Talk:Pio of Pietrelcina
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|WikiProject Christianity / Saints / Catholicism||(Rated B-class)|
|WikiProject Biography||(Rated B-class)|
Don Zauker series
I take that my edit was removed in less than 5 mins for no reasons; the section about his impact on popular culture is the right place to state he's become an iconic individual in a satyrical comics, this info having the same dignity as the controversies parts. I noticed it as I wanted to fix a thing, so I put it back, hoping it will remain, as it seems to me to be perfectly fit and congrous with this section. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.127.116.11 (talk) 13:15, 2 July 2010 (UTC) Edit: and now I sourced it too, let's see if the edit is rolled back again... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.104.22.168 (talk) 16:36, 2 July 2010 (UTC)
Page move/article name
I moved the page from Pio of Pietrelcina to Padre Pio of Pietrelcina. I've never heard him called Pio of Pietrelcina. Everything I've ever read has always said either just "Padre Pio" or "Padre Pio of Pietrelcina." I saw the early thread about the article name and this seems the best way to go.Malke 2010 (talk) 23:37, 15 September 2010 (UTC)
I suggest moving the page from the current to St. Padre Pio of Pietralcina. He is a saint now and saints have St. before their name. It is the orthodox mannar of referring to canonized individuals all over literature so that they are distinguised from the rest. Sainthood involves a process within the Catholic Church which is well known and even documented within literature itself. I really suggest the move. Thankyou Alan347 (talk)
Appearing to Maria Esperanza before he died
An editor recently added the claim of Maria Esperanza de Bianchini that Pio, who was her spiritual director, appeared to her before his death. The edit was removed by another editor on the basis that the source was not a reliable source. I restored the edit, indicating that althought the source at first glance might not appear reliable, the author has written more than a dozen books on related subject and would appear to be reliable. I also added another source. I have a third source, an encyclopedia on pilgrimages which concurs and which I will add. An recently editor put a "dubious" tag on the edit. While the question of whether Pio appeared to her is certainly a matter which is wide open (her husband being the only one present), I think it is now clear that Ms. Esperanza, who has now had a cause for her canonization opened, made this claim. I'm going to add the third source and remove the dubious tag. Mamalujo (talk) 23:01, 23 September 2010 (UTC)
- Was the husband the only person present during the transformation? They did not report that Elvis was there too? This lady's website says that she predicted technology (inconsistent to any scientist I tell you) and claims to have predicted the internet too, saying:
- "nuclear electronic science, thermonuclear science, and transistonuclear science." The message, now 23 years old, also seems to have foreseen the internet. "Electronic computers will [cause] the utmost revolution people could imagine," she quotes a message from 10:30 a.m. to 11 a.m. on March 18, 1981."
- I am trying not to laugh. And she claims both levitation and bilocation! And The bridge to Heaven: interviews with Maria Esperanza of Betania by Michael H. Brown is not based on investigative reporting, it is based on interviews with her. And the article mentioned is again based on that book. So all roads here lead to interviews with her, and nothing else. The quotes you have are "nowhere near" WP:Reliable. And she can get submitted for beatification, but that does not a saint make. Many years of investigation will be needed. And please note that this person has an imprimatur and support from her Archbishop (no less) who still supports while and some of her books pages were found to be exact copies of training manuals for seminarians and books written by other authors. So bishop support does not always mean much. Now what does Pilgrimage encyclopedia say exactly? Please state what it says instead of just a blind reference. Thanks. History2007 (talk) 01:12, 24 September 2010 (UTC)
- Gilitz is Jewish and so has no dog in this fight. He has authored 9 books and over 40 scholarly articles. The encyclopedia is a reliable source. You seem to be missing the point. Whether or not what Esperanza claimed was true or not is mostly beside the point. The point is she was a notable (now that her cause has been opened) devotee of Pio, indeed he was her spiritual advisor. That she claimed his visitation is credible, notable and reliably sourced (whether or not the apparition/viistation is). As to your pious fraud, it is not surprising if she is copying from seminary texts that her books would get an imprimatur now is it? After all those texts ought to be orthodox. Of course, that is all a red herring. If you want to see what the source says, there's a page cite. It corroborates the matter in the article. Mamalujo (talk) 23:50, 24 September 2010 (UTC)
- You did not answer the Elvis part. As for "Pio, indeed he was her spiritual advisor", did she ever meet Pio, or was it by bi-location? Or was it when she invented the internet? The point is that she seems to run an "exaggeration factory", and that needs to be noted - for it is notable. As for the non-pious fraud, she did not say she copied it, but said it was private revelation. Maybe it was and God was just reading the previously published book to her. History2007 (talk) 00:10, 25 September 2010 (UTC)
- She would not be the first purported mystic to run an "exaggeration factory". I am not saying she speaks only the truth. It was not her but the apparitions at Betania which the Bishop in South America approved in 1987. The earlier apparitions, he noted, were seen by few and uneducated people, many of them children. The Bishop notes that the later apparitions witnessed included "many middle class professional people as: Doctors, Psychiatrists, Psychologists, Engineers and Lawyers. There are also numerous college students from the different Universities in Caracas." Over 100 people saw at least 7 apparitions and signed statements to that effect. The Bishop's 1987 letter, although nearly 6,000 words, mentions Esperanza only once. So, I am not saying her claims in the article are credible, only that it is credible that she made them and that they are now notable because her cause has been opened. If indeed she is an apparent fraud, her cause will go nowhere. Mamalujo (talk) 01:17, 25 September 2010 (UTC)
This claim about this woman is more appropriate to the article about her, not to Padre Pio. This article is already bloated with unnecessary items. If there's a consensus to delete this bit about this woman, I support it's deletion. As a side note, just because a cause for canonization has been opened has nothing to do with the merits. She has fans. Lots of people have fans. That doesn't mean the Vatican should/would declare them saints.Malke 2010 (talk) 00:52, 28 September 2010 (UTC)
The article reports his father's name as Grazio. Two works that I have access to have his name as Orazio. Also one of his sisters is listed as Pellegrina. The two works have her name as Felicia. This needs to be clarified. --Auric (talk) 13:57, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
- Padre Pio: the true story Page 24 by Bernard Ruffin - 1991 :
- "Although he was baptized Grazio, Padre Pio's father was known most of his life as Orazio".
- So there we go. History2007 (talk) 14:27, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
- Carty, Rev. Charles Mortimer (1951). "Biography of Padre Pio". Padre Pio: The Stigmatist. Saint Paul 1, Minn.: Radio Replies Press. p. 1. LCC GN 111.
- De Liso, Oscar (1960). "Ch. 2". Padre Pio, the priest who bears the wounds of Christ. McGraw-Hill. pp. 13, 15. LCC 60-15686.
New Information: Padre Pio Under Investigation
Certain sections of the present Wikipedia article on Padre Pio are made obsolete by the 2011 publication: Padre Pio Under Investigation by Francesco Castelli. Also for Italian readers, Padre Pio L'ultimo Sospetto makes a factual contribution to the knowledge base.
File:Padre Pio during Mass.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion
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