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Historians needed!

The Wiki for Todmorden says, 'Although now usually considered to be entirely in Yorkshire, the historic border between Yorkshire and Lancashire runs through the centre of the town'

I'm not sure this is entirely true. I'm certain that the borders have been moved over time and Todmorden is now entirely 100% in Yorkshire.

Should it be, 'The historic border ran through this town'? or something similar?

This is true, there is a sign marking the border in the town centre. I think it was administratively part of the West Riding before 1974, but is geographically split between Yorkshire and Lancashire. Lancsalot 09:26, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
The border between Yorkshire and Lancashire used to run through the town before 1888 when Todmorden was entirely consumed by West Yorkshire. It's been entirely Yorkshire since then even if the Post Office still prefer you to put 'Lancashire' on letters as it messes up their OL14 Oldham (in Lancashire) postcode. More details are at
"through the centre of town" is most accurate, as the border ran along the main road that formed the high street until 1888.
The border between Lancashire and Yorkshire until 1888 was the river which actually runs under the town hall. The border marker with white rose and red rose is about 100 yards away off Burnley Road. The Lancs postal address is a leftover from the old counties, as is the fact that the Todmorden Cricket Club plays in the Lancashire League. Going even further back, the town was once in the Diocese of Manchester. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nico Pendle (talkcontribs) 17:39, 20 May 2010 (UTC)


Under "External Links" there is reference to "Sir John Fielden" which links to an article about John Fielden (d.1849) who is often referred to as "Honest John". He was elected as M.P. but I'm sure he was never knighted! -Ethicaljohn 21:55, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

I agree and have amended it accordingly. - Scribble Monkey 08:45, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Todcoatofarms.jpg[edit]

Nuvola apps important.svg

Image:Todcoatofarms.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 05:45, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

Town hall[edit]

There's a great free-to-use image of the Town Hall here when someone gets time to access their WikiCommons account. Thanks, --Jza84 |  Talk  19:23, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

  • Yes check.svg Done - If I remember there was another image you noted on a Yorkshire place but cannot remember which one. Can you jog my memory? Keith D (talk) 22:21, 8 May 2008 (UTC)
That's a toughy! I'll try and have a think. I do have a commons account, but if I'm interputted and don't want to loose the image, I make a note of it. I'll get back to you! --Jza84 |  Talk  23:06, 8 May 2008 (UTC)


Surely the list of notable residents would NOT be best written as prose, but rather, as it is presently, formatted in a bulleted list. - could the tag suggesting otherwise be removed?

See WP:UKCITIES. --Jza84 |  Talk  00:12, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
This bit "the suggestions on this page are merely guidelines, not rules written in stone"? ~ Scribble Monkey (talk) 12:10, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
Not so much that no (although fair enough, you make a point), but that lists should be presented as prose is recommended for a reason. Indeed, anyone who's tried to take a settlement to FA with a list of notable people will find that it is very much frowned upon by reviewers (I've tried myself). It is possible to make really good sections out of these. WP:GM (which I freely admit being part of) has taken many such articles with prose-based notable people sections through GA and FA. And one has to remember these are large towns and settlements that would otherwise have hundreds of entries.
There are ways around it though - take a look at how say Sale, Greater Manchester tackles things, or Milnrow, or Chadderton perhaps? Each of those point to a list-class page. --Jza84 |  Talk  14:09, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

10:06, 21 February 2011 (UTC) The list should include John Nowell 1802-67. Worked as a hand-loom weaver, but better known as a bryologist. A liverwort genus Nowellia is named after him and there is an obelisk erected in memory of him in the grounds of the pariah church. Source Mosse and Liverworts by Ron Porley and Nick Hodgetts, Collins New Naturalist series 2005. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk)


The population is for the upper Calder Valley, not Todmorden. I would have only thought the population of Todmorden would have been around 4000-5000. Can anyone find a more suitable figure. In the meantime, I shall note where the figure is from on the page. Mtaylor848 (talk) 16:10, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

The link provided has "rotted", but the spreadsheets produced by the Office for National Statistics records Todmorden's 2001 population as 11,555 [1]. Nev1 (talk) 16:24, 9 July 2009 (UTC)
Thats right. I added the rotted link when it was still live - it's possibly the population of Todmorden civil parish though. --Jza84 |  Talk  17:13, 9 July 2009 (UTC)


As there's been some to and fro with external links lately perhaps the section should have some discussion as to what is and is not allowed or relevant? For the discussion, I'll remind people of the official Wikipedia policy at WP:EL. I'd also advise people that if their particular site is notable then you may wish create a page for it as I did for Todmorden_Markets. Creating a page avoids an overly long External Links section and allows more than one person to contribute to a subject, unlike external sites. Shaunaegis (talk) 13:25, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

Must say I am not convinced about the separate article for the markets and have tagged it {{Notability}} & {{Advert}} as it just looks like advertising to me. What do other think? Keith D (talk) 15:48, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
I too am not convinced that a separate article is the solution. I would prefer the sites being used as footnotes or references, as that would prove that they reinforce and elaborate on the article rather than rely on the tenuous premise that they are relevant merely because they relate to Todmorden. It would also improve the quality of the article, which would be of benefit to Wikipedia as well as to the linked site. - Scribble Monkey (talk) 19:13, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
I did think of using references but as with links, I'd suspect they'd be subject to vandalism, which we've not solved in this dicussion so far. Shaunaegis (talk) 09:02, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
Fair point. Also I suppose the reliability of the source could be called into question if both the article and source were edited by the same persons, i.e. they merely reinforce each other's claims rather than one is a definitive source. - Scribble Monkey (talk) 11:17, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
A separate article made sense to me based on the fact there were other towns with markets already. See for just England. The language used was based on looking at those other pages and others. Shaunaegis (talk) 09:02, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

The Todmorden_Markets page must surely be a vehicle for advertsing and promotion. The author is the very same person who produced the website which is linked to not once but twice from the page, in both references and external links. (talk) 01:29, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Please create a user instead of logging in anonymously and please discuss this at where the discussion belongs. Shaunaegis (talk) 11:30, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

We don't seem to have made any progress here, which is unfortunate as that would indicate that the links are still not relevant and should be deleted. - Scribble Monkey (talk) 23:43, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

Can't believe we've still got that link there despite everyone agreeing to delete it or did it get snuck back in? Anyway - deleting it now. Shaunaegis (talk) 15:57, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Alan Godfrey incident[edit]

This section seems to be attaching more importance to itself than it should with a top level heading and a lot of text. No offence intended to the author who is obviously passionate about the subject but it's not majorly important to Todmorden. Shaunaegis (talk) 15:57, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Agree, it should be removed.--J3Mrs (talk) 08:34, 20 September 2011 (UTC)


I have removed most of the external links. If they are so important they could be used as references within the article. Most were commercial. Providing tourist and travel information is not what wikipedia is about.--J3Mrs (talk) 09:02, 19 September 2011 (UTC)

FTA: "There are many events that go one in the town hall. there's dys were childre ca come i and do activitys.the hole community is allowed in. It is a very friedly place."

Seriously? What illiterate moron writes these articles? — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 17:33, 6 January 2012 (UTC)

Community gardens?[edit]

There's a blurb in the article about this. Should it mention the two women spearheading the project and that there are gardens all around the town? One is Mary Clare but I forget the name of the other. I just saw them featured on US public television news. --RThompson82 (talk) 22:48, 29 July 2012 (UTC)


Just if you want to know: In German "Tod" means "Death" (as a noun, "dead" would be "tot" with T) and "Morden" is "to murder." So a German would understand that village's name as "to murder to death" or "death murder."-- (talk) 07:07, 21 May 2013 (UTC)