Talk:T. B. Joshua
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Edited it to have a more neutral point of view.
I'm sensing some issues with neutrality for this page, so I'd like to point out to any editors who follow this page that wikipedia has rules regarding article neutrality, and somebody should really take a look. DreamHaze (talk) 21:37, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
With the neutrality mark I want to stop the silent edit war at this point. Some seem not to have understood what the purpose of an encyclopedia is. This is not the website of the T.B. Joshua Fanclub. -- JohSt 18:27, 25 September 2008 (CEST) —Preceding unsigned comment added by JohSt (talk • contribs)
I have noticed your neutrality mark. We clearly recognize and understand the purpose of Wikipedia in presenting neutral information on people, places and events. It is an encyclopedia. Regarding the controversies section, however, the allegations and accusations made in the past from the mentioned organization and persons, while referenced, may not reflect the views of the said individuals, organization or majority of the organization in this present day. We must be careful not to defame present day organizations or individuals based on past views. This is the reason for removal of this section. Wellington 384 (talk) 14:32, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
- First of all: if the neutrality of an article is disputed it is customary, first to discuss bevor deleting any contribution.
- On the relevance of the section 'Controversies':
- It would be absurd to deny or to conceal from the public that T.B. Joshua is a very controversial- if not the most controversial pastor in Nigeria, even Africa today. A quick peek on Google proves that the Internet is full of critical reports. To present this controversy is a component of the biography and not a defamation of anyone or anything. In regard to this it is of no importance if the presented allegations reflect the sight of the mentioned individuals or organisations of today or not (as a matter of fact the SCOAN is not member of the PFN up to now). For an encyclopedia it is only relevant that it happened. Btw I would not be surprised if some organisations change their view over the years as T.B. Joshua is a relatively young phenomenon. Time will tell if T.B. Joshua will be forgotten or established as a prophet in the public view. --JohSt(talk • contribs)
It would be exciting to document this man's reputation as a prophet. His church's website has a section on "prophecy" but the only claims of prophecy that I found there are for events that have already occurred. Does he publish his yet-unproven prophecies? Where? If he is a real prophet, the world should take notice of him; if not, perhaps the article should refer to him as a "self-styled" prophet. Snezzy (talk) 23:07, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
State of the article: my cleanup efforts - some POV material still remains
Well. I have begun efforts to try and bring this article into some semblance of meeting Wikipedia's style and NPOV efforts, though I have to say the task is a most thankless one. I have to wonder if this article wasn't constructed with a certain care to appear more sourced than it actually was, and yet consist solely of what seemed like media promotional material. On following up many of the references, they appear to have the depth of an empty bath; most had nothing to do with the sentences they were allegedly sourcing. For example, the news links next to the claims of prophecies (to reputable cites such as BBC News Online and CNN) had no mention of Joshua whatsoever in them, and there is no record online of any third-party verification of them. The Controversies section also seems an interesting effort of misdirection, as far from containing external sources' concerns over Joshua's claimed powers, it is simply a sort of watered-down mention of unorthodoxy. have removed the worst, and left the claims to stand by themselves where appropriate; furthermore, I have also excised some of the material which seemed to be overly "granular" out of proportion to notability. What needs to happen is 1) external sources need to be found and added for the various claims; 2) external criticisms need to be added and sourced; 3) remaining POV promotional text needs to be reworded into bare claims only with the sources from steps 1) and 2). I shall continue with the efforts as time permits. To supporters of Joshua I would urge you to allow claims to speak for themselves, and remind you of Wikipedia's policies on neutra l point of view (WP:NPOV) and notability (Wikipedia:Notability). --NicholasTurnbull | (talk) 04:00, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
Dear Sir, I'm very much interesting on your live ministry every sunday at SCOAN, how you are delivery people from the claws of satan the devil.How can one arrange to travel to SCOAN from cameroon. please for directives.Tohsium (talk) 18:50, 3 May 2010 (UTC)
How is Africa ever going to move forward when this kind of charlatan is held in awe by people who ought to spend their time educating themselves and working their way out of poverty, rather than rely on miracles from a man who clearly is nothing but a con artist. I despair. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.127.116.11 (talk) 10:28, 14 January 2011 (UTC)
- I agree with your sentiment. But Wikipedia is one place where you're empowered to actually do something about it. If you want to help debunk T. B. Joshua's mythology, rather than vandalize the page, help improve it! The current presentation is extremely one-sided and it needs knowledgeable people to add reliable sources that tell the other side of the story. AtticusX (talk) 12:37, 14 January 2011 (UTC)
Apologies. I was just trying to see how long it would take to get reverted. I have to say you guys are amazingly prompt. What shall I vandalise next? I was thinking something relating to twilight? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.104.22.168 (talk) 13:10, 14 January 2011 (UTC)
I have noticed that the link which has been attached to the claim that the genuineness of T.B. Joshua's miracles have been questioned does not match the claim. The editor who made that edit should either provide a better link or remove it. Without a proper link his/her claim is misleading.
- You're quite right, it doesn't. This was the reference that was formerly attached to the claim in the previous version of the article. Almost none of the article's references, in fact, matched its statements before I stripped it, and many still do not. I am currently researching better sources. --NicholasTurnbull | (talk) 07:52, 17 April 2011 (UTC)
Synagogue Church of All Nations should get a separate article. And the stuff regarding the recently reported deaths should be added there: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-14406818
Possible Conflict of Interest
I made some edits yesterday and it was put forward by Famousdog that I may have a conflict of interest in editing the T.B. Joshua article, so to anyone concerned I just wanted to be open and public about my interest in T.B. Joshua and the SCOAN. I recently had an opportunity to travel to the church and was very impressed by what I saw. The edits I have made to the T.B. Joshua article reflect this impression. I am still learning the ins and outs of Wikipedia editing and I apologize for linking to YouTube videos from the Official SCOAN YouTube Channel. That demonstrated poor judgment and I just wanted to be up front and apologize for it.
am asking for blessing about my final exam which am to start on monday my name is steven j.mgombera from tanzania.am form four at alfagems secondary school. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 22.214.171.124 (talk) 16:15, 1 November 2013 (UTC)