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Does anyone have records of a Mission being located near New Smyrna Beach, Florida? There are local "legends" as well as some old ruins that are attributed to a Spanish Mission in New Smyrna Beach - but no records seem to be available. Gamweb (talk) 00:01, 9 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
The only mention of a presidio I see at Tristán de Luna y Arellano is for Presidio Santa Maria de Galve, founded in 1698. There is no earlier presidio west of Tampa Bay listed in Childers. As far as I know, Tristán de Luna y Arellano's expedition did not try to establish missions, and so is outside of the scope of an article about Spanish missions, even if it did establish a presidio that Childers overlooked. The Spanish mission system in Florida never extended west of the Apalachicola River valley. By the time Pensacola was established in 1698, there were few Indians living in the area, and I have not read of any efforts to establish missions among them. - Donald Albury 00:21, 17 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Did you see the link to the University of West Florida archeology website? There was a much earlier attempt to establish a presidio at Pensacola, way back in 1559. It did not last long, and information is sketchy, so it's unknown whether Luna planned to establish a mission, although it's likely that priests / missionaries were with the expedition. However, since the sentence is just listing presidios that Spain attempted to establish to defend La Florida, the early Pensacola attempt should be included, as it lasted longer and included a larger garrison than the Tacobaga site at Tampa Bay.
Isn't it frustrating how little information has been discovered about the Spanish Florida period??? Zeng8r (talk) 20:48, 17 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]
I don't see any mention of a presidio on that page. I will note that Childers states that there were no presidios west of the Apalachicola River prior to 1698, when the Presidio Santa Maria de Galve was founded on Pensacola Bay. Even the Presidio San Marcos de Apalachee, the only presidio between Tampa Bay and St. Joseph Bay, was not established until 1718, although the site had apparently been used as a port since soon after the Apalachee missions were established. In any case, the presidios at Pensacola Bay and St. Joseph Bay were established to block French expansion eastward from Louisiana, and had no substantive connection to the Spanish mission system in Florida, which is what this article is about. - Donald Albury 02:26, 18 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]
The text of the article, as it stood earlier this year, said:
The first Spanish missions to the Indians of Florida, starting with the foundation of St. Augustine in 1565, were attached to presidios. Between 1565 and 1567 ten presidios were established at major harbors from Port Royal Sound to Tampa Bay to prevent other European powers from establishing bases in the area. Most of the presidios were unsustainable. San Mateo was destroyed by the French, the entire garrison at Tocobago was wiped out, and most of the other presidios were abandoned due to a combination of hostility from the native inhabitants, difficulty in providing supplies, and poor weather. By 1573 the only remaining presidios in Florida were St. Augustine and Santa Elena, and Santa Elena was abandoned (for a second time) in 1587.[1]
Subsequent edits obscured the connection between the text and the citation. The attempt to establish a colony at Ochuse in 1559 is outside the scope of the paragraph. The paragraph was not about attempts to protect Florida from foreign settlements, per se, but about how the first missions all had presidios attached, an experiment that failed. - Donald Albury 11:53, 18 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]
References
^Childers, Ronald Wayne (2004). "The Presidio System in Spanish Florida 1565-1763". Historical Archaeology. 38 (3): 24–32. JSTOR25617178.
