Talk:The Battle of the Labyrinth

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Former good article nominee The Battle of the Labyrinth was a Language and literature good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There are suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
February 28, 2011 Good article nominee Not listed


Untitled[edit]

PLEASE DO NOT PLACE FAN COMMENTS, PREDICTIONS, OR ANY OTHER SUCH MATERIAL ON THIS PAGE. THE TALK PAGE IS INTENDED SOLELY FOR TALK ABOUT THE ARTICLE ITSELF AND ANY RELATED EDITS AND INFORMATION.--Mktsay123 (talk) 14:27, 12 March 2009 (UTC)

YouTube[edit]

uhhh youtube.org isn't a real site... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.192.43.48 (talk) 00:01, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, I have fixed it. Erik the Red 2 (talk) 00:54, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

K, so since when does the summary on the back of the book count as an actual plot summary? This is an encyclopedia, not a third grade book report. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.4.200.52 (talk) 20:33, 6 April 2008 (UTC) Unfortunately, it's the only info we have-but you're right, using the actual summary off the back of the book is plagiarism. I'll try to fix it. Erik the Red 2 (talk) 00:54, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

Mortal acquaintance?[edit]

The "Mortal Acquaintance" is under dispute - whether it's Nancy Bobofit or Rachel Elizabeth Dare. Shouldn't it be the latter? If you go to [1], you'll see a profile for Rachel under "Olympians, Gods, and Monsters", which includes her home town, her various nicknames, and even one object that she owns (note that Nancy is not mentioned in the profile listings). Since none of these descriptions are found in the book, it can be safely assumed that these will appear in Battle of the Labyrinth. Also, the description of the "mortal girl" that Percy sees in Chapter 1 closely matches Rachel - frizzy, red hair and marker marks.

68.4.66.248 (talk) 17:18, 4 May 2008 (UTC)RainbowSprinkle (username rainbow_sprinkle - too lazy to log in)

Confirmed: It IS Rachel. I checked the webpage - you can read the whole first chapter, and it confirms that it's Rachel. End of story. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.4.66.248 (talk) 17:35, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.244.67.69 (talk) 01:49, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

Paperback?[edit]

Excuse my ignorance, but it's July 2009 and I have a paperback edition. I'm from the US, so maybe the sentence about paperback not being released until August is a UK thing? Anyone have an answer? PrincessofLlyr (talk) 19:32, 5 July 2009 (UTC)

It is very confusing. I am in India and have a paperback edition from UK. So, I'll be bold and remove it. Regards, Pmlineditor 15:46, 6 July 2009 (UTC).

Plans on how to reach GA?[edit]

A brief look at this article and I'm pretty sure we still need to do much work for this to reach GA.

I'm listing out the stuff needed to get done, and please help with this, cause I'm not so familiar with this stuff... -Mktsay123 (talk) 16:03, 10 February 2010 (UTC)

Discussion Above, List Below

To do[edit]

  • Expand Plot SummaryN Need to remove "play-by-play" feel
  • Doing...--mono 00:22, 27 March 2010 (UTC)
  • I think it's done...Yes check.svg Done -Mktsay123 (talk) 07:27, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
  • Re-format of Main Characters Yes check.svg Done
  • Add Awards and Nomination Fairly sure this is done Yes check.svg Done Winner 42 Talk to me! 23:56, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
  • Add reliable references.
  • For a look at what the GA process expects, check out Talk:The Titan's Curse for its GA review (which passed).
  • Fix problems mentioned in the GA review that still have not been adressed. Hurricanehink reviewed this page for GA, but failed it. Most of the problems have been solved, but two remain.
    • Problem 1: the critical reception section has no negative reviews.
    • Problem 2: There is no Development and publication section section, which hurricanehink finds to be a "pretty glaring omission". How soon after the previous book was this one started? Was it always planned to be the 2nd last in the series?

GA checklist[edit]

GA review (see here for criteria)
  1. It is reasonably well written.
    a (prose): b (MoS):
  2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.
    a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR):
  3. It is broad in its coverage.
    a (major aspects): b (focused):
  4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.
    Fair representation without bias:
  5. It is stable.
    No edit wars, etc.:
  6. It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate.
    a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
  7. Overall:
    Pass/Fail:

Discussion[edit]

Sorry for being absent for so long, but schoollife's harsh. I guess I'll just be able to provide some insights occasionally. So, here we go.

Characters[edit]

While presuming good faith, I don't think differing the characters into categories is a good idea. The way it is shown now, we have "Demigods" and "Immortals", and Poseidon, not neccesary a major character was listed in Major Characters List. I think we should discuss who the major characters are in this book. If following previous GA examples, I'd say Percy, Annabeth, Grover, Tyson, Rachel, Nico, Quintus/Daedalus, and Luke. Kelli, Hera, Hephaestus are quite near, or even off the edge. If we really want to display the other minor ones, maybe we should plan a section devoted on the Mythical Creatures that were shown in the book. That can be saved for further discussion.

I agree that the characters need to be reworked. The other main characters lists don't include this many. I'll just trim it a bit! PrincessofLlyr (talk) 15:54, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

Calypso... Main character? -Mktsay123 (talk) 01:18, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

That one's debatable. She is kind of a major love interest (in this book, at least), but whether she's a main character...I don't know. What does everyone else think? PrincessofLlyr (talk) 02:44, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
Mention her in the plot, Percy's summary, but I don't think she should have her own blurb. Airplaneman 03:32, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
I added her to the plot and temporarily hid her place in the character section. However, I don't think I did a good job at adding her to the plot, so... please help... -Mktsay123 (talk) 08:40, 24 April 2010 (UTC)
I added more about her in Percy's description. Maybe we could add the link to her section in List of Percy Jackson and the Olympians characters. PrincessofLlyr royal court 12:18, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

Yes, that would be a good idea, PrincessofLlyr. I do not think she should be listed as a main character because the role she plays int eh book does not affect the plot very much. Bookworm7412 (talk) 06:21, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Awards and Nomination[edit]

Not much to say, but I don't think a starred review counts... I think we're hitting a wall on this.

This is all I can come up with now. We still have a fair amount of work to do. Things are looking good, so keep it up, 'kay? I'll try to come as often as I can! -Mktsay123 (talk) 15:49, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

We've dealt with this before. Awards are hard because a lot of the reviews and awards are subscription only sites. Ideally you would add the links from somewhere with a subscription (library). I can't help any with that because I can't use the computers at my library, but I'll try to keep doing other research. We found them for the previous books, so there has to be a way to get it for this one! PrincessofLlyr (talk) 15:58, 26 March 2010 (UTC)
Wow, so some library's can access those subscription-only data? That's nice to know... It's just that I live in Taiwan, so that's a no-no for me. See if other PJTF members can help...... I'm posting this at PJTF main page.-Mktsay123 (talk) 06:33, 31 March 2010 (UTC)
Well, I've never actually tried it myself. I think it's mentioned in one of the GA reviews for one of our previous books. Maybe I'll have to do some looking around... - PrincessofLlyr (talk) 15:21, 31 March 2010 (UTC)
Should we add a quote from Kirkus Reviews? This one : "Look no further for the next harry potter; meet Percy Jackson, as legions of fans already have."

Winner 42 (talk) 17:47, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

Sure...do you have a reference? PrincessofLlyr royal court 16:47, 21 April 2010 (UTC)
I saw it on the back cover of the The Last Olympian under Praise for... I'm new to Wikipedia so I don't know if this counts.

Winner 42 (talk) 17:47, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

Well no, it doesn't. Kirkus is another subscription thing - ideas anyone? PrincessofLlyr royal court 17:19, 21 April 2010 (UTC)
Give up on this because we can't find anything and delete this from the article? Winner 42 (talk) 16:16, 2 May 2010 (UTC)
I don't think we can afford on giving up the section because it's quite essential for a book article. (I think.) I believe we can put subscription things in the reference if we can access it, so... can anyone go to nearby libraries for luck??? -Mktsay123 (talk) 07:12, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────Yeah, we definitely can't give up. Um, I may at some point have access to a library subscription, but it will be several weeks. PrincessofLlyr royal court 13:21, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

I found a reference is it good? Winner 42 ( Talk to me! ) 19:38, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Plot Summary[edit]

I have to say I'm impressed by the plot summary now. It's short. It covers everything. Nice. However, the Sequel section still has a little play-by-play feel or I-don't-know-how-to-say-it feel. Just feels strange. -Mktsay123 (talk) 14:51, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

I tried to fix it. Is it better now? Airplaneman 16:42, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, I think it's nice now... Wow, that's a really fast response! -Mktsay123 (talk) 01:17, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
Just so happens this page is on my watchlist, and that I logged on at the right time :). On to the reception section! Airplaneman 03:33, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
Just so you know, I sort of rewrote the summary to fix it. *blush* I hope you aren't offended or anything about me practically deleting all your writing. But I covered major events in the story, so... Anyway, I hope it isn't too long or anything.--Cassie Hawthorne (talk) 04:47, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

C-Class?[edit]

I just noticed today that this article has dropped to C-class. I'm really shocked that despite our hard work to try and get the article promoted to GA, it was instead given a C while we were managing to acquire information of the awards and nominations... What happened? And... what did we miss? -Mktsay123 (talk) 16:47, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

I have no Idea what happened if anything it should have gone up Winner 42 (talk) 17:33, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

Um?[edit]

Is Annabeth older than Percy? under characters she is listed as 15 and he is 14...Homework2 pass a notesign! 17:13, 11 May 2010 (UTC)

That's a good question...let's see, it is correct about his age, but I can't find anything in the book about her age. I'll do a thorough search this afternoon. PrincessofLlyr royal court 17:24, 11 May 2010 (UTC)
PJ wikia has them listed as both born in August 1993. Opinions anyone? PrincessofLlyr royal court 17:28, 11 May 2010 (UTC)
That's helpful...sigh. I say just make their ages the same throughout the articles. Homework2 pass a notesign! 17:35, 11 May 2010 (UTC)
YesY Done. All of our other articles show them as the same age throughout. PrincessofLlyr royal court 17:38, 11 May 2010 (UTC)
We can't use PJ wikia as a source. pluma 23:59, 26 December 2011 (UTC)

Which B class requirement is missing?[edit]

  1. The article is suitably referenced, with inline citations where necessary. It has reliable sources, and any important or controversial material which is likely to be challenged is cited. The use of citation templates is not required but the use of tags is encouraged.
  2. The article reasonably covers the topic, and does not contain obvious omissions or inaccuracies. It contains a large proportion of the material necessary for an A-Class article, although some sections may need expansion, and some less important topics may be missing.
  3. The article has a defined structure. Content should be organized into groups of related material, including a lead section and all the sections that can reasonably be included in an article of its kind.
  4. The article is reasonably well-written. The prose contains no major grammatical errors and flows sensibly, but it certainly need not be "brilliant". The Manual of Style need not be followed rigorously.
  5. The article contains supporting materials where appropriate. Illustrations are encouraged, though not required. Diagrams and an infobox etc. should be included where they are relevant and useful to the content.
  6. The article presents its content in an appropriately accessible way. It is written with as broad an audience in mind as possible. Although Wikipedia is more than just a general encyclopedia, the article should not assume unnecessary technical background and technical terms should be explained or avoided where possible.


?[edit]

How is Sea of Monsters High Importance and this Mid Importance? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Winner 42 (talkcontribs) 21:29, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

They are both high importance within the percy Jackson task force, but mid in the WikiProject Novels. Derild4921 21:53, 29 May 2010 (UTC)
I think they should be considered top importance. Should I change it? pluma 23:16, 23 December 2011 (UTC)

Calypso[edit]

Why is she hidden still? Homework2 TalkWhat I do! 15:57, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

Because we didn't ever make a decision about whether or not she should be listed as a main character. Honestly, I think she's major within the book and should have a short entry as a character. PrincessofLlyr royal court 18:26, 5 June 2010 (UTC)
I was the one who hid it because I didn't really consider her as a major character in this book at that time. Come to think of it, she did play quite a role and did have more scene than most other characters. Standing neutral now. Any other comments? -Mktsay123 (talk) 14:21, 12 June 2010 (UTC)
Okay, she was pretty much in one chapter...but without her I can see the book being a lot different. She IS extremely minor...that is a hard one. Personally, I wouldn't put her, because it says "major characters" and she is not at all major. Maybe we could mention her in the summary. --Glimmer721 (talk) 01:43, 17 June 2010 (UTC)
I have removed her standalone entry and kept her mention in Percy's summary. Hope this is OK, Airplaneman 23:51, 17 June 2010 (UTC)
Sounds good. PrincessofLlyr royal court 00:40, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

What to do now?[edit]

What more should we do? I'm not sure we really need the Awards and Nominations section; maybe we can merge it with critical reception. Any ideas? --Glimmer721 talk 00:45, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

I agree with you, we should merge the two sections because they are saying the same thing. I'm thinking that we should have a sub-heading for each major reviewer. Any other ideas? Winner 42 Talk to me! 00:36, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

GA Review[edit]

This review is transcluded from Talk:The Battle of the Labyrinth/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer:Hurricanehink (talk) 17:25, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

Seeing as you reviewed mine, I'll do you the favor too.

  • The lead is on the short side. Is there a way you could expand it? Ideally to two paragraphs, but at least to beyond 4 lines.
    • Fixed pluma Ø 03:27, 14 September 2011 (UTC)
  • "During a game against giant scorpions at the camp" - what sort of game?
    • Fixed pluma Ø 03:28, 14 September 2011 (UTC)
      • Not sure what word describes best; "activity" better summarizes than "game". --Perseus8235 21:45, 19 February 2011 (UTC)
        • Well, it's just weird and vague seeing "during a game". ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 17:47, 21 February 2011 (UTC)
          • Fixed pluma Ø 03:12, 14 September 2011 (UTC)
  • "Using the Labyrinth, Percy, Annabeth, Grover, and Tyson must find Daedalus so that Luke cannot get Ariadne's string, thereby foiling Luke's invasion. Ariadne's string is used to navigate the Labyrinth." - that could be worded better. It doesn't give any indication why Daedalus is important here, and the latter sentence is on the short side. Try rewording.
    • Fixed pluma Ø 04:38, 14 September 2011 (UTC)
  • Is there a reason Tyson is linked the second time it's used, and not the first?
  • Can you reorganize the structure of the plot summary? There are two paragraphs, the latter of which is insanely long.
    • Fixed—added a paragraph break. Airplaneman 17:50, 20 February 2011 (UTC)
  • "Following a hint from the Greek God Hephaestus, Percy travels to Mt. St. Helens, where he finds telekhines, which Percy calls "sea demons". Percy attacks the telekhines and they chase him." - the former sentence is a bit of a run-on with how many comma phrases there are, and then the latter is rather short. Could you find a way to reword for better flow? You also say "Percy" three times in two sentences.
  • "Percy finds Annabeth and they have a short argument during which Percy tells Annabeth to flee. Percy gets a kiss from Annabeth and Annabeth disappears." - you mention Percy and Annabeth three times each in two sentence. Please reword, and ideally combine the two - "After Percy finds Annabeth, the two have a brief argument during which he tells her to flee, and she disappears after giving him a kiss." Something like that
  • "who is able to see through the Mist" - that is the first time you mention Mist, but it doesn't say what it is
    • Fixed --Perseus8235 21:52, 19 February 2011 (UTC)
    • I've also additionally added a wikilink. Glimmer721 talk 00:46, 22 February 2011 (UTC)
  • You link Daedalus three times in the plot summary - unnecessary.
  • How do they discover that Daedalus is Quintus?
    • Fixed pluma Ø 22:06, 11 September 2011 (UTC)
  • "the big prophecy" - that's the first time any big prophecy is mentioned... Remember, the article has to be understandable to someone who doesn't know the books.
    • Doing... pluma 19:30, 25 December 2011 (UTC)
      • It looks like someone already Fixed this but did not indicate it here. pluma 19:34, 25 December 2011 (UTC)
  • "Luke has already reached Daedalus and got Ariadne's string" - why "has already reached" here? Most of the article, you use present tense, which is fine, but occasionally you use the "has + past tense verb form". Consistency would be nice. Oh, and "got Ariadne's string" is sort of poor wording. Did he steal it? Discover it? Stumble across it?
    • Fixed pluma Ø 03:01, 14 September 2011 (UTC)
  • "Grover comes to the rescue" - really, "comes to the rescue"? It's an encyclopedia article, not a book review ;) Try rewording with something a little more professional
    • --Perseus8235 21:53, 19 February 2011 (UTC)
      • But now this sentence mentions Grover three times. "Grover finally finds Pan, but the god of the wild is dying and wants Grover to tell the other satyrs that they must save the natural world themselves—his spirit passes into all present, Grover in particular, when he dies." ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 17:47, 21 February 2011 (UTC)
        • Fixed pluma Ø 03:08, 14 September 2011 (UTC)
  • Is there a reason Rachel Dare's character section is longer than other characters? Is she that much more important than, say, Percy?
  • It seems very trivial that Tyson enjoys peanut butter sandwiches
  • The Critical Reception section looks quite awkward having one long paragraph and then one tiny one. Are there any other negative reviews? The article needs to be balanced, so if there were it should be mentioned. Also, I'm not so sure the best format is copying from all of the reviews. IMO, the article would be much better if you paraphrased some of the reviews.
  • I notice there is no section on "Development and publication", which I feel is a pretty glaring omission. How soon after the previous book was this one started, for example? Was it always planned to be the 2nd last in the series?
    • Although this would be original research, his blog says in 2007 that the "Titan's Curse" is third-to-last. --Perseus8235 15:22, 20 February 2011 (UTC)
      • Well, try and find some other information on the development. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 17:47, 21 February 2011 (UTC)
        • Is there any place you can go to find negative reviews (like rotten tomatoes but for books)? It seems like people only publish the good ones. pluma 02:07, 24 December 2011 (UTC)
  • "The Last Olympian was released May 5, 2009.[13] It is the last book of the series." - two things - could you combine them, and cite the latter sentence?

That's it for now, I guess. Good luck with all of that. If you have any questions, feel free to respond on here, or ask me on my talk page. --♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 17:25, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

I didn't bother striking out the completed tasks, since not everything was addressed. I'm sorry to do it, but given the outstanding concerns, I'll have to fail it. Let me know when you do finish everything on here, and I'll be glad to give another review (although it need not be a GA review). --♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 05:03, 28 February 2011 (UTC)