Talk:Tomb of the Unknown Soldier
|This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier article.|
|This article is of interest to the following WikiProjects:|
- 1 Previously unsectioned comments
- 2 Gilleleje, Denmark
- 3 Details of War Memorial in Melbourne deleted
- 4 Deletion of speculation that no more tombs would be built
- 5 Merge discussion with Tomb of the Unknown Soldier Guard Identification Badge
- 6 Cathedral
- 7 Mercie of freedom from katie dodge
- 8 Philippines' Libingan ng mga Bayani
- 9 Catalonia is not a country
- 10 Identified
- 11 too much info on Canada
- 12 QI on Unknown Soldier
- 13 Payton Thomas
- 14 Tomb of the Unknown - Battle of the Little Big Horn
- 15 Reference to Walt Whitman as originator of the idea of a tomb
- 16 India Gate?
- 17 Malaysia's Tugu Negara
- 18 Blah, Blah, Blah
- 19 we dont want the new virginia tomb included?
- 20 Conceptual context
Previously unsectioned comments
The idea of a Tomb of the Unknown Warrior, the first conceived in 1916 by the Reverend David Railton, who while serving as an army chaplain on the Western Front had seen a grave marked by a rough cross, which bore the pencil written legend 'An Unknown British Soldier'.
He wrote to the Dean of Westminister in 1920 proposing that an unidentified British soldier from the battlefields in France be buried with due ceremony in Westminister Abbey "amongst the kings" to represent the many thousands of Empire dead. The idea was strongly supported by the Dean and the then Prime Minister Lloyd George. There was initial opposition from King George V and others but a surge of emotional support from the great number of bereaved families ensured its adoption. Arrangements were placed in the hands of George Nathaniel Curzon who prepared in committee the service and location.
The body was chosen from four bodies draped with Union Flags at the chapel at Ste Pol near Arras, France on the night of 7th November, 1920 by Brigadier General L.J. Wyatt and Lieutenant Colonel E.A.S. Gell. The Body was placed into a coffin and sealed. The following morning a multi-denominational service was held for the soldier who's coffin bore the legend 'A British Warrior who fell in the Great War'.
The Coffin was then taken to Boulogne under guard by French soldiers and placed aboard HMS Verdun, Marshall Foch saluted the coffin as it rested on the Quayside before loading. As the flotilla carrying the coffin closed on Dover Castle it received a 19 gun Field Marshall's salute.
On the morning of the 11th November, 1920 the Coffin was loaded onto a gun carriage of the Royal Horse Artillery and drawn by 6 horses through through immense and silent crowds. The route followed was Hyde Park Corner, The Mall, and to Whitehall where the Cenotaph was unveiled by King George V. The Cortege was then followed by King, Royal Family and ministers of state to Westminster Abbey, where the Coffin was borne into the West Nave of the Abbey flanked by an honour guard of 100 holders of the Victoria Cross. The coffin was then interred with soil from each of the main battlefields and covered with a silk pall. The Armed Services then stood as honour guard as an estimated one and quarter million mourners filed past during the seven days before the tomb was closed. The ceremony appears to have served as a form of catharsis for collective grief on a scale not previously known.
The grave was then capped with a black marble stone featuring an inscription composed by Dean Ryle.
BENEATH THIS STONE RESTS THE BODY
OF A BRITISH WARRIOR
UNKNOWN BY NAME OR RANK
BROUGHT FROM FRANCE TO LIE AMONG
THE MOST ILLUSTRIOUS OF THE LAND
AND BURIED HERE ON ARMISTICE DAY
11 NOV: 1920, IN THE PRESENCE OF
HIS MAJESTY KING GEORGE V
HIS MINISTERS OF STATE
THE CHIEFS OF HIS FORCES
AND A VAST CONCOURSE OF THE NATION
THUS ARE COMMEMORATED THE MANY
MULTITUDES WHO DURING THE GREAT
WAR OF 1914 - 1918 GAVE THE MOST THAT
MAN CAN GIVE LIFE ITSELF
FOR KING AND COUNTRY
FOR LOVED ONES HOME AND EMPIRE
FOR THE SACRED CAUSE OF JUSTICE AND
THE FREEDOM OF THE WORLD
THEY BURIED HIM AMONG THE KINGS BECAUSE HE
HAD DONE GOOD TOWARD GOD AND TOWARD
From Tomb of the Unknown Warrior article
Details of War Memorial in Melbourne deleted
"Much work goes into some Tomb Of the Unknown Soldier memorials, for example, the War Memorial in Melbourne, Australia, has a small hole cut into the roof above the tomb (which is a large granite stone set into the floor). On the 11th minute, of the 11th hour, of the 11th day of the 11th month (11:11 AM, November 11th), a ray of light shall pass over the inscription 'Lest We Forget', engraved on the stone in gold, during this the Last Post is played by a bugler. Over 5000 mathematical calculations were conducted so this would occur, and it is said that it will continue for 1000 years. As a side note, a light is placed in the hole and at 11:11 AM every day, it will artificially pass light over the inscription, whilst a taped recording of the last post is played, the light is removed for the 11th November ceremony, and a real bugler plays, this artificial ceremony is so visitors can experience this without having to attend on the 11th november, which is often restricted."
because it seems that this should be in a more specific Wikipedia article. Motmot 19:11, 24 January 2007 (UTC)
Deletion of speculation that no more tombs would be built
I deleted this section wherein it was stated that no more tombes were lokely to be built because 1) It was personal speculation 2) It was proven incorrect in that the New Zealand tomb was erected in 2004, well after DNA advances 126.96.36.199 22:40, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
Merge discussion with Tomb of the Unknown Soldier Guard Identification Badge
I changed Cathedral to abbey in the first paragraph. Westminster Abbey and Westminster Cathedral are 2 different things and the abbey ISN'T a cathedral.
Padsley 10:07, 30 October 2007 (UTC)
Mercie of freedom from katie dodge
A journey of emotions lead solders to a life unthinkable, Escaping the lives they once had where cowardly actions ain't aloud... The volunteers of bravery makes memories that will scar them for a lifetime, but still they seek-out into the dusk of the devils sand box with a rifle in hand and their rucksack on there back. Fighting proudly for the freedom of others as they reach there location. They stand there ground. There hearts pure and there souls are bulletproof. They clear away any thoughts they may have of their love ones. Firing sounds covering the silence. We are American warriors with a message of freedom. Secrets for survival becomes an emotional rage of horrifying adventure. These are the forgotten heroes that fight upon us, as the stream blue sky becomes a cloud of gray they still don't hesitate to use there knowledge. Brave is what they are. For some it's only a matter of time until they're standing with God looking down upon those who survived. The rest lives on with the memories of being victimized by the war. These are the secrets of unknown heroes who risked everything for the freedom that we take advantage of...
Dedicate: to the unknown soldiers
By:Katie Dodge 29 of Maine —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.8.131.52 (talk) 23:48, 18 May 2008 (UTC)
Philippines' Libingan ng mga Bayani
Catalonia is not a country
Catalonia is not a country, so it should not be here. Catalonia is a region of Spain, so please someone put it where it belongs. Forgive my english --184.108.40.206 (talk) 17:17, 20 October 2008 (UTC)camdem--220.127.116.11 (talk) 17:17, 20 October 2008 (UTC)
- Catalonia is indeed a country, and the Catalans are a nation. However, it is not a sovereign state. "Region" means nothing. If you did your homework, you'd also know that part of Catalonia is in the French state (see Northern Catalonia)--MacRusgail (talk) 18:23, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
too much info on Canada
I do not know why the Canadian Tomb should get so much space when the Description of the other tombs are so short i think it should be shortend any ideas as to how it should be done? Alinkinthefuture (talk) 16:48, 15 April 2009 (UTC)
QI on Unknown Soldier
There was an interesting section on QI this week about the Unknown Soldier. Assuming it's accurate, and if someone can source it, there were several interesting snippets:
In the UK the WW1 unknown soldier was given a state funeral with full military honours. There was a guard of 100 VC winners. Guests of honour were 100 women who had lost their husbands AND all their sons in WW1.
It was also said that in the UK and USA - and presumably most "western" armies, DNA samples are taken of all military staff, so there are unlikely to be "unknown" soldiers in future wars. Apepper (talk) 21:50, 21 February 2010 (UTC)
Tomb of the Unknown - Battle of the Little Big Horn
There is a Tomb of the Unknown at the Custer Battlefield Museum in Garryowen, Montana, to remember those fallen at the Battle of the Little Big Horn. At a ceremony for the 50th anniversary, representatives from the US and American Indian governments came together to "bury the hatchet." A tomahawk was placed at the new memorial to represent the ending of hostilities. http://www.custermuseum.org/Garryowen.htm Custerbattlefieldmuseum (talk) 17:39, 12 November 2010 (UTC)
Reference to Walt Whitman as originator of the idea of a tomb
In the intro we have The idea was first conceived by Walt Whitman during his first hand experience in the American Civil War, where he reflects in Specimen Days on "the Bravest Soldier crumbles in mother earth, unburied and unknown." while interesting this doesn't make, or reference, any mention of a combined tomb but rather WW's recognition that there is a lack of recognition. It seems to be fairly well established that David Railtonis credited with the concept. One reference: The Unknown Soldier by Neil Hanson. Perhaps this should be reworded? Robertp42 (talk) 03:52, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
- cf. The Unknown Warrior, David Railton, Arc de Triomphe#The Unknown Soldier, fr:Tombe du Soldat inconnu (France) --Vsop.de (talk) 09:39, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
Malaysia's Tugu Negara
As this article is about "Tomb of the Unknown Soldier", monuments listed must be a, well, tomb of unknown soldier(s). As such, Tugu Negara in Kuala Lumpur does not contain any remain of any warfighter. Thus, in my opinion, that monument does not meet the criteria of being a tomb of unknown soldier since it is not a tomb.
I am going to delete that entry about Tugu Negara, with the reason above. I am going to wait a week, until end of 07 May 2011. If there is no reasonable argument against it, Tugu Negara will be removed. Jusfiq (talk) 02:45, 1 May 2011 (UTC)
Blah, Blah, Blah
The second paragraph has a humongous, terribly-long, excruciatingly-written, poorly-phrased, badly formed run-on sentence, in parentheses, no less, reciting a mini-history that could be better placed elsewhere in the article so as to not cause readers to completely lose track of what is being said in this article. Let's see if someone can straighten it out. Bigdumbdinosaur (talk) 01:13, 15 July 2011 (UTC)
- Quite right. I've some some clean up. "Dig in" (pun intended)! Help is always welcome. --S. Rich (talk) 04:29, 15 July 2011 (UTC)
Btw, hola people. :) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:306:3BEF:1B30:ACDB:871F:A6D5:41B9 (talk) 02:58, 10 November 2012 (UTC) Oh and sorry for my SENTENCE FRAGMENTS, with parentheses! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:306:3BEF:1B30:ACDB:871F:A6D5:41B9 (talk) 03:02, 10 November 2012 (UTC)
we dont want the new virginia tomb included?
why not? is it something to be ashamed of? there are more unidentifiable american troops in the virginia landfill tomb than any other 'unknown soldier tomb' in the usa. it was even authorised by the us air force.
- It may have been removed because the information was unsourced. The information being inserted into the article needs reliable sources to verify the information. - SudoGhost 14:55, 12 December 2011 (UTC)