Talk:Russian Empire

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Monarchy[edit]

Wasn't the Russian Empire a constitutional monarchy from 1906 to the end of the empire? There was a Constitution and there was a legislative assembly.

Accrording to the connstitution it was an absolute monarchy. And the assembly had the right to discuss legislation, not to pass it. Hellerick (talk) 04:40, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

However it fits the definition of constitutional monarchy even though it really a absolute monarchy.

According to Wikipedia:
A constitutional monarchy is a form of government in which a monarch acts as head of state within the perimeters of a written (i.e., codified), unwritten (i.e., uncodified) or blended constitution. It differs from absolute monarchy in that an absolute monarch serves as the sole source of political power in the state and is not legally bound by any constitution.
According to the Basic Law of the Russian Empire:
4. Императору Всероссийскому принадлежит Верховная Самодержавная Власть. Повиноваться власти Его не только за страх, но и за совесть Сам Бог повелевает.
To the Emperor of All Russia belongs the Highest Autocratic Authority. To obey His authority, not only in fear, but in conscience, the God Himself enjoins.
The monarch had no "perimeters"; the constitution did bound the citizens, not the emperor. Hellerick (talk) 03:56, 12 November 2009 (UTC)
But according to the Absolute monarchy page and the Constitutional monarchy it states and I quote
Some monarchies have powerless or symbolic parliaments and other governmental bodies that the monarch can alter or dissolve at will. Despite effectively being absolute monarchies, they are technically constitutional monarchies due to the existence of a constitution and national canon of law.
As originally conceived, a constitutional monarch was quite a powerful figure, head of the executive branch even though his or her power was limited by the constitution and the elected parliament. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.160.227.168 (talk) 22:23, 12 November 2009 (UTC)
His power were also limited by the Russian Constitution of 1906 it says
Act. 44-No new law can be enacted without the approval of the State Council and the State Duma, and it shall not be legally binding without the approval of the Sovereign Emperor.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.160.227.168 (talk) 22:23, 12 November 2009 (UTC)
No law. The emperor did not need laws to rule the country, he was issuing decrees. The emperor's decrees were enacted immediately, while Duma's laws had no power unless they were approved by the emperor. Hellerick (talk) 03:24, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

There WAS a legal code as well as decrees issued. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.206.246.242 (talk) 02:35, 2 April 2010 (UTC)

"Last Absolute Monarchies." Wasn't Austria and later Germany also absolute Monarchies. In this sense the first and second French Empire also count as so. If these empires mentionned are not absolute in the sense that a constitution existed then Russia would also have been considered constitutional. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.206.246.242 (talk) 02:34, 2 April 2010 (UTC)

Land mass[edit]

22.4 Mio km^2 are not 1/3 of earth's land mass. Earth's land mass is 148.3 Mio km^2. So either it's 44.5 Mio. km^2 or almost 1/6 of earth's land mass.

Please please[edit]

Please could someone create or link to a map of Imperial Russia with its SUBDIVISONS outlined? On wiki we have the sub divisions for the USSR and modern Russia but not imperial Russia. Maybe starting from 1900s?

-G

Map[edit]

I'd like someone to find a map of Imperial Russia. I'm sure the territory it covered was huge! --Cogent 03:16, 28 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Indeed it was. May be a little later, but generous Tev has provided us with one. Эйрон Кинни (t) 07:59, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

Influence at Falklands,Southern Georgia & southern sandwich ''? AleG 11:45, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Russian Empire or Imperial Russia?[edit]

Why is the title "Imperial Russia" and not the "Russian Empire" like it was listed in the Russian history index originally? It seems to me merely to be the differences in emphasis on the nation and the type. Somebody may one day do a Chinese Empire instead of Imperial China, or the other way around. Consistency, if necessary, would be nice. --Menchi 20:53 10 Jul 2003 (UTC)

There's a subtle difference between 'Russian Empire' and 'Imperial Russia'. The latter term IMHO emphasizes the fact that this is a phase of history, and that Russia became imperial, whereas China is called an empire throughout most of its history. I also think that the modern sense of 'empire' as 'a nation that rules over others' isn't so strong in the adjectival form. So I think the present form should stay. --Smack 19:34, 30 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Russian Empire is a literal translation of official country name in 1721-1917. Imperial Russia is a vague term reflecting, in its most vast sense, the period of 1480-1991, when the policy of Russian rulers was imperial. Dr Bug  (Volodymyr V. Medeiko) 21:35, 30 Jul 2004 (UTC)
I don't think that the Russian hegemony in the USSR can or should be described as "imperial" or as an "empire". Such a terminology seems both pretentious and reminds of McCarthyism. --Joy [shallot] 13:59, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)
1480-1991 clearly exceeds the scope of this article. It is not about Muscovy, neither does it deal with the Soviet Union. Therefore Russian Empire seems to be the only reasonably subject. --Johannes Rohr 21:01, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

I would prefer this article to be moved back to Russian Empire.  "Imperial Russia" is meaningless.  And Soviet Union, although being sometimes named "Soviet Empire", never was named "Russian Empire". — Monedula 16:32, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Imperial Russia is also wrong in the sense that the Russian Empire consisted of far more than modern Russia, think of Alaska, Finland, most of historical Poland and most of the later Soviet Union. Is there anyone opposing this? Else I would move this article back within seven days from now.--Johannes Rohr 14:03, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Imperial - Control of many countries by a monarch. Empire - Control of many countries by another country (their head of state).

-G —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.24.149.137 (talk) 01:15, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Russian Empire translating as Российская Империя - right term, also Imperial Russia wrong term which can translated in Russian as Time in history of russia —Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.37.22.40 (talk) 01:34, 1 March 2009 (UTC)

Map, Coat of Arms?[edit]

Crossposted from Wikipedia_talk:Wikiportal/Russia:

Imperial Russia is a navigational article that refers to four articles that correspond to four periods of the Russian History between the end of 17th and beginning of the 20th century. Each of these articles is very good and I don't think it is a good idea to try to move the info from them back to Imperial Russia article. These historic articles are in a great shape, especially if compared to many important ru-related topics. -Irpen 02:48, Jun 6, 2005 (UTC)

I still think what Imperial Russia article can be improved a lot...there is no map, no coat of arms etc., nothing comparable to articles on Ottoman, German or Austro-Hungarian empires. (Fisenko 02:52, 6 Jun 2005 (UTC))
Agreed, let's just make sure that we don't mean moving the text on history from one of four narrower articles. Irpen 03:09, Jun 6, 2005 (UTC)

"Flag 1914-1917" is damn wrong. It was never used as an official flag, Nicholas II only authorised anyone who wished so to fly that flag personally, as it purported to symbolise the union between the country (tricolour) and the royal family (coat of arms). The reason for this innovation was to boost morale during WWI.


Map Again[edit]

The map of imperial Russia in 1913 is wrong. The territory covered may be right, but other countries have incorrect boundaries. In particular, the Ottoman empire covered most of the Near East, Alsace-Lorraine was part of Germany, not of France at that time, and the Austrian empire is missing.

I suspect this map to come from a modern one.

Images[edit]

the congestion of many pics of different sizes and shapes at the top of the page gives it an extremely ugly appearance. In the past I tried to change this, but was reverted. People, what's wrong with your eyes? mikka (t) 18:49, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Infobox[edit]

I've created an infobox for this page, located at Template: Imperial Russia infobox, but I can't seem to get it to integrate properly into the article. If anyone wants to look over it and see if they can get it to work properly, they're welcome to. Tev 19:45, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

Okay, I had to play with it a bit but I seem to have made the bloody little thing work right. Tev 15:35, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Keep it here or switch?[edit]

It seems the previous consensus was to move this article to Russian Empire, which I personally agree with. Provided noone has any objections by the day after tomorrow, I'm going to ask an admin to switch 'em around. Tev 15:37, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Done. Also move-protected. —Nightstallion (?) 10:50, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

Flag[edit]

The flag used now is the traditional flag of Russia since the times of Peter the Great who used the colours often seen in Europe upon his return. The Gold, White and Black flag was only used between the years 1858-1883 and was never popular. After this the traditional red-white-blue flag returned. The statement on the image which states this was the official flag throughout the period of the Russian Empire is wrong.


From 1883 to 1917 the official flag of the Russian Empire is described by many sources as Image:Flag of Russia.svg, but the article has a different flag featured in the infobox. So which is it? Эйрон Кинни (t) 20:41, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

The flag that was/possibly will be again be used was that of the Romanov Dynasty, and was the flag previously listed on this page as that of the Empire. I'd personally say go with that, but it says in your edit that you found this other flag being used at the Finnish wikipedia? If that's the case then, as it is a feautred article, perhaps we should use it. I'm more than open to discussion, but if you don't object I'll change it back to what it was, since that is what it was originally listed as. As a side note, if you speak any Finnish it would be a big help if you could translate some of that article and bring it over here. This article is woefully inadequate, and while I'm trying to bulk it up a bit, I need to do much more research before I'll be able to do a whole lot. Tev 22:10, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

Both flags where replaced at the begining of World War I by a new flag. Information, as well as an image, can be found at http://flagspot.net/flags/ru_1914.html. Scotishman 18:00, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

This is flag provisional government, for the private use. NOOB Scotishman --HungerGhost (talk) 09:39, 13 December 2007 (UTC) Quote:

http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Флаг_Российской_Империи

Несмотря на то, что Пётр I разработал за свою жизнь огромное количество флагов (различные варианты Андреевского флага, штандарты царя Московского и императора Всероссийского, варианты гюйсов и проч.), государственный флаг Российской империи им так и не был установлен.

Преемники Петра почти полтора века продолжали эту «традицию»: несмотря на широкое использование в быту русского бело-сине-красного триколора, юридически его статус в качестве флага Российской империи не был установлен.

В 1858 году в царствование императора Александра II председатель геральдической палаты Российской империи барон Кене обратил внимание государя на то, что цвета государственного флага России не совпадают с цветами государственного герба (что шло вразрез с правилами немецкой геральдики). Несмотря на то, что в действительности цвета русского флага соответствовали цветам центрального, древнейшего изображения государственного герба империи, а именно — герба Москвы, барону Кене удалось убедить императора в необходимости создания нового флага.

[[Изображение:Flag of the Habsburg Monarchy.svg|thumb|Флаг Австрийской империи (1804—1867), династический флаг Габсбургов]]

Не исключено, что на решение принять чёрно-жёлто-белый флаг в качестве государственного флага Российской империи повлияло то обстоятельство, что ещё одна империя того времени — Австрийская — использовала сходный флаг, представлявший собой чёрно-жёлтое полотнище (цвета Священной Римской империи германской нации XVXIX веков).

Указом Александра II от 11 июня 1858 года был введён чёрно-жёлто-белый «флаг гербовых цветов»: «Описание Высочайше утвержденного рисунка расположения гербовых цветов Империи на знаменах, флагах и других предметах, употребляемых для украшений при торжественных случаях. Расположение сих цветов горизонтальное, верхняя полоса чёрная, средняя жёлтая (или золотая), а нижняя белая (или серебряная). Первые полосы соответствуют чёрному государственному орлу в желтом поле, и кокарда из сих двух цветов была основана императором Павлом I, между тем как знамена и другие украшения из сих цветов употреблялись уже во времена царствования императрицы Анны Иоанновны. Нижняя полоса белая или серебряная соответствует кокарде Петра Великого и императрицы Екатерины II; император же Александр I, после взятия Парижа в 1814 году, соединил правильную гербовую кокарду с древней Петра Великого, которая соответствует белому или серебряному всаднику (Св. Георгию) в московском гербе». Указ утверждён Сенатом по докладу министра императорского двора графа В. Адлерберга[1].

[[Изображение:Romanov Flag.svg|thumb|Флаг гербовых цветов Российской империи (1858—1883), династический флаг Романовых]]

Однако российское общество не принимало этот новый символ государственной власти: в сознании русских чёрно-жёлтые цвета ассоциировались с Австрией и правящим там домом Габсбургов. В империи параллельно существовало два флага: чёрно-жёлто-белый — национальный «де-юре» и бело-сине-красный — национальный «де-факто», причём предпочтения населения повсеместно отдавались последнему.

Император Александр III, известный своими русофильскими настроениями, во время коронации обратил внимание на контраст в Москве: Кремль был украшен и вся процессия одета в бело-жёлто-чёрное, а в городе преобладали бело-сине-красные цвета. Была назначена комиссия из авторитетных лиц под председательством генерал-адъютанта адмирала К. Н. Посьета. Комиссия вынесла следующее решение: «Бело-сине-красный флаг, учреждённый императором Петром Великим, имеет за собой почти 200-летнюю давность. В нём замечаются и геральдические данные: московский герб изображает белого всадника в синем плаще на красном поле. Подтверждением этим цветам служат и флаги в военном флоте: 1-я линия обозначается красным, 2-я — синим и 3-я — белым флагом с Андреевским крестом в крыже. Контр- и вице-адмиральские флаги соответственно имеют красную и синюю полосы, наконец, гюйс составлен из цветов: белого, синего и красного. С другой стороны, бело-жёлто-чёрный цвета ни исторических, ни геральдических основ за собой не имеют». — На основании решения комиссии адмирала Посьета национальным флагом был высочайше утверждён бело-сине-красный[2].

right|thumb|Флаг Российской империи «для частного употребления» (1914—1917) 28 апреля 1883 года (7 мая 1883 года это решение было включено в Собрание узаконений Российской империи) Александром III было издано «Повеление о флагах для украшения зданий в торжественных случаях», предписывавшее использовать исключительно бело-сине-красный флаг. Чёрно-жёлто-белый с этого момента считался династическим флагом царствующего дома Романовых. Согласно другим данным, противоречащим данному утверждению, бело-сине-красный флаг высочайше утверждается императором Александром III лишь «для коммерческих судов»[3].

Последний русский император Николай II в 1896 году окончательно закрепил за бело-сине-красным флагом статус единственного государственного флага Российской империи.

С началом Первой Мировой войны в 1914 году для поднятия патриотизма населения особым циркуляром министерства иностранных дел был введён дополнительный имперский флаг «для употребления в частном быту». Он отличался от государственного флага империи жёлтым квадратом с чёрным двуглавым орлом (композиция, соответствующая дворцовому штандарту императора). Орёл изображался без титульных гербов на крыльях, квадрат перекрывал белую и около четверти синей полосы флага. Однако этот флаг не получил распространения; вопреки распространённому заблуждению, он никогда не был государственным флагом Российской империи. Новый флаг не вводился как обязательный, его использование лишь «разрешалось». Символика флага подчёркивала единение царя с народом.

Official flag Russian Empire: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f3/Flag_of_Russia.svg (1721—1917) —Preceding unsigned comment added by HungerGhost (talkcontribs) 20:11, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

The abdication[edit]

The abdication was to Mikhail, and Mikhail declared that he will not rule until the Constitutional Assemly gathered and ordered the Provisional government to rule. The state officially continued being empire.--Nixer 16:17, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

The end of the Empire is generally regarded to have been upon the abdication of Nikolay II, as upon his abdication his brother refused the crown, and the rule of the Tsats was over. While it may not have been technically over, that's up to the reader to decide, the Romanovs had no say in the government after that. Tev 03:57, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Reverted changes[edit]

As I tried to explain in my edit, this article is not up to code. I took the information with the intention of editing it to make it into something unique. I'd think that if someone is looking for information on the Russian Empire, however, they would be looking at this page, rather than going to History of Russia. Regardless, I'm happy to leave it at this and slowly try to add information if that's what's preferable on Wikipedia. Tev 16:07, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Please don't try to duplicate information contained in other articles, especially by pillaging them. I came to this page to find a link to Russian history, 1682-1796 and was surprized that it was gone. Therefore, please don't remove links to main articles either. You may add a short summary of each article here, provided that the links to the main articles remain. You may want to check History of Russia to see how it may be effected. --Ghirla -трёп- 16:11, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Addition of Russian Name and transliteration[edit]

I just added the Russian name of the Empire, "Российская империя" and its transliteration to the intro sentence, exactly following the style that Russia uses in its intro sentence. Hope this is helpful? T. S. Rice 07:03, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

For some reason, the "Russian" name isn't printed in proper Russian Cyrillic. It should read "Российская империя", not "Россiйская имперiя". Could somebody fix that, it's really bugging me. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.34.74.114 (talk) 01:29, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

Gerb[edit]

Discussion regarding a revert war episode her, moved from my talk page:


"State Seal" is U.S. terminology for its states. All other country's emblem are traditionally called "coat of arms, although they often don't follow the rules of european heraldry. It is not the firt time in various languages that some words acquire new meanings. `'mikka (t) 17:32, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

In fact these were called "Большая государственная печать" and "Малая государственная печать" - Big State Seal and Minor State Seal respectively.--Nixer 17:35, 30 July 2006 (UTC)
I think there was change in terminology. I see that since Alexey Mikhailovich the term "gosudarstvenny gerb" was used. In National emblem of Belarus, the article author used the term "national emblem" to translate the term "gos. gerb", which, as I see, is suggested by some russian dictionaries. What do you think about this option?
Oliversi & bonaqua blocked. `'mikka (t) 17:38, 30 July 2006 (UTC)
I think it is good synonim both for seal and coat of arms. I support even idea to change all such words to the universal term "emblem".--Nixer 18:24, 30 July 2006 (UTC)
In fact these are the State Emblems - Big and Small Coats of Arms of the Russian Empire's. See http://geraldika.ru/symbols/29 and http://geraldika.ru/symbols/1368. Here it is precisely written Big and Small Coats of Arms of the Russian Empire's--Oliversi1 18:31, 30 July 2006 (UTC)
Various chaotic links prove nothing. http://russia.rin.ru/cgi-bin/guide_e.pl?id=4669 says "State Emblem". `'mikka (t) 19:30, 30 July 2006 (UTC)


I suggect to discuss this. Similar issue: articles National emblem of Belarus and Coat of arms of the Soviet Union say these things are not coats of arms.

Histgorically, times ago, Russia had "state seal" ("pechat") and "coat of arms" ("shchit") among state symbols. Later "gerb" was used, which is clearly not "shchit".

So I guess it is time to invoke reputable sources in Russian geraldry, rather than quotations from variuous amateurish websites. `'mikka (t) 19:41, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

mikka thank you for Big and Small Coats of Arms of the Russian Empire's. Now it is correct. Even on the site - СЕРВЕР НАЦИОНАЛЬНОГО ИНСТИТУТА ГЕРБА И ФЛАГА, ГЕРАЛЬДИЧЕСКИЙ СОВЕТ при Президенте РФ http://sovet.geraldika.ru/ write so. If you want to see it, put "Большой герб Российской империи or Малый герб Российской империи" in the search of these site and you can read this.--Oliversi1 17:08, 31 July 2006 (UTC) (this user is an established sockpuppet. +Hexagon1 (t) 10:10, 3 August 2006 (UTC))

The state symbols of the Russian Empire were defined in the Corpus of Laws of the Russian Empire: [1] (chapter 61). There was one gerb and three state seals (Big, Medium and Small)--Nixer 13:50, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for proper research. Indeed, the Russian Empire Coat of Arms is a regular escutcheon type and placed in the centre of the State Seal. (I started State symbols of Russian Empire, to close the issue for long) `'mikka (t) 15:51, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
I think this article should be linked there or that article merged here.--Nixer 18:18, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

See http://www.russianempire.ru/constitution.php, http://www.russianempire.ru/symbols.php, http://ruek.narod.ru/simvolika/gerb1.html, http://ruek.narod.ru/simvolika/large1.html, http://derzava.ru/simvolika/, http://derzava.ru/simvolika/gerb/gerb1.html, http://derzava.ru/simvolika/gerb/gerb2.html, http://geraldika.ru/symbols/29 and http://geraldika.ru/symbols/1368 Also on the site - СЕРВЕР НАЦИОНАЛЬНОГО ИНСТИТУТА ГЕРБА И ФЛАГА, ГЕРАЛЬДИЧЕСКИЙ СОВЕТ при Президенте РФ http://sovet.geraldika.ru/ write "Большой герб Российской империи or Малый герб Российской империи" - it is an official SERVER of NATIONAL INSTITUTE of the ARMS And FLAG, HERALDIC ADVICE at the President of Russia.

http://www.monarchruss.org - it is a good site, but not official. Even on this site (site provide by you) http://www.monarchruss.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=168&Itemid=28 write - Big, Medium and Small Coats of Arms of Russian empire. Yes, in Russian empire were Big, Medium and Small Coats of Arms and were three state seals (Big, Medium and Small). It is natural that State Seals had the form of Coats of Arms. Now too in all countries in the world the state seal is a copy of the State Emblem or has it. But the state symbols in all countries in the world are - a State Flag, a State Hymn and a State Coats of Arms and sometimes the State Motto. The State Seal is not a primary symbol of the states. It is an indirect or secondary symbol. In all clauses in wikipedia about the countries and the states in the table about the given country specified only a Flag, a Hymn and a Coats of Arms and sometimes the motto, but not State Seal

"Большой российский государственный герб, Высочайше утвержденный 3 ноября 1882 года, есть в золотом щите черный двуглавый орел, коронованный двумя императорскими коронами, над которыми такая же, но в большем виде, корона, с двумя развевающимися концами ленты Андреевского ордена. Государственный орел держит золотые скипетр и державу. На груди орла герб Московский. Щит увенчан шлемом святого великого князя Александра Невского. Намет черный с золотом. Вокруг щита цепь ордена св. апостола Андрея Первозванного; по сторонам изображения святых Архистратига Михаила и Архангела Гавриила. Сень золотая, коронованная императорскою короною, усеянная российскими орлами и подложенная горностаем. На ней червленная надпись: С Нами Бог! Над сенью государственная хоругвь, с восьмиконечным на древке крестом".

На золотом полотне хоругви изображен средний государственный герб, но без девяти окружающих его щитов. Главный щит окружен снизу девятью щитами с гербами владений, увенчанными соответствующими коронами. Над ним еще шесть щитов с территориальными гербами.

Средний государственный герб - тот же, что и большой, но без государственной хоругви и шести гербов над сенью. Он изображался на средней государственной печати, а также по особым указам Его Императорского Величества.

Малый государственный герб изображается без императорской сени, без щитоносцев и без родового герба императора; цепь ордена Андрея Первозванного помещается на груди орла вокруг щита с гербом Москвы, а гербы царств и Великих княжеств размещены на крыльях орла следующим образом: на правом крыле, в первом месте, герб Казанского царства; на левом, в первом месте, герб Астраханского царства; на правом крыле, во втором месте, герб Польского царства; на левом, во втором месте, герб Сибирского царства; на правом крыле, в третьем месте, герб Херсонеса Таврического; на левом, в третьем месте, герб Грузинского царства; на правом крыле, в четвертом месте, соединенные гербы Великих княжеств Киевского, Владимирского и Новгородского; на левом, в четвертом месте, герб Великого княжества Финляндского.

В таком виде, но в щите и с присоединением императорской сени, государственный герб изображается на малой государственной печати. На других малых печатях и в украшениях он может быть изображен без гербов на крыльях орла, но всегда с московским гербом на груди, окруженным цепью ордена Андрея Первозванного.

Когда малый государственный герб изображен в щите (который должен быть всегда золотым), то цепь ордена Андрея Первозванного окружает не московский герб на груди орла, а сам щит. По особым "высочайшим повелениям", которые объявлялись через Министра Императорского Двора, к малому государственному гербу могли быть добавлены: или сень, или же, когда орел помещен в щите, увенчанном Императорской короной, щитоносцы.--Livers 22:11, 4 August 2006 (UTC)


I have no idea what are you qouting from. The 1906 Russian Code of Law says differently. You write: "http://www.monarchruss.org - it is a good site, but not official". Are you implying that they falsified the text of the Law? Obvioulsy you are well-educated, but not an expert in Russian geraldry, and sorry, the text of the Law takes perecedence over all interpretations, unless some expert explaines what the heck is going on with terminology here. I see only one hint to explanation: your text mentions year 1882, while the Law quoted by Nixer is of 1906. `'mikka (t) 22:25, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Уважаемый mikka. Извините, что пишу здесь на русском языке, так как именно на родном языке можно высказаться более точнее. Я писал выше http://www.monarchruss.org - это - хороший сайт, но не официальный. Даже и на этом сайте (сайт представленный Nixer), http://www.monarchruss.org/index.php?Option=com_contenttask=viewid=168Itemid=28 пишут - Большие, Средние и Маленькие Гербы Российской империи - значит они всё же существовали. Да и в своде законов статья 61. Российский Государственный герб есть в золотом щите черный, двоеглавый орел, коронованный двумя Императорскими коронами, над которыми третья, такая же, в большем виде, корона с двумя развевающимися концами ленты ордена Святого Апостола Андрея Первозванного. Государственный орел держит золотые скипетр и державу. На груди орла герб Московский: в червленом щите Святый Великомученик и Победоносец Георгий, на коне, поражающий дракона золотым копьем. - это точное описание малого герба Рос. Империи. Раз гос.герб был, то где он в статье?
No it is not an exact description of the small COA. An exercise for your children (if any): find 10 (!) differences. `'mikka (t) 19:25, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

Ответ на ваш вопрос: Я не имел ввиду, что в разделе сайта http://www.monarchruss.org/library/svod_zakonov.htm сфальсифицировали свод законов. Одно другому не противоречит. И о гос.гербах и о гос. печатях пишут и на сайтах представленных Nixer и на сайтах представленных мной. В 1906 году была принята и конституция рос. империи:

На подлинных Собственною Его Императорского Величества рукою написано:

"БЫТЬ ПО СЕМУ".

В Царском Селе, 23 апреля 1906 года. Также её подписал: Председатель Государственного Совета, граф Сольский.

В конституции (Зак. Осн. ст. 59). Большой Российский Государственный герб в полном его виде изображается на Государственной большой печати, также на тронах, балдахинах, в залах, назначенных для торжественных при Императорском Дворе собраний или для заседания высших присутственных мест, но не иначе, как по особым Высочайшим повелениям, объявляемым через Министра Императорского Двора. При сем определяется каждый раз, какие должны быть украшения вокруг главного герба и между окружающими его щитами прочих гербов Царств, Княжеств и Областей, упоминаемых в пространном титуле Его Императорского Величества.

(§6 сего приложения) Средний Государственный герб изображается в полном его виде изображается как на средней Государственной печати, так, по особенным указаниям Его Императорского Величества, и в других местах и случаях.

§8 Малый Государственный герб (§7 сего приложения), но в щите и с присоединением Императорской сени Государственный герб в полном его виде изображается на малой Государственной печати. На других малых печатях и в украшениях он может быть изображаем по §7 сего приложения и без гербов на крыльях орла, но всегда с Московским на груди гербом, окруженным цепью ордена Святого Апостола Андрея Первозванного.

§9 Когда малый Государственный герб изображен в щите (который должен быть всегда золотым), то цепь ордена Святого Апостола Андрея Первозванного окружает не Московский герб на груди орла, а самый щит.

§10 По особым, объявляемым чрез Министра Императорского Двора, Высочайшим повелениями к малому Государственному гербу могут быть присоединяемы: или Императорская сень (§1 сего приложения), как сие определено о малой Государственной печати (§8 сего приложения), или же, когда орел помещен в щите, увенчанном Императорской короной, изображения Святых Архистратига Михаила и Архангела Гавриила.

24 июля 1882 года было решено изменить цвет короны с золотого на серебряный и добавить в Большой герб Империи щиток с гербом Туркестана, и утверждён новый рисунок (Полный Свод Законов 1906, собр.3, т.II, №1035), а 3 ноября 1882 года утверждёны описание Большого герба и полный императорский титул. Описание Большого герба и полный императорский титул были утверждены также Императором Николаем II - (Полный Свод Законов 1906, собр.3, т. II, №1159).

Обновлённые версии Среднего и Малого гербов были изготовлены Гербовым отделением департамента Герольдии Правительствующего Сената, обсуждались по докладу бывшего министра юстиции статс-секретаря Набокова и были утверждены 23 февраля 1883 года и были утверждены Императором Николаем II - (Полный Свод Законов 1906, собр.3, т.III, №1402).

Вы пишите что я не эксперт в геральдике. Может вы и правы. Но я не считаю что в НАЦИОНАЛЬНОМ ИНСТИТУТЕ ГЕРБА И ФЛАГА и в ГЕРАЛЬДИЧЕСКОМ СОВЕТЕ при Президенте РФ сидят дураки. В этих организациях настоящие специалисты в данной области и я думаю они знают что пишут. Я уверен что эти люди читали и досконально изучали и своды законов и конституцию рос. империи и многие другие законы и указы того времени. Да и более подробной истории о происхождении гос. гербов России чем на сайте http://derzava.ru/simvolika/, http://derzava.ru/simvolika/gerb/gerb1.html, http://derzava.ru/simvolika/gerb/gerb2.html я нигде не видел. И на сайте Никсера о сводах законов и не на сайте http://www.russianempire.ru/constitution.php нет полных текстов даных документов.

Да, в Российской империи были и Большой, Средний и Малый Гос. Гербы и были три государственных печати (Большая, Средняя и Малая) - символ закона и власти для гос. лиц обладающих ими. Никсер абсолютно прав и не лжот - три гос. печати действительно были. Естественно, что государственные Печати имели форму Гербов. Теперь также во всех странах в мире государственная печать - копия государственного герба или включают его. Но государственные символы во всех странах в мире - государственный Флаг, государственный Гимн и государственные Гербы и иногда государственный Геральдический девиз. Государственная Печать не первичный символ государств. Это - косвенный или вторичный символ. Во всех пунктах в Википедии о странах и государствах в столбе с права с первичной основной информацией о данной стране под названием государства вставлены только Флаг, Гимн и Гербы и иногда геральдический девиз, но не государственная Печать. Государственная Печать - это символ власти, как например скипетр, держава, булава, шит и меч в разных странах. О трёх государственных печатях можно написать отдельно в этой статье, но не заменяя гос. гербы рос. империи. Гос. символы остаются гос. символами, а символы власти и закона остаются символами власти и закона. Поэтому не надо путать две разные вещи. Ещё в подтверждение своей правоты скажу, что печать не может быть разноцветной, а только одного цвета. Герб наоборот может быть разноцветным. Именно гербы, а не печати указаны на изображениях в статье.

Вот пример:

Russian Empire's Minor Coat of Arms
File:Small State Seal of Russian empire.gif
Russian Empire's Small State Seal
No it is not: "На краях печати Императорский титул в кратком виде (ст. 60, п. 2)." Imperial title missing. What you see here may well be the reverse of a 5-kopeck coin, well known to be used to forge the state seal. Нет это печать. В ст. 60, п. 2 написано:"В некоторых, законом определенных, случаях сей титул Императорского Величества употребляется и изображается краткий" ничего не сказанно о печатях!

.

--Livers 11:53, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

возврат того, кто признаёт только правым себя и мнение других его не интересует.Для меня П.С.З. 1906 г.,ред 1913 г. означает больше чем не полный свод законов на одной странице представленный вами.Где вы видели разноцветную печать? Таких просто не бывает в мире, ещё не придумали заправлять печать разными красками. В 1906 году тем более её не было. Гербы наоборот могут быть разноцветными, так как являуться картинками (рисунками). Посудите логически. Вы не годовалый человек и даже мало грамотный поймёт, что я прав и не будет позориться говоря о разноцветном гербе - печать.Да и Полный Свод Законов 1906, ред 1913, собр.3 чётко говорит в Российской империи были и Большой, Средний и Малый Гос. Гербы и были три государственных печати (Большая, Средняя и Малая). Если хотите вставить в статью эти три печати, то найди их картинки и вставь их. Я представил картинку малой гос. печати. Других я пока не нашёл, как найду представлю. А если вы настырно будете продолжать утверждать, что встатье печати, а не гербы то уберите их из статьи вообще. Печатям не место среди символов (эмблем) государства. Они ими не являются. Государственные символы во всех странах в мире - государственный Флаг, государственный Гимн и государственные Гербы и иногда государственный национальный девиз. Это знает даже первоклассник.Поймите наконец, что в этом споре вы не правы.Доказательств моей правоты много и они на лицо.--Livers 16:37, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

If you were more careful in reading what you cut and pasted, you would have presented a more solid argument in your favor. Namely, the key phrase is "какие должны быть украшения вокруг главного герба" . I.e., there is a notion of "Main State Coat of Arms" and its "embellishments". Now it remains to understand how the terms Big/small/middle "gerbs" were intgroduced and whether the tradition of embellishment of the COA is consistent with european tradition. so that we may formally use the word COA, rather than "state emblem" to translate the word "gerb", as suggested by a number of Russian Russian-English dictionaries, inlcuding Lingo (whoa! article missng!).

Second, your jokes about colours are out of place. The law says: "В большой Государственной печати ...над всем золотая усеянная", so I guess there was golden color in 1906.

Anyway, my main point was not to use this or that word, but to explain why there is an apparent discrepancy in terminology. Your goal was apparently to prove that I am wrong. Didn't it occur to you, that we both may be wrong?

As for "мнение других его не интересует", you are right: I don't care about anyone's opinions. I care only about others' arguments based on facts, with official definitions taking priority over other usages. `'mikka (t) 19:25, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

mikka спасибо за ответ! Также спасибо за аргументы представленные вами в мою пользу -" Namely, the key phrase is "какие должны быть украшения вокруг главного герба" . I.e., there is a notion of "Main State Coat of Arms" and its "embellishments". Now it remains to understand how the terms Big/small/middle "gerbs" were intgroduced and whether the tradition of embellishment of the COA is consistent with european tradition. so that we may formally use the word COA, rather than "state emblem" to translate the word gerb". Насчёт печатей и их цветов я имел ввиду, что печати могут быть одного или двух цветов, но не может быть много цветными как гербы. И что золотой цвет в 1906 году был я не отрицал. Насчёт "мнение других его не интересует" я говорил о Никсере, а не о Вас. И то что вы принимаете только факты я очень рад и считаю правильным. А для Никсера скажу раз он даёт информацию с определённого сайта (http://www.monarchruss.org/library/svod_zakonov.htm), то пусть с начало прочитает их полностью, а потом делает выводы. Даже в приведённым им же своде законов в статье 61. написано:"Примечание. Подробное описание Государственного герба и Государственной печати во всех видах и правила о употреблении их помещены в особом приложении (прил. I)". Это означает, что данный текст закона не полный и в нём нет всех вариантов гербов и печатей и их подробного описания и что есть приложение и существует полный свод законов Рос.Империи. Также авторы указанного сайта не просто пишут и о существовании трёх гербов (http://www.monarchruss.org/index.php?Option=com_contenttask=viewid=168Itemid=28). Они не дураки и изучили те законы в которых говорится, то о чём они пишут.--Livers 22:24, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

1850 Map[edit]

Just a small point, but I'm pretty sure that in 1850 Russia didn't control the whole Amur region over in the Far East, or a lot of the Caucasus and Central Asia that it's accredited with here. El Jaber 16:53, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

Good point. Most of Turkestan was conquered later than this. I think I read somewhere that Russia took control of the last part of Central Asia somewhere during the 1880s. Valentinian (talk) / (contribs) 22:10, 31 August 2006 (UTC)

Yes this is my mistake. Although parts of Central Asia (such as "Little Horde" northern Kazakhstan) were annexed by Russia as early as 1731, Turkmenistan was not conquered until 1885. In 1867 then Alaska was sold most of Central Asia exept for Turkmenistan (Transcaspian Region), Emirate of Bukhara and Khanate of Khiva was under Russian domination though. See Russian Turkestan Fisenko 01:31, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

For modern comparisons, I think this map is really nice: http://editors.sipri.se/pubs/pressre/ptibmap.gif - pointing out the Russian empire's borders in 1900, the modern borders since 1991 and, implicitly, the post-WWII Soviet border. Darth Sidious 23:42, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

I find it odd that large portions of this article are written in present tense. 206.116.206.9 00:25, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

Probably parts imported wholesale from 1911 EB. The Empire was still in the present tense at that time. Feel free to update them. ALL of them. I'd do it, but I lack the time. Snezzy 19:32, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Cheers[edit]

Ja ja me burlo de ustedes, como es posible que un artículo que podría ser enorme se cierre tan facil por una discución, les pido por favor que vean el artículo en español del imperio ruso y comparenlo con el suyo, todo el artículo fue escrito por su real majestad de la wikipedia española-eslava Mexicansky 03:21, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

I don't understandHotshotCleaner (talk) 23:43, 11 October 2011 (UTC)

End[edit]

We say: "[it] existed ... until it was declared a republic in August 1917", but then under "Collapse" we have March 2, 1917. Can we clarify that? Biruitorul 08:46, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

Preceded[edit]

Why doesn't the infobox the "preceded" information part like the othet collapsed empires have? After the Russian Empire collapse, many other countries were born like Estonia, Latvia and others.

RE - USSR[edit]

There were Republic of Russia/Russian Republic (01.09.1917-1918) and RSFSR/Soviet Russia (1918-1922, later RSFSR became just part of USSR and predecessor of modern Russia) between RE and USSR. This is not shown in the infobox now. 217.198.224.13 13:45, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

Russian America[edit]

Why doesn't the map of Russia's phases of expansion doesn't include the possession in North America? Even though it was subsequently bought out by the USA, it should still be illustrated as territory once held by the empire. -- TKMB, 17 April 2007

I agree. Any mapmaker going to do it?--Methodius 06:17, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

From what I understand is that Russia DIDN'T own territories in North America but certain companies had RIGHTS to certain territories for trading (routes) and the use of the land (hunting, furs).

-G

Atheism[edit]

After the Russian Revolution the Soviet Union promoted Atheism, but was Atheism legal in Tsarist Russia? The article doesn't seem to say.-unsigned 6/25/07

Legal, but discouraged. --217.172.29.4 (talk) 08:56, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Unlike Western monarchs, Russia had a seperation of church and state. Russias kings/queens didn't need permission or to be ordained by the church. One of the many ways Russia was ahead of its time.

-G

Population numbers[edit]

Wow! I had no idea the population of the Russian Empire was so huge! 181, 000, 000 people! Damn! No wander we were third in the world, after only China and India! --SergeiXXX 03:39, 23 July 2007 (UTC)Romanov Flag.svg

There was no India at the time, it was part of the British Empire, just like various populous yet underdeveloped Central Asian states were part of the Russian Empire. Less than a half of these 181,000,000 people were Russian, Ukrainian, or Belarusian. --Humanophage (talk) 01:55, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

Rework needed for new opening section[edit]

Sorry to say that, but the new opening section is a complete mess now after the recent additions (see [2]), is not at all encyclopedic, not NPOV and needs quite a lot of rework now. How about reverting and starting to insert the information (rephrased to NPOV) properly into the different subsections of the articles? Cheers, MikeZ 11:46, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Recents additions[edit]

I removed this from mainspace for discussion and processing. In its current form, the section does not conform to our standards. --Ghirla-трёп- 11:53, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

The Russia Empire was the largest empire of its time. The history of Russia is one of almost continual expansion. It has been estimated that from 1600 to 1900 Russia grew at a rate of 50 square miles a day. by the end of the 18th century Russia included Siberia, western Ukraine Lithuania, Poland, and Tatar Crimea. In 1809, Finland was added to by the that time the largest most powerful empire in the world. And in the first half of the 19th century, the small countries of the Caucasus - Georgia, Armenia and Azerbaijan - and huge areas of central Asia became part of the riches empire of the 19th century.

Napoleon I of France conquered most of Europe and Egypt from about 1803 to 1812. In 1812 after he conquered most of Europe he set his eyes on Russia. After 2 years of preparation on June 24, 1812 Napoleon set out with the largest army the world had ever seen 691,501 men on his French invasion of Russia. Known in Russia as Patriotic War of 1812. Not to be confused with The Great Patriotic War during WWII.

Leading a French army more than half a million men strong, Napoleon I invaded Russia in June 1812. By September, he had succeeded in reaching Borodino on the approaches to Moscow. A bloody battle broke out in which many were mortally wounded, including one of the most brilliant commanders of the Russian Army, a Georgian prince, Pyotr Bagration. Afterward, the Russians, led by the crafty, one eyed Mikhail Illarionovich Kutuzov, retreated. In 1812, Napoleon took Moscow. But a terrible fire destroyed most of the city, including winter supplies. The fire was set on the order of Tsar Alexander I. After just a month Napoleon, the coqueror of Europe and Egypt, was forced to retreat from Russia. Frozen and straving 90 percent of his 650,000 men died or deserted. Two years later, the Russians, under Alexnader I, rode triumphantly into Paris and the Russian Empire became the most powerful empire in the world and began to play a prominent role in Europen affairs.

In 1913 the year which merked the 300 year old reign of the Romanov Dynasty the Russian Empire was the riches empire in the world. with a $257.7 billion economy. No other country or empire in the world could compete.

By 1914 the Russian Empire was by far the largest in the world, stretching from the Arctic Ocean to the Capsian Sea and from the Baltic Sea to the Pacific. Within its vast borders were vast and diverse nationalities ranging from the northern ice-bound Chukchi to the desert nomads of Kazakhstan. The huge empire which included Finland and Poland was divided into provinces and ruled from St. Petersburg. Ivan the Terrible opened the way to the resources of Siberia when he defeated the Tatars who has oppressed Russian for 200 years, at Kazan on the Volga. Yermak, a daring Cossack leader, penetrated farther in fur-rich western Siberia in 1581, as shown in Surikov's painting in 1895. With 850 men Ivan conquered the native tribes and greatly expanded Russian's borders. When Ivan died in 1584 the Russia he had expanded was larger than France, England and Spain combined.

Fur-rich Alaska, separated from Siberia by narrow straits which were united, was first visited by Joseph Billings, an English sailor in Russian service, led a secret expedition to study Alaska's people and explore the coast. by 1866 Alaska was a Russian colony. But because of the proximity to British controlled Canada sold it to the US in 1867 for $7,200,000.

By 1914 the Russian Empire had the largest army in the world with 1.3 million men. And by the start of WWI the number had more than doubled into a army with 4 million troops. And the numbers only increased until it reached 15 million troops. Because of this in the start of WWI the Russian Empire won every battle and almost pushed to Berlin. Another reason for this success was because Russia was the only country in WWI that allowed women to take part in combat with the men. Up on till 1917 the Russians were in a well position in the war. In 1915 Tsar Nicholas II took supreme control of the Russian Army and of the war.

Although many Religions, including Buddhism and Islam, are found in Russia, 90 percent of the population identifies with Orthodox Christianity. Adopted from Byzantium over 1,000 years ago by Prince Vladimir, it was chosen for the splendor of its ceremonies. Rich in ritual, Orthodox service are often long, elaborate, and colorful. Priest chant and the choir sings without the accompaniment of musical instruments, because it is believed that only the human voice should be used in sacred music. The Bible was translated into Old Church Slavonic in the 9th century by Saints Cyril and Methodius. Church Slavonic is close to the Russian Language and is still used today in chruch services. At the head of the Russian Orthodox Church is the Patriarch. The Patriarch like all senior ranks of the Orthodox Church he is drawn from the unmarried black clergy. Russian Orthodoxy remained Imperial Russia's State religion until the Revolution in 1917.


Flag 2[edit]

It was me who changed the Slavic Tricolor Flag to the Romanov one. I feel, that as the longest-ruling dynasty in Russia, the Romanovs probably used their family colours to represent the country. Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong. I see it has already been discussed here...--SergeiXXX 23:06, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

Image:Russian Empire 1914 17.svg was the final flag for the russian empire [3] --Barryob (Contribs) (Talk) 11:48, 24 November 2007 (UTC)
Romanov flag is correct for the periods of Romanov rule.Tttom1 (talk) 21:31, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

And it wasn't official flag of Empire, by special hand-bill in 1914 it was introduced as additional Empire flag for private use, according to Russian WP History of Russian flag.

Rulon Oboyev (talk) 10:10, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

You cannot cite other wikipeida pages as sources --Barryob (Contribs) (Talk) 18:04, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
  • What is important for you? Essentials of information or page as sourses?

Maybe you think, you know russian history better than russians? I compassion you...

Rulon Oboyev (talk) 10:32, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Compassion me all you want unless you can provide a source the Russian wiki page counts for nothing --Barryob (Contribs) (Talk) 17:09, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Here's your site flagsite. Mallerd (talk) 14:39, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Might wanna look at last flag on the page. Mallerd (talk) 14:40, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

These sources all clearly state that the white-blue-red tricolor became an alternative civil flag in 1883, and that in 1914 both the white-blue-red and the black-orange-white were replaced with the 1914-1917 flag - no mention of the 1914-1917 flag being for "private use":
Bonnell, Victoria E. Russia at the barricades: eyewitness accounts of the August 1991 coup. M.E. Sharpe, 1994, p92
Condee, Nancy. Soviet hieroglyphics: visual culture in late twentieth-century Russia‎. Indiana University Press, 1995, p49
Saunders, Nicholas J. Matters of conflict: material culture, memory and the First World War‎. Routledge, 2004, p129
National Museum of Science and Technology (Canada). Material history review‎. anada Science and Technology Museum, 2000, p46
http://www.crwflags.com/FOTW/flags/ru_1914.html Lt.Specht (talk) 23:17, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Sources aboard Russia may be wrong in some details. Do not forget that. This source also has non–encyclopedic style ("Kerensky government has too munch else in it's mind!" etc.), so, it's not relevant source. Seryo93 (talk) 08:07, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
Just because the sources are not from Russia, and are not in Russian, does nothing to their credibility. Non-English sources are not even supposed to be used, only when there are no other sources. Lt.Specht (talk) 08:19, 19 February 2010 (UTC)
Per WP:VUE, English-language sources are to be preferred when possible, but that doesn't at all mean that sources in other languages are not allowed when English sources are available. There's nothing wrong with using both English and foreign-language sources when both discuss the same topic. Nyttend (talk) 01:25, 27 February 2010 (UTC)
There would be nothing wrong with it if at least the sentence or part of the foreign source which is being used was translated (online translators have said contrary to what some users are saying sources say). The majority (if not practically all) of sources on this issue overwhelmingly agree with the sources above. Russian users are just POV pushing to make sure the white-blue-red tricolor never leaves the infobox, and launching an edit war on anyone who tries to follow these sources. Lt.Specht (talk) 23:45, 28 February 2010 (UTC)

Alyaska[edit]

Why isn't Alask on the map? Kostantino888Z (talk) 17:59, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

It is It's not on the top map because that is from 1914; it is on the map later in the article. —Justin (koavf)TCM☯ 21:26, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
Why is the map on the top not of the zenith of its territory? Many otrher empires have it. Mallerd (talk) 14:29, 26 August 2008 (UTC)


Extension[edit]

The date about the area covered by the russian empire in 1916 is equal than the soviet extension after WWII, wich is wrong because tsarist Russia was bigger althought the only stimation avalaible is here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_empires#cite_ref-4

That is: 24.8 million km² (under Alexander II in 1866) - including Alaska

--Bentaguayre (talk) 17:57, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

Map[edit]

Why isn't the map at the top not the map of the zenith? The true zenith of the Russian Empire was in 1866 and it included Alaska.

- Cwoldo  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cwoldo (talkcontribs) 17:51, 27 December 2008 (UTC) 
I agree, the map should be anachronic--EuroHistoryTeacher (talk) 21:55, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

I was just getting ready to ask that in fact, I've noticed it's like that on a lot of empirical maps —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.235.132.219 (talk) 21:53, 1 April 2009 (UTC)

In the boundary section of this article the author mentioned about "Kyrgyz steppes" actually it is not Kyrgyz steppe it is Kazakh steppe, they use kyrgyz steppe because, in the Soviet period and also in Russian empire period, russians used kyzgyz instead of kazakh, because they didn't want to confuse with another ethnic group "Cossacks"(this word in russian sounds like Kazak).So don't get confused kyrgyz and kazakh is not the same nation!!!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nurlybek (talkcontribs) 20:14, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

Factual conflict with Wikipedia itself[edit]

In the section titled "Early Twentieth Century" is a statement regarding Russian in 1915 (during WW1) that "casualties were increasing (even though staying lower than in the rest of warring countries)" This is at odds with the table in Wikipedia's own article about WW1 casualties at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_I_casualties. The table states Russia's military casualties for the entire war were about 1.8 million, and including civilians killed, were about 3.3 million total. Only Germany had more military deaths, and it fought the war for a year longer, and on two fronts, making it an invalid comparison. No country had more total deaths than Russia did.

I suppose a case could be made that up to the point referred to in the article (mid-1915) Russian casualties were lower, but anyone who knows anything about the Eastern Front would find that hard to believe. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.49.185.232 (talk) 17:55, 20 July 2009 (UTC)

Imperial external territories[edit]

Perhaps this section should be expanded? The Russians had a presence in many parts of the world that are not mentioned or covered in this article. It seems most of these tidbits exist somewhere on wikipedia, but it would be practical to have them all in one place.

- The details of Russia's Chinese possessions are rather vague and leave the reader without a clear picture of just what the Russian presence amounted to there.

- There are brief mentions of Russian America, but only in context to Alaska. Early on, Russia also had numerous posts at various times along the West Coast as far as northern California. These are covered more thoroughly in the Russian America article, but shouldn't they at least be mentioned here? Can Russia's claims on Oregon Country also be noted?

- This interesting bit of information on Russia's fort and protectorate on the island of Kauai in Hawaii were once found on the Russian America article, but as Hawaii is not geographically part of the Americas, it has since been removed and orphaned. I relocated it to this article under the imperial external territories section, but it doesn't integrate very well just yet.

In 1815, Dr. Schäffer, a Russian entrepreneur, went to Kauai and negotiated a treaty of protection with the island's governor Kaumualii, vassal of King Kamehameha I of Hawaii, but the Russian Tsar refused to ratify the treaty. See also Orthodox Church in Hawaii and Russian Fort Elizabeth[4].

--129.68.111.84 (talk) 16:58, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

Military[edit]

There is absolutely NO information whatsoever on the Russian military during this period. No information on how the army was organized, its strength, its equipment, so on so forth. Why is this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.65.245.3 (talk) 22:13, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

I'll make a military section if that's ok. If it's not, just delete it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by NuclearWizard (talkcontribs) 16:08, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Empire size[edit]

It says here that the British Empire was the 3rd largest empire in history, yes the page for said empire claims it was the largest

Can someone sort this out? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kill me when i die (talkcontribs) 00:07, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

Greater Coat of Arms of the Russian Empire 1882-1917 (mass replacement)[edit]

On these two pages, published a letter from the Chief Heraldry Master of Russia. It is dated 2006. http://www.rus-deco.com/vp/JS-Lib/CustomerSites/Common/view_larger.htm?src=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.rus-deco.com%2F510_500_csupload_20087015.jpg%3Fu%3D553230982

http://www.rus-deco.com/vp/JS-Lib/CustomerSites/Common/view_larger.htm?src=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.rus-deco.com%2F514_500_csupload_20087025.jpg%3Fu%3D3016084680

At the present moment is initiated his replacement to this picture without a single mistake and the author's portrayal: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greater_Coat_of_Arms_of_the_Russian_Empire_1700x1767_pix_Igor_Barbe_2006.jpg Earlier, the authors insisted on the presence of yellow in the figure dies with his name. For VIKI author has made an exception. However, the file with a yellow bg can remain - it has more resolution. References to it are optional for connoisseurs. http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greater_coat_of_arms_of_the_Russian_empire_IGOR_BARBE_1500x1650jpg.jpg All files are located here: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Greater_Coat_of_Arms_of_the_Russian_Empire

THNKS!

Barbe Igor (talk) 09:45, 24 March 2011 (UTC)

An idea.[edit]

Could someone do a section for the "Legacy" of the Russian Empire? That'd be pretty good. —Preceding unsigned comment added by NuclearWizard (talkcontribs) 12:42, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

Peasants[edit]

Hi!

Can anybody please explain why the peasants are wearing military caps? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.37.199.19 (talk) 19:01, 11 December 2011 (UTC)

To be honest, I'm not really sure, but if you look at portraits and photos from this time period, the practice of wearing military caps by male members of the lower classes seems to have been pretty prevalant in Tsarist Russia right up to the revolution. I'm not sure why this was so, and you've posed a most interesting query, here. If you ever find any definitive answers to this question, please post them here, as I'd be interested in learning more about that, myself! Thanks! - Ecjmartin (talk) 02:47, 12 December 2011 (UTC)
That's actually not a military cap, although its origins are military. This kind of headgear is called "картуз" (kartuz; a summer cap with peak), and it was really popular in the 19th century not only among the peasants, but also among the working class, landlords, and even occasionally among the nobility (although theirs had a slightly different design).—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); December 12, 2011; 15:06 (UTC)
Good to know! Thanks so much for that information! I'd always wondered about that... - Ecjmartin (talk) 17:55, 12 December 2011 (UTC)

Opening paragraphs -- "Last absolute monarchy?"[edit]

I changed the portion of the opening section that stated that the Russian empire was "the last absolute monarchy in Europe before its demise," because this was (and is) untrue. First of all, Russia was transformed into a limited monarchy by its 1906 Fundamental Laws, which limited the Emperor's power, even if not by much (and even if Tsar Nicholas II failed to abide by all of its provisions). Nevertheless, the empire legally ceased to be an absolute monarchy in 1906. Furthermore, both the Vatican City State and Monaco remained absolute monarchies after 1906; Monaco became constitutional in 1911, while the Vatican technically remains an absolute monarchy to this day, with the pope ultimately wielding all executive, legislative and judicial power within its boundaries. Hence, to describe Russia as "the last absolute monarchy in Europe before its demise" is misleading. - Ecjmartin (talk) 14:45, 4 June 2012 (UTC)

Languages[edit]

There weren't German, Polish, Finnish and Swedish. RE had Ingermanlandisch (finno-german), Neddersassisch (nethersaxon), Ostangelsaksisch (eastern anglo-saxon) and Preussisch (Prussian). 85.26.241.210 (talk) 02:30, 18 July 2012 (UTC)


Ethnic relations and Linguistic distribution[edit]

Russian Empire was a very multiethnic country. Therefore an "ethnic relations" section with a linguistic distribution table are mandatory in the article.--Balkony (talk) 14:49, 28 March 2013 (UTC)

Monument of Tsar Alexander II in Sofia[edit]

May I propose we remove the photo of the monument of tsar Alexander in Sofia, since it has little to do with the main topic of the article and concerns another country. --Kreuzkümmel (talk) 19:54, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

SO I assume nobody objects. --Kreuzkümmel (talk) 17:19, 3 May 2013 (UTC)
Good idea. - Ecjmartin (talk) 22:54, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

Romanov Empire[edit]

I think the name Romanov Empire is more accurate in that the name Russian Empire is often applied to any of the powerful Russian states throughout history (like Kievan Rus' or the Soviet Union) or just the long history of Russian imperialism. After all, Russia has a history of building empires (read Russia: The Once and Future Empire to see what i'm talking about). Charles Essie (talk) 23:37, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

I have to respond to this one, The Russian Empire in it's prime (late 18th century to 1866) was actually more powerful than the Soviet Union in it's prime (1948-1985). Although you can't truly compare the Russian Empire with it's succesor due to technology, but in truth, the only reason why the communists were successful was because many of the revolutionaries and Bolshevik soldiers were formerly soldiers and generals of the Imperial Russian Army. To answer your question, no! The Romanov Empire is a disgraceful name as the Russian Empire was the most powerful Russian state ever to exist and the one thing that would have saved it that is much better than bread and can grow strong even in the worst conditions, something that the Russian people could have had an infinite supply of if they would have had it was THE POTATO!, that way they would have survived WWI. :) Keeby101 (talk) 21:45, 15 July 2013 (UTC)
I disagree, the name Russian Empire is used very losely, it dosen't always refer to only the Romanov era. For the record the Soviet Union was much more powerful than the Romanov Empire, it had a much stronger military–industrial complex, a much more advanced economy and infrastructure and a level of worldwide influence rivaled only by the United States. Charles Essie (talk) 01:36, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

What would have saved The Russian Empire and what would have saved it from falling to the Communists![edit]

Now I know that this is not a forum and I am not trolling here, but I have to address this, we all know that the Russian Empire was the most powerful Russian state in history and was the 3rd largest empire by land mass, but am I right when I say that the one thing that would have saved the Russian Empire from collapsing would have been the POTATO, given that it grows in the worst of conditions and if the Russians were to have had that, they could have exploited it and thus would have survived World War I. Am I wrong? Keeby101 (talk) 22:05, 15 July 2013 (UTC)

This is just my opinion--it might have helped a tiny bit, but the problems that led to the collapse of the Russian Empire were far beyond the scope of food supply. Questions of political corruption, unrealized hopes and dreams (especially of the peasantry, but also of the middle classes), military disasters, an ineffectual Tsar, allegations involving Rasputin and the Empress, and a host of other difficulties played a much larger role. If nothing else, having a dependable food source (potatoes) definitely couldn't have hurt. It might not have helped much, but it couldn't have hurt. But that's just my opinion, and you know what they say about those... - Ecjmartin (talk) 23:01, 15 July 2013 (UTC)
Guys, the Romanov Empire was not the most powerful Russian state in history, that honor goes to the Soviet Union! Charles Essie (talk) 21:35, 12 December 2013 (UTC)
Wrong, the Soviet Union was weak compared to the Russian Empire! Had it not been for the Russian winter in 1943, the Sovier Union would have fallen. On top of that, the Russian Empire lasted for 400+ years and was completely stable until the assassination of Tsar Alexander II. Whereas the Soviet Union fell apart completely in a matter of 70 years. In fact, had Alexander II not been assassinated by those revolutionary terrorists, the Russian Empire would have become a constitutional monarchy. In other words, the honor goes to the Imperial Russian Empire! Keeby101 (talk) 07:18, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

Then again, we are comparing two Russian States from two different eras. :) Keeby101 (talk) 07:18, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

On a side note: The Russian Empire could have won the Crimean War btw. Had they prolonged the war to the point to where it would have become too costly for France and Britain (to which it almost did), then Russia would have won that war and with that, Alaska would probably be part of Russia today along with California, most of the middle east, all of northern China and nearly all of Eastern Europe.

I'm being totally serious when saying this! I researched all of this! Tsar Nicholas I was ignorant for not prolonging the Crimean War. Keeby101 (talk) 07:18, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

Well, you could use your research and sources to improve the article on the Crimean War. The section on the "End of the war" is underdeveloped and there is no explanation on how peace was achieved. Dimadick (talk) 10:03, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

The term "Falling to communism" is not even close to neutral writing. Also, are you people seriously comparing the Russian Empire to the Soviet Union? as much as i respect the Russian Empire, the Soviet Union would've completely obliterated them. RomanK79 (talk) 22:03, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

What are everyone's thoughts on the map change that I made?[edit]

In case if you all were wondering who changed the map, I did. It's much better than the last one. It depicts The Russian Empire with all of the territories it possessed at different time periods shown at once. Keeby101 (talk) 02:41, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Move to Romanov Empire[edit]

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: not moved. Early close per WP:SNOW. -- BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 18:41, 10 February 2014 (UTC)


Russian EmpireRomanov Empire – The name "Russian Empire" is not exclusive to the Romanov dynasty, there have been Russian states in history that could considered "empires" (such as Kievan Rus', the Grand Duchy of Moscow, the Tsardom of Russia, the Soviet Union, or even the current Russian Federation). Charles Essie (talk) 21:35, 9 February 2014 (UTC)

  • Oppose. Doing a quick google search, "Russian Empire" (web search Google Books) appears to be the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC (in terms of usage) for the period between 1721 to 1917. "Romanov Empire" gets less google hits (web search Google Books) and therefore not a more WP:COMMONNAME. Thus, at the time I am saving my comment here, it is no surprise that a Romanov Empire redirect page has never been created yet -- a sure sign that little or no readers and editors are really looking for that search term here on Wikipedia. Zzyzx11 (talk) 22:49, 9 February 2014 (UTC)
  • Strong Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME. Google Books: 73,800 for Romanov Empire and 900,000 for Russian Empire. Google Scholar (Journal): 8,970 for Romanov Empire and 632,000 for Russian Empire. IJA (talk) 22:54, 9 February 2014 (UTC)
  • Strong Oppose. Never have I heard the Russian Empire being called the Romanov Empire. Of all the proposals that I have seen on Wikipedia, this one is the most ludicrous of all of them! The name Russian Empire stays! Kirby (talk) 00:34, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
  • At the very least there should a disambiguation page, there were other Russian Empires! Charles Essie (talk) 00:50, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
  • Oppose the Romanoffs also ruled part of the period Wikipedia called Tsardom, and that was functionally also an empire, so the proposed title and current titles provide no indication of period. The Romanoff Empire would have started with the death of Boris Gudanov and the selection of the Romanoffs. -- 70.24.244.161 (talk) 06:16, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
  • Oppose. We follow usage in Reliable Sources. No evidence has been provided to even suggest that RS use "Romanov Empire" more than "Russian Empire" to refer to the topic of this article. --B2C 07:14, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
  • Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME. Jaan Pärn (talk) 08:30, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
  • Oppose - Related news : The New York Times, The Guardian Maurice07 (talk) 12:03, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Stop removing the map! This is getting ridiculous![edit]

I am putting the orthographic map back onto the infobox! There are plenty of sources that prove the accuracy of that map! This is starting to come off as trolling and it needs to stop! Kirby (talk) 05:31, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

Czar as White Tara[edit]

The Czars of the Romanov Dynasty were recognized as reincarnations of the White Tara by the Buryats.

http://books.google.com/books?id=MqXnOBX4dREC&pg=PA23#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=rdSnsngNLUsC&pg=PA189#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=OTFjMoAUfcgC&pg=PA30#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=zCdoje8i8NMC&pg=PA103#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=p4NJbN1BDzoC&pg=PA115#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=9aNBAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA299#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=jqRDAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA299#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=8aanmN8DXIcC&pg=PA22#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=gPRnyfM4WMMC&pg=PA418#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=SwX7ifWyI_QC&pg=PA66#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=Ssv-GONnxTsC&pg=PA237#v=onepage&q&f=false

Rajmaan (talk) 02:35, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

Changed "Great war" to "First world war" to avoid confusion with International readers[edit]

RomanK79 (talk) 21:56, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

  1. ^ Полное собрание законов Российской Империи, т. XXXIII, № 33.289.
  2. ^ Цитируется по: Путятин Александр. О русском национальном флаге.
  3. ^ Морской Устав, статья 1142. Издание 1886 года.