Talk:Pella

Royal Tomb

In Greece, it's a "royal tomb" even if it was not made for members of a royal family— "it's a term" User:Matia.gr tells us, reverting my edit. I say that's a lotta baklava. Anyone agree? --Wetman 21:58, 13 February 2006 (UTC)

Your tone is inappropriate. Read WP:CIV, revise your edit, and then maybe we could talk about it. Got it? talk to +MATIA 22:25, 13 February 2006 (UTC)

Merge

FA on Fr, but here it's split into two overlapping sections - I'd like to do the FR trans & see this go FA, the way these two articles stand this is unlikely.Bridesmill 02:54, 9 July 2006 (UTC). Actually, this is confusing - We have Pella Prefecture, Pella, and History of Pella - the latter two overlapping. Somehow the talk page for Pella is here at Pella Prefecture. I'm confused.Bridesmill 02:56, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Merged; I am working on the FA trans at my Sandbox.Bridesmill 02:21, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

More Alexander required

You may consider this overlap with the 'Alexander The Great' and 'Macedonia' pages, but surely there has to be a greater emphasis on the Alexander story as the reason we are discussing Pella today (no offence intended to current inhabitants!)? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 80.43.25.141 (talk) 14:41, 22 January 2007 (UTC).

Postol

Your argument "Slavic has nothing to do with this city. If we put a Slavic translation of this name, then let's put the Cantonese, Spanish, French etc. translations too. There is no need for it" sounds polemic. The town was (and still is) known by this name in Slavic, and Greek Macedonia had (and still has) slavic-speaking inhabitants, so it is not totally out of question that "Postol" was a historical name of the place. It was after all the birth place of a Bulgarian/Macedonian nationalist, so it must have had at least some Slavic population (if you do not assume that Misirkov was born by chance there). So the question is here: how notable was the name "Postol"?  Andreas  ^(T) 01:20, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Please explain why you think that Pella/Agii Apostoli did not have a historical name Postol or why you think this name is not notable. What is your opinion on; the proportion of Slavic-speaking population of A.A. before the population move in 1913, the name used by the Ottoman authorities. If possible, give reliable sources on your claims.  Andreas  ^(T) 22:35, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Dear User Deanhellene, on a recent edit summary, you say:

The town of Pella is in Greece. Slavic is not spoken in Greece. Pella has been a Greek town since ancient times and has never had anything to do with the Slavic people or language. Better explanation?)

It is certainly true that Pella has been part of the Greek state for almost 100 years. But this tells us nothing about what languages have been spoken there. Indeed, South Slavic dialects were widely spoken in what is now Greek Macedonia. --Macrakis 03:22, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

I am afraid I disagree here, guys. The name Postol was neither the original name, nor an official name in use today. It was just one of the many names this town has. In Ancient times, the city was founded as Pella, and was known under that name for more than 1400 years (from 399 BC until at least 1200 AD, after some point at which it was also known as Aghioi Apostoloi. Pella was, for he Slavic tribes that settled in the wider Balkan region around 1000AD, known as Postol as well. And in the Ottoman era it also had some Turkish names too, but the fact remains, is that the name Pella never ceased to exist (more specifically especially in Italian and English maps if I recall correctly). Since the fall of the Ottoman Empire, the town was again officially known again by its popular name Pella. Pella even has been been declared as the official name of the town in the Greek State for more than 100 years now. Its obvious that while Pella may been called Aghioi Apostoloi or Postol in certain time periods, does not means it was not called Pella. Its name was and always been Pella, both in ancient and modern times.--85.75.135.132 (talk) 19:11, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

Split

Macrakis was bold and split the article (he did not populate the new article, though). Good point because it seems that A.A. was not a continuation of Ancient Pella, Was there a time when there was no settlement there? Was A.A. founded independently of ancient Pella? Then indeed we need two articles. But disambig notices have to be added, and also all the links have to be checked. I could do this.  Andreas  ^(T) 14:47, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

Done  Andreas  ^(T) 16:04, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

Sorry about that; I did do a few, but wasn't as systematic as you. Thanks. --Macrakis 18:48, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

Agriculture

Agriculture is very common to the south and mainly produces fruits.

This was not English; I have replaced it. If the fruits in question grow on trees, like apples, orchard, (or perhaps grove for olives, oranges and other citrus). If they are bush fruit, like berries, recasting may be justified. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 23:54, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

Athens vs Athens, Greece

...or Pella vs Pella, Greece. Heh, nice precedent we're setting here... Now go on and split all modern Greek towns from their history. And while you're at it, go split those of the other countries too. Merge now. NikoSilver 19:14, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

But isn't this article talking about Ancient Pella, while Pella, Greece is talking about modern day Pella? That could be one of the reasons for the two articles. We could rename this to History of Pella, and then rename Pella, Greece to Pella. ^{El Greco (talk · contribs)} 21:16, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Niko, you are right saying that we cannot split every article on a city between present and past. However, in this case, there is a rationale, see above under #Split. See also the split between Constantinople and Istanbul. Generally, many places in Greece have been renamed after independence, not only in Macedonia. In many cases, an Ancient Greek place name was revived, for example Menidi was named Acharnes after the ancient Acharnae. I would suppose that with Menidi it is the same case as with Pella: the ancient settlement was abandoned at some time in history, later a new settlement was created nearby, and at some point after independence, the new settlement was given the name of the old one. In the case of Amphipolis, the articles were indeed merged[1].  Andreas  ^(T) 21:31, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

No problem, but it looks quite silly to create two stubs out of one article. I'd merge regardless and I'd make sure the abandoned settlement issue was specified (and sourced). I don't follow the rationale that says [temporary abandoned settlement] equals automatically [article split]. It really doesn't have to be that way when the content is rather poor to begin with. Lack of continuation is not a reason for split. It is a reason for simply saying so. NikoSilver 22:27, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

The 2 articles (Ancient and Modern Pella) need to be merged up. Ancient and modern Pella are exactly like Ancient Olympia and modern Olympia - Pella and Olympia are two modern towns that are build near the archeological sites of the same name, that have been abandoned a long time ago. But in Wikipedia. we have Ancient and Modern Olympia merged up, while Ancient and Modern Pella divided into 2 articles. I have a bad feeling about why Ancient Pella was separated from modern town of Pella. (of which the archeological site falls within the modern town's admninistrative limits). I am afraid if this separation was done mostly for political reasons that have nothing to do with Pella, but with the political dispute between Greeks and the Slavs of the Republic of Macedonia. Wikipedia must keep the politics out of this, and merge the Ancient Pella with Modern Pella articles so they can be in line with all other articles of the archeological sites of Greece and their modern towns. --85.75.155.72 (talk) 18:35, 30 December 2012 (UTC)

Pella Regional info

Added the Pella Regional Info Panel, as the archeological site of Pella is within the Municipality limits of the nearby town of Pella. Much like most archeological sites in Greece have a Regional Info panel with some pictures of the Archeological sites themselves such as Ancient Olympia and the Olympia Municipality's info, of which the archeological site is part. But I have a bad feeling that some people may remove the Regional Info panel from the Pella article, despite the site being part of the town of Pella/Aghioi Apostoloi/Postol.--85.75.155.72 (talk) 18:29, 30 December 2012 (UTC)

Re-ordering of sections

I propose to move the Etymology and Language sections to the end of the page as they are of somewhat less interest than the History and Archaeology parts. I also propose to expand the latter sections with more details.Rjdeadly (talk) 13:38, 25 July 2015 (UTC)

Adding Wikipedia discussion to the wrong place

Muntele - I've reverted your changes to the article because they contain discussions and opinions that appear to need to be discussed here, not in the article itself. Can you explain your situation here instead of adding it back to the article again? I'd like to help you sort it out so that you can add content to the article that will be a positive contribution and in-line with Wikipedia's guidelines. Thanks :-) ~Oshwah~^{(talk) (contribs)} 16:56, 13 February 2016 (UTC) I forgot how to answer. By replacing the word TALK in your reaction? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Muntele (talk • contribs) 17:06, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

I don't understand what you mean by "TALK" and "reaction" - I just want to discuss your content. Can you add it here so we can go over it? Or I can do it. ~Oshwah~^{(talk) (contribs)} 17:21, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

Hi, Muntele - Here is what you added:

“ A 1 century old cigaret lighter was found in Japan. As a result, the American lighter has been forwarded as a strong argument that the Japanese language was a dialect of North-America, part of the English dialects.

Using the same Greek agresive bias language above about Pella(the greek target of this bias political fantasy is Alexander Macedon and the stealing in 1913, by Greece, of the southern half of Macedonia, because Alexander was born in Pella) and the same logic, we can conclude also that as a result, these confirm that an English dialect was spoken in Japan, as was previously expected from the American names (Johnson, McDonalds etc.) forms of names found in Japan last century and even today, this being favourable to the American economic expansion in Japan, as the Greek expansion into Macedonia and other (north of Greece) states started in 1913 continue at official level even today. Also quoting from the bias fantasy above about Macedonia and Macedonian language (posted here by greek admins as "a marginal language"😉 besides the "prime"😉 greek language), japanese was also "a marginal language" beside the "primordial English language", in Japan. And as long as greek admins here considers & uses Wikipedia as a war field fuelled by greek political agenda, and NOT as an information platform as Wikipedia was meant to be, I expect the admins to take a decision about WHAT Wikipedia is: An information platform, or a war field for bias poitical agenda. If it's a war field, all my addings here should remains as is. If it's an information platform, than please remove all the nonsense the greek nationalists placed allover Wikipedia at almost all pages, plus return all the deleted old maps and historical pictures, deleted by greeks nationalists here because they messed up their fantasy stories placed here allover, including "the greek version" of all modern names of places and people which has nothing to do with Greece or the greek language.

(Admins/vandals: Please do not remove this "strong argument", because is bring quoted from the paragraph above about the Macedonian language, and it uses the same logic. Besides, 1 century ago the whole Japan existed actually only in that area were the lighter was founded, as whole Macedonia existed -and can be identified oy with- the city of Pella; as wikipedia demonstrates above).

”

There are many issues with this content. It's unreferenced and not supported with any reliable sources, it doesn't appear to meet Wikipedia's neutral point of view guidelines, and it contains commentary and discussion that is meant to be said here, not in the article. This is why I reverted your edits. You will need to fix these issues before adding it back to the article. ~Oshwah~^{(talk) (contribs)} 17:26, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

Etymology

I think that the section Etymology must be moved at the beginning of the article ( e.g.Athens, Rome etc.)Jestmoon(talk) 09:42, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Pella. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150702080028/http://www.alexanderthegreatmarathon.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=13&Itemid=40&lang=en to http://www.alexanderthegreatmarathon.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=13&Itemid=40&lang=en
• Added archive https://archive.is/19981205120026/http://www.culture.gr/2/21/211/21117a/e211qa01.html to http://www.culture.gr/2/21/211/21117a/e211qa01.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 18 January 2022).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 09:56, 8 December 2017 (UTC)

etymology

I summarise the available sources. In Ancient Greek the word means "wooden pail". The origin of the word is probably IndoEuropean, or Pre-Greek.

1. Solders in an essay on the Heschychius glossary has referenced πελλα, λίθος "stone" an Ancient Macedonian word, which seems to be related with some toponyms like Pella, Pellene. With the prefix α the word απέλλα , apella, "fence ,enclosure of stones" is formed .

2. Julius Pokorny: Indogermanisches Etymologisches Wörterbuch p.807

Root/lemma peli-s,pel-s Old Indian: pāsāna, stone (from *pars, *pels), Greek: πέλλα, λίθος Hesychius (* pelsa), Pashto: parša (* plso), cliff ,Germanic *falisa, German: Fels, Old Norse:fell (* pelso), Illyrian *pella, *palla.

3. R. S. P. Beekes .Etymological Dictionary of Greek, Brill, 2009, p. 1168

He suggests a Pre-Greek proto-form *πελσα ,"pelsa". Jestmoon(talk) 12:17, 1 September 2021 (UTC)

Article behind in archaeology

Goodday people. In the late 20th and early 21st centuries a lot of archaeological work was done and also geological work invalidating the main approach as it is expressed here, which is far early now, perhaps not even within the lives of most of you. Pella was not late. Early Bronze Age. This will entail a rewrite at which time you will have a chance to decide a new outline. I could get around to it but who knows when that might be? Be aggressive. Take the male cow by the ring in its nose. Nobody today gets the horns. That ring is provided courtesy of the Archaeological Museum of Pella. I am specifying that in the article I am actually working on, Emathia. If you don't see it right away be patient. By the way all romantic accounts of the settlers looking out over the great remarkable plain are like the novels of Jane Austin, wishful thinking. They looked out over the salten sea from a stony island. The stony etymology therefore is considered the correct one currently. Everyone hearkens back to Pokorny for that one. Ciao.Botteville (talk) 01:33, 24 December 2023 (UTC)

References