Talk:Religions by country

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
          This article is of interest to the following WikiProjects:
WikiProject Countries (Rated List-class)
WikiProject icon This article is within the scope of WikiProject Countries, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of countries on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.
 List  This article has been rated as List-Class on the project's quality scale.
 
WikiProject Religion (Rated List-class, High-importance)
WikiProject icon This article is within the scope of WikiProject Religion, a project to improve Wikipedia's articles on Religion-related subjects. Please participate by editing the article, and help us assess and improve articles to good and 1.0 standards, or visit the wikiproject page for more details.
 List  This article has been rated as List-Class on the project's quality scale.
 High  This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.
 


Comments[edit]

This page should include an entry for Germany. Denial 17:28, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Sorry!I've forgotten Germany!I will add Germany now!Thanks for your reply!Angelo De La Paz 01:54, 24 October 2007 (UTC)


Non-Religious?[edit]

It seems that there is a big issue with what is classified to be 'non-religious'. People who say that they are of a faith system (even if they are not formally members/attend services) should not be put in such a system. I fail to see how not attending formal religious services makes a person 'non-religious'! Bennyj600 (talk) 00:20, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Articles and posts on Wikipedia or other open wikis should never be used as third-party sources.[edit]

The heading above was quoted from Wikipedia's verifiability policy. This article violates that policy. -- Boracay Bill 01:32, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

Excuse me!Could could tell me more and detailed what is the violations of this article?Thank you!Angelo De La Paz 01:54, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

The Afghanistan, Bhutan, Brunei, Cambodia, China (Including Tibet), Czech Republic, India, North Korea, South Korea, Luxembourg, Nauru, Peru, Philippines, Poland, Singapore, Slovakia, United States, and Vietnam entries all said "Wikipedia, ..." in the References & Sources column. It looks like the only Wikipedia source actually cited was for Afghanistan. When I made this talk page remark initially, I didn't have the the time to look at details. Now that I've done that, I have removed those Wikipedia citations. I still have not tried to verify that the cited sources do in fact support the associated assertions, and may not have time to do that. -- Boracay Bill 10:11, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

Oh, I see!Thank you so much!Good luck!Angelo De La Paz 21:18, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

Featured list[edit]

I want to nominate this article as a Featured list on the basis of the WP:WIAFL. What's your idea?Angelo De La Paz 00:51, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

Identification of supporting sources[edit]

Focusing on just identification of supporting sources, I see the following in the article (excerpt):

Religions by country as 2007
Country or Territory Christian Muslim Buddhist Hindu Others Atheist Notes References & Sources
 Afghanistan 0.1% 99% 0.3% 0.2% 0.4%* n/a *: Including Parsees, Baha'is,Sikhs, etc... [1][2][3]
 Albania 30% 70% n/a n/a n/a n/a [4][5][6]

I have a difficult time relating the "References & Sources" items to the assertions which these items are supposed to be supporting. How about a more conventional alternative, something like the following (note—I have edited the assertions in the table, attempting to conform them to info from the cited supporting sources):

Religions by country as 2007
Country or Territory Christian Muslim Buddhist Hindu Others Atheist Notes
 Afghanistan 0.02%[1] 97.89%[1]
99%[2][3]
0.3%[citation needed] 0.35%[1] 1.72%[1]*
1%[2][3]
0.01%[1] *: Including Parsees, Baha'is, Sikhs, Traditional ethnic, etc.[1]
 Albania 30%[4][5] 70%[4][5] n/a n/a n/a n/a

References[edit]

  1. ^ a b c d e f Country Profile: Afghanistan (Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan), Religious Intelligence Ltd., retrieved 2007-11-15 
  2. ^ a b Background Note: Afghanistan, Bureau of South and Central Asian Affairs, U.S. Department of State, May 2007, retrieved 2007-11-14 
  3. ^ a b Afghanistan, People, CIA World Factbook, November 1, 2007, retrieved 2007-11-14 
  4. ^ a b Background Note: Albania, U.S. Department of State, Bureau of European and Eurasian Affairs, September 2007, retrieved 2007-11-14 
  5. ^ a b Albania, People, CIA World Factbook, November 1, 2007, retrieved 2007-11-15 

-- Boracay Bill 05:12, 14 November 2007 (UTC)


Hi Boracay Bill!I think your suggestions are not too bad but it will make this article has more problems and make the readers feeling uncomfortable , very difficult to read the sources or edit it, etc...It contains over 200 countries/territories and if you make the table as your 2nd choice so it will be more confused and heavier at least 5 times!I think this article is OK now!Look at what was happened with article of Christianity by country of User:Vexorg

Angelo De La Paz 05:56, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Accuracy[edit]

Some of the Buddhism figures here seem to be drawn from wildly inflated estimates on Buddhist propaganad websites. Peter jackson (talk) 12:01, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

Merger proposal[edit]

Both Christianity by country and Religions by country are hopeless messes of original research, synthesis and abuse of statistics.

For example, Christianity by country tells us that Anguilla is 90.5% Christian. The source does not say this. It says: Anglican 29%, Methodist 23.9% other Protestant 30.2% Roman Catholic 5.7% other Christian 1.7% other 5.2% none or unspecified 4.3%

To get the 90.5%, we have to decide which of those categories are "Christian" and which aren't, then (ignoring statistical problems with doing so) add them up.

So, Anglicans, Methodists, other Protestants, Roman Catholics, and other Christians are Christians. Unspecified and other (9.5% of the population) are not. Messy at least.

The same source was used for Belize. The source says: Roman Catholic 49.6% Protestant 27% (Pentecostal 7.4%, Anglican 5.3%, Seventh-Day Adventist 5.2%, Mennonite 4.1%, Methodist 3.5%, Jehovah's Witnesses 1.5%) other 14% none 9.4%

Before my edit, Roman Catholic + Protestant = 76.6 Christian. Are any of the "other" 14% Christian? Who knows? But at least we established that Jehovah's Witnesses are Christians. Except in other countries, where we decided they weren't.

Ditto Mormons. Sometimes they're Christians, sometimes they aren't.

In the zeal to come up with a single number for every country, the various editors threw caution (and Statistics 101) to the wind and took matters into their own hands. It produced a nice, tidy table full of garbage.

And don't get me started about the years for sources and multiplying a bad 2002 figure of 76% Christian and a 2007 population estimate of 301,139,947 to arrive at exactly 228,866,359 Christians in the U.S.

Basically, it looks like one big table won't work. The figures are neither compatable nor complete. I think the best we can do is a heading for each country with a selection of stats from reliable sources and a link the to "Religion in Country X" article.

Mdsummermsw (talk) 17:35, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

I do not see the need for a merge. Having a table with the major affiliations is very useful. It sounds like the figures must be sourced in a more robust manner rather than doing a merge. -- Alan Liefting- (talk) - 10:55, 12 April 2008 (UTC)
A single table WOULD be useful. However, we do not have reliable data for 245 of 295 countries listed in Christianity by country. The remaining countries use data from a variety of sources and present the data as if it is comparable. When two sources use widely divergent definitions of "Christian", their results cannot be meaningfully compared. Are "Christians":
- Those who self-identify as such when asked.
- Those who identify as belonging to a religion that the poll deems to be Christian.
- Those who are listed as members of a church that the poll deems to be Christian.
- The percentage of the population not specifically identified as belonging to a non-Christian religion, adjusted downward by the percentage of the population who say they "believe in God" (yes, really).
- Some other definition.
Actually, it seems most in Religions by country are using seat-of-the-pants original research.
Angola. The source says: "Catholic Church estimates 55% Catholic, but this figure can not be verified....Ministry of Culture says Protestant traditions...estimated 10%.... African Christian 25% are believed to be followers. 5% are believed to be Brazilian Evangelical". Add the unverifiable estimate of the Catholic Church, data from the Ministry of Culture and the percentages "believed to be" African Christian or Brazilian Evangelical, we get 95%. Not a figure I'd be willing to defend, given its origins.
One of the sources for Aruba is a report on Armenia.
The British Virgin Islands has two sources, one with figures that add up to 96% Christian (WP:SYN which was used) and one which states outright that 86% are Christian (which was not used).
The source used for Columbia essentially says there are various conflicting claims. One of the sources it mentions is selected for the Christian figure. To fit the data with the table, that source's "Agnostics" became "Atheists".
United Kingdom 35% to 71.6% Christian? Two U.S. Government sources cited give 71.6% and 72% (the second is probably just rounding the first). The 35%? This source, which does not give a percentage of Christians at all, but says 38% in the UK said "I believe there is a God". Take that 38%, subtract 3% (for the Muslims, I guess), squint really hard and Bingo!: 35% Christian (works for France and a number of others as well).
Is that "useful"? For what? - Mdsummermsw (talk) 15:48, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

This merger proposal is a bad idea. It will not make the links or the stat's any less messy. If anything merge Christianity by country with Roman Catholicism by country and Protestantism by country. That at least could work format-wise.--Carlaude (talk) 16:22, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Atheist[edit]

I changed Atheist to "Non-religious". Although "Non-religious" includes, or at least in most peoples opinion, atheists, "Atheism" doesn't include agnostics, deists and "people who believe something, but are not interested in organized religion". For example: To the Eurobarometre only 8% of Austrians say, they don't believe in any kind of god, life force or spirit, but this site states a number of atheists between 14% and 46% (!), which is more probably the number of all people considering themself non-religious. So that's quite a huge difference. (And sorry for my bad english, I'm not so good with that language although I have no problem reading something in English.) 62.47.184.208 (talk) 15:44, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Non-Muslims in Saudi Arabia[edit]

According to the latest census of US Department of States there is about 28.5 million in Saudi Arabia, including an estimated foreign population of more than 8 million. The foreign population reportedly includes 1.6 million Indians, 1.5 million Bangladeshis, 1.2 million Filipinos, 1 million Pakistanis, 1 million Egyptians, 600,000 Indonesians, 400,000 Sri Lankans, 350,000 Nepalese, 250,000 Palestinians, 150,000 Lebanese, 100,000 Eritreans, and 30,000 Americans (Source: [7]).That means:

  • Christianity: 4.5% or over 1.3 million Christians (Predominant of about 90% of Filipinos, Americans, Europeans; parts of Eritreans, Lebanese and others).Read more in Christianity in Saudi Arabia
  • Hinduism: 4.5% or over 1.3 million Hindus (at least 1 million among 1.6 million Indians and predominantly of Nepalese).Read more in Hinduism in Arab states
  • Buddhism: 1.4% or over 400 thousand Buddhists (93% of Sinhalese people from Sri Lanka; remainders are from East Asian countries as China, Vietnam, Thailand, etc...). Read more in Buddhism in Middle East
  • Others as Sikhs, Baha'is, Jews, etc...all is common 0.5% or less than 30K people

Overall Muslim numbers is including native Saudi Muslims and foreign Muslims (from Pakistan, Bangladesh, Egypt, Indonesia, etc...) is only 89% as maximum and it's 100% with 22 million native Saudi Arabian citizens.It means the numbers of Muslims is from over 20 million (100% of Saudi Arabia's citizens only) to 25.5 million (including both foreign Muslims and citizens).

04:52, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

Yes you have provided a source to those, but this '89%' is a claim which is based on original research, which conflicts with Wikipedia's guidelines. You cannot use the information of ethnic groups and believe each of these different ethnic groups have a different religion, it's nonsense. You might not know that there may be high numbers of Muslims in any of these, Ethnic group is not related to Religion. Unless you find a direct source which says '89% Muslim' in Saudi Arabia then that is fine, but at the moment these sources are useless, biased and unreliable, plus you violated Wikipedia's policies: Wikipedia:No original research. The only statistic from CIA shows is, '100%'. I believe you should add 100%, but add a '*' next to it, explaining only Citizen count. Mohsin (talk) 16:21, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

I've added the note that is 100% of Saudi citizens must be Muslims before based on CIA Factbook. But in the recent year estimates of US Department of States (the same level agency as CIA) has found non-Muslim populations in Saudi Arabia is very large with over 1 to 1.5 million Christians and Hindus each. And small numbers of Buddhist, Sikhs, Baha'is, etc...And it's growing year after year and thus making the overall Muslim in SA declining from 91% (2006) to 89% (2007) and now is only 87.7% because in fact, the Christian percentage is up to 5% of the total population of SA while other religions are not changing much. I am very generous with you many times because I still keep the old census of last year as I did with your such favorite articles as Islam by country, Muslim majority countries so now I think you should know it. And I want to say this to all the Muslims: YOU MUST RESPECT OTHER RELIGIONS OR OTHER PEOPLE BEFORE YOU WANT EVERYBODY THINK GOOD ABOUT ISLAM AND MUSLIMS. That's all my requests. Angelo De La Paz (talk) 16:32, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

I completely agree with you. This person is a religious fanatic and keeps changing religion-related information (mostly in majority Muslim countries) according to his ideological views, without respecting the opinion of other people, or the sensitivities of people belonging to other faiths. Ayça Leovinus (talk) 17:47, 4 October 2008 (UTC)
Sorry I have to completely disagree with you there, because I have not removed any content of other religions or in fact you should know, that I have moved many of the info to Religion in Turkey, and I have expanded the Kemalism ideologies, and added various informations of populations of Jews and Christians. Mohsin (talk) 20:57, 4 October 2008 (UTC)
Again there is clear evidence of Original Research made by you I am very generous. You have no rights to decide what the real statistics of Religion is in Saudi Arabia, please cite a source where it clearly says 89%, if you can't, will what can I say, the data you have provided is biased and you should be old enough to know that by now. And I think there's no point of discussing this matter, seeing that you view every edit by others as vandalism, while it is a Good Faith edit, this article should be reviewed by an administrator. Mohsin (talk) 16:41, 2 October 2008 (UTC)
If you view many other internet links or sources, you will find nearly all say '100% Muslim', the non-Muslims are regarded as non-Citizens, therefore the non-Muslim population is excluded from those statistics. Cannot find any other sources which contradict that stat. Mohsin (talk) 16:59, 2 October 2008 (UTC)
It does look better know and less biased. Estimated should be added though. Mohsin (talk) 09:21, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

Turkey[edit]

The most comprehensive statistics of Religions in Turkey is available from the CIA, which show 99.8% Muslim, and 0.2% Christian and Jewish (120,000 Christians and 26,000 Jews). The statistic 99% is just a summary and rounded up by the US Department of State sources, and the Buddhist percentage source, is unreliable because 0.10% will have a figure of over 70,000 Buddhists in Turkey (that would make them larger than the Jews - second largest and no record of Buddhists), and the source does not cite percentages of the Jewish community which is one of the main minority religions. Mohsin (talk) 11:00, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

France[edit]

The non-religious statistic for France is impossibly low (1 digit), also it contradicts the religion in France Page and the CIA World Factbook. 24.65.95.239 (talk) 22:30, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Agreed. It also contradicts this http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Europe_belief_in_god.png and this http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Europe-atheism-2005.png These figures however may be hard to obtain as, if I recall correctly, religious or racial census are forbidden, at least for governmental organizations.--Iv (talk) 11:44, 25 November 2008 (UTC)

New Discussion[edit]

A discussion has been started at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Countries/Lists of countries which could affect the inclusion criteria and title of this and other lists of countries. Editors are invited to participate. Pfainuk talk 12:24, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

Religion in Albania[edit]

The majority of Albanians today are non-religious (Usa Government). The datas for the non-religious population are there. But there are no data to affirm that 70% is Muslim !!! Are you kidding? The Albanians are 100% religious? This is ridiculous!!

Non religious are 60-75% and don't modify it please.

Se the voice Religion in Albania —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dessy92 (talkcontribs) 19:16, 25 May 2009 (UTC)


http://www.scribd.com/doc/15738681/Feja-ne-Shqiperi1 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dessy92 (talkcontribs) 19:21, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

Footnote section[edit]

I removed this, as what it did was to discuss autonomous and secessionist areas without giving any relevance of this detail to the issue of religious belief. Fences&Windows 21:26, 19 June 2009 (UTC)

Split into templates[edit]

I thought it would be a good idea to split this article into templates, like it's done at LGBT rights by country, due to this article being so long by now. What's anyone else say? Munci (talk) 18:58, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

  • Split each sortable table into a new article - Article is over 300 kB and should be split apart. --Jax 0677 (talk) 22:51, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

Jews in Aghanistan[edit]

Because of Zablon Simitriv,I changed the number of Jewish people in Afghanistan to 1 instead of 0. Since it is such a small number I left it at 0%.Is this okay? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Leoesb1032 (talkcontribs) 01:17, 3 October 2013 (UTC)