Talk:Wiki

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Former good article Wiki was one of the good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

Video of Ward Cunningham has Subtitles that are Inaccurate and Misleading[edit]

Greetings. Although I could find little to indicate any current momentum to improve this page, I am nonetheless, motivated to ask if any Wiki regulars have watched and read the Ward Cunningham video which is embedded at the top right of the page. Perhaps after donating money, I feel a bit more "protective" of Wikipedia's reputation. While the project needs no gallants to protect its virtues, its credibility is another challenge altogether. Specifically, the subtitles to the video of Ward Cunningham, titled "Interview with Ward Cunningham, inventor of the wiki" are an inaccurate match of spoken words to written words not just in the many irritating misspellings (usually of homophones), but in the meaning of his words. Twice the subtitles contradict what he is saying about the creation of his first wiki. One of these occurs when he talks about creating a " new collaborative text program" and the subtitles state he was creating a "new tax program". The obvious oral/written disconnects such as when he says, "I tried to write", the subtitles read, "I tried to right" are the type of "folksy" mistakes that we tend to overlook when watching our neighbor's home videos. Criticizing would seem churlish since in those videos the visuals are the main focus and the printed words are usually of secondary importance. (Also criticism of this type might actually impel the neighbor to edit those videos and show them again to demonstrate how our feedback had been integrated.) But in this video both oral and written presentations seem like they ought to be discussing the same ideas by using the same words? Or am I being too picky? He talks about the origins of the word, "wiki", saying "I used a Hawaiian word" and we see the photograph of a Hawaiian 'WIKI WIKI' shuttle. But the subtitles read" I decided to use a "wine word". Really? As in, "I find this Chardonnay to be crisp, with intonations of pears, hints of grass leaving a truly resplendent wiki on the palette." I'll take the Merlot, thanks.

This is not even to mention that the video itself needs to redirect to "Surrealism". Because it is surreal when Mr. Cunningham (around 9:33) discussing the merits of collaborative projects says "... because you know some of it, he knows some of it..." and the text is displaying "...like pi or John Sullivan all around us". Have videos ever been vandalized on WP before now?

Ironically, one of the most basic elements of a wiki, the ability to immediately correct an error is denied to us on the page describing this very element. I could only sit slack-jawed at what I was reading but unable to correct any of the mistakes. And they just keep coming. Try a sampling: 2:57, 3:02, 3:48, 3:56, 4:13. Many people with adequate hearing read subtitles. We can't shake our collective head and say that the hearing-challenged will be the only ones who get a stilted, sometimes nonsensical, and almost always inaccurate rendition of Mr. Cunningham's remarks.

The fact that no one has mentioned any of these errors, the fact the video is never mentioned in the archived notes, as far as I can determine, leads me to believe I am overlooking an important decision by the videographer, the transcriber, Mr. Cunningham and the Editors advising those of us who just happened upon the video, that there is a reason of all this. A statement to assuage people like me (who had a sinking feeling while watching the video that if this is as good as Wikipedia can do, then I do want a wine word to go with my pi. I do want John Sullivan to change the tax plan). A reassurance that the dysfunctional subtitles are meant for something more than a merely inept rendition of a man's words. Perhaps a written way to acknowledge the importance of Vox Pop You Lie, a peace offering to those resentful of literacy, "See we can be just as imprecise and out-of-touch as you. Welcome brother."

Obviously my first written contribution has already violated a number of "Talk" section guidelines and the helpful suggestions for the beginner. Brevity certainly died a quick death. Specific errors are not enumerated adequately, nor anywhere near completely. I am far from neutral about what I see as a problem and I have no way to offer help since I can edit subtitles, but not on an embedded video. I feel tempted to delete this entire entry. But these errors I've committed, particularly in going on this long are indicative of the feelings I have. It is embarrassing to watch the video knowing how many people land on this page daily. It is the first-listed on Google and Bing when querying "Wiki" but look what else redirects here as well. Even "Happy Days". I can't imagine how Mrs. Cunningham must feel. Not to mention Ward's wife if he's married. So I apologize for my long-windedness. Sort of. I would like to help fix these errors because that's whats important here, but I don't know how. If this has all been hashed out and resolved, I can only say I tried to find the pages where the problem and the fix were discussed, but I could not. Maybe if readers see such a long message and think it's a rant or someone about to be barred from WP making his final statement, it'll interest them enough to read it. I'd like to think that might happen. Because its scary Out Here on the ice, alone. With only wine words and Mr. Sullivan to keep me warm. Thanks for reading this if you did. I'll look forward to what happens now. Waiter! Czech please. (I'm using this contribution as a text right-off).

Top2bottomjk (talk) 18:11, 10 December 2014 (UTC)

Good catch! The subtitles can be found at this page on Wikimedia Commons and corrected by anybody. It looks as if User:Tbayer (WMF) took an automatic transcription back in May 2014 and cleaned up some but not all of the text - if you search for the phrase "manually corrected" while editing the subtitles, you can see where the user stopped and started. A little surprised that there's no template for flagging unfinished transcriptions on Commons. --McGeddon (talk) 18:31, 10 December 2014 (UTC)
I have listened upto 5:50 and heard no glaring inconsistencies, so far. I went back to 2:57, even. But it captures the genuine Ward Cunningham, whom I have spoken to at Wikimania 2006. I will not pursue the thread further. Improve the transciption, by all means; keep it accurate. Thats in the spirit of Wiki, after all. --Ancheta Wis   (talk | contribs) 18:42, 10 December 2014 (UTC)
Thanks for the accurate summary, McGeddon (and for the ping). Yes, when this video was announced on the Wikimedia blog, we invited people to edit the subtitles further, but nobody has worked on them since, probably also because they are hard to find in the format in which the video is currently embedded on this page (there's still work to do on improving the software support for subtitles). Sorry about this, Top2bottomjk, and you're welcome to add your corrections to the page linked by McGeddon. I'll try to do further work on these subtitles myself once I have some spare time.
(Side note on multiple account use: I previously also edited this page under my volunteer account, HaeB.)
Regards, Tbayer (WMF) (talk) 03:47, 11 December 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 19 January 2015[edit]

176.10.86.231 (talk) 10:37, 19 January 2015 (UTC) Wikipedia is very useful a lot of the time but it is also full of BS so the moral of the story is, do not believe everything you read.

X mark.svg Not done; Self-evident and trivial. Andy Dingley (talk) 10:48, 19 January 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 6 February 2015[edit]

Dear wikipedia i have some information regarding your website and i would like to share it with the world. your website was first known as the World Encyclopedia on the Web. i would just like to point that out to the millions of readers. Thank you Sjlogan77 (talk) 16:28, 6 February 2015 (UTC)

X mark.svg Not done That is not a semi-protected edit request - and it is wrong - see History of Wikipedia - Arjayay (talk) 16:49, 6 February 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 8 April 2015[edit]

I would like to edit this article due to it not being 'Acurate'. Please allow me to edit this, thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.203.24.131 (talk) 15:08, 8 April 2015 (UTC)

external rendering sand and cement[edit]

I wish to know the materials and the proportions to render the outside of a brick building and make it shower proof thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.176.145.219 (talk) 10:08, 30 April 2015 (UTC)