite any references, but I do remember actual stats from sports analysts. Teams would play second, third, and fourth lines more often in games near the end of the regular season. This was not illegal nor controllable. It however did give the less experienced players more ice time against teams that were hungry and strong trying to get higher standing for the play-offs. There may have been other ways as well. I don't have the desire to find citations, but others may wish to for the article.--Canoe1967 (talk) 00:57, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Compensatory draft selection[edit]

Resolute removed the section Compensatory draft selection here, however the section is referenced and contains useful information, so unless there is a consensus that this section does not belong in this article, I will restore it. Dolovis (talk) 01:21, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

You never learn to step back, read and understand, do you? The material you are complaining about is already in the article. As I explained in the edit summary, I merely removed your duplication of said content. I already merged your compensatory draft selection article, rewording as needed to fit into the article. Resolute 02:52, 30 May 2011 (UTC)
It reads better as it own section. Dolovis (talk) 03:18, 30 May 2011 (UTC)
A single paragraph rarely makes a good section. If you can bring in other aspects of the system of compensatory picks to create a decent section out of it, by all means. Historically, for instance, teams would trade for pending UFA's they knew they couldn't sign because it would net them a pick (Theoren Fluery to the Sharks, and Curtis Joseph to the Flames, as two examples). That might give you a basis from which to find sources and build a section. Resolute 04:06, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

Capitalization in headers[edit]

The "Eligible Players" section header has the first letter in each word as an upper-case letter. As far as I know, usually only names should be capitalized. Is it correct to capitalize both words? If yes, is there some policy/guideline information I'm missing? HeyMid (contribs) 21:26, 15 July 2011 (UTC)

No, that is counter to the MOS. Only proper names should be capitalized. Resolute 23:18, 15 July 2011 (UTC)

Time to get rid of 'Entry'[edit]

It's no longer the Entry Draft, as there isn't the Waiver Draft to differentiate from. Can we make this page just the NHL Draft and include the history of the previous time as NHL Entry Draft? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Arusnak (talkcontribs) 19:13, 21 June 2012 (UTC)

Trading of draft picks[edit]

The thing which I do not understand is how can teams be trading draft picks if the results (standings) of future seasons as well as the outcome of the respective lottery -- these being the two determining factors for a draft position -- are not known to them? As far as I know, teams are trading specific (eg a No 2 pick) and not just any pick in a future draft. There should be an (obvious) answer to this, it's just I haven't figured it out yet ... Thanks to anyone who is helping me out on this! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.33.91.2 (talk) 13:12, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

Team A own a pick in a certain round. So they trade say their 1st round pick 2016. They trade it. Now team B owns that pick (and their own) in the first round. Where the obtained pick will occur will depend on how team A finishes and lottery results. I guess it is sort of like a futures market. Dbrodbeck (talk) 13:42, 25 September 2013 (UTC)
Exactly. It is something of a gamble on the part of the team acquiring the pick. They will know what round the pick they acquire will be in, but not the specific place until the season ends. Some trades are designed to account for this. The Jay Bouwmeester trade to St. Louis, for example, included a 2013 first round pick going to Calgary. However, as a condition of that deal, if the Blues missed the playoffs (thus drafting between 1-14, depending on the lottery result), they would have instead given Calgary their 2014 first round pick, plus an extra fourth rounder. Resolute 13:48, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

Thank you very much for making this clear to me (and so swiftly). In central European leagues, we do not have such a sophisticated system -- or any draft system for that matter -- so it's nice to receive tutorials from people who know. Patrick H. (Austria)... and by the way, Resolute: It seems that you have taken one of the pictures in the article on Alex Plante (in a Calgary Hitmen uniform) who now happens to play for my local team: Dornbirn Bulldogs. It's a small world after all! Patrick H.