Talk:Qiu Chuji

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http://www.jstor.org/stable/25066726?seq=13

http://www.jstor.org/stable/41930343?seq=13

http://books.google.com/books?id=8FVsWq31MtMC&pg=PA64#v=onepage&q&f=false

Rajmaan (talk) 22:24, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

Untitled[edit]

found another article about him:Kiu Chang Chun.Skyfiler 01:03, Apr 24, 2005 (UTC)

Journey to the West[edit]

The name and content of the book Journey to the West(西游记) by Wu Cheng'en is quite different from the book Journey to the West of the Perfect Man of Eternal Spring(长春真人西游记) by Li Zhichang. I don't think the book Journey to the West will attributed to Qiu Chuji.


Response to comment on Journey to the West[edit]

While I think everyone now agrees that Qiu Chuji did not write "Journey to the West" I believe that you are incorrect that the book has not been attributed to him. Perhaps you misunderstood my meaning-- my intent was to indicate that the book has been attributed to him, but that attirbution is unlikely to be correct. Please consider the following:


Monkey by Wu Cheng'en translated by Arthur Waley (one of the most popular translations of Journey to the West into English), Grove Press, 1943. In the 1984 edition at page three, in the Introduction by Dr. Hu Shih (the Chinese ambassador to the U.S. when the intro was written in 1942) you will find the following:

"Wu died without any children. The anonymity of the authorship of Monkey [here the author refers to "Journey to the West"] was so complete that for over three centuries the general reading public actually believed that the story was written by the Taoist Patriarch Chiu Ch'u-ki (1148-1227) who in 1219 was invited by Genghis Khan to visit him in Central Asia and who left a record of his travels under the title Hsi Yu Ki (Record of a Journey to the West), which is still regarded as a valuable contribution of the geographical knowledge of the time. It was the similarity in title and the seemingly allegorical character of the novel which were largely responsible for the erroneous attribution of authorship."


Please see also, Seven Taoist Masters: A Folk Novel of China translated by Eva Wong, Shambhala Classics, 1990. My understanding is that this is an anonymous folk novel that Ms. Wong has translated. At page 173 of the 2004 edition you will find the following text, which seems consistent with the report in Arthur Waley's book of the incorrect attribution of "Journey to the West":

"After his reconciliation with Zen Master Pai-yun, Ch'iu Ch'ang-ch'un left the daily administrative matters of White Cloud Monastery to his senior disciples and withdrew into solitude in preparation for his departure from the mortal realm. Drawing from his experience of the obstacles that he had encountered during his training, Ch'iu Ch'ang-ch'un wrote a book called Journey to the West. In it he discussed the pitfalls that obstruct the path to enlightenment. . . "

Since the story is so famous and apparently the misattribution was so widespread, it seems worthwhile to set the record straight here. If I have been mislead by the English langauge sources that I must rely on, then the note should come out. But Dr. Hu Shih seems a reliable source. Crypticfirefly

Thank you for your clarify. I agree with you now.--Skyfiler 02:45, August 22, 2005 (UTC)


ERROR IN PINYIN

The pinyin for his name lists incorrect tones - it should be qiu1 chu3ji1, no chu4ji1.  chu4 means place, it is a noun, chu3 means to dwell in or at, it is a verb.  It's easy to see his name should be chu3ji1 - ji1 here is being used to mean the essence or nature of things, and the name means he is dwelling or residing in the essence of things.  I'm afraid I don't have a cite for this, but for someone who is familar with naming conventions of this period it is obviouse.

Also, it should be chang2chun1zi3, ie the zi is not neutral tone, but rather is it's full tone.  The zi3 used in names is almost always full tone, especially where as here it is used respectfully.

Closest thing I can come to a cite is to tell you to watch one of the television adapations of jinyong's 射雕英雄传 and just listen to how they pronounce the name - granted they screw up alot of pronounciations, so its not terribly authorititative, but as I said this name is fairly obviouse.

I don't know how to edit wikipedia pages, so I'll leave it to someone else to edit the page, should they agree.

~~~~  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.119.9.27 (talk) 13:05, 27 July 2011 (UTC)