Talk:X-ray (chess)

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old talk[edit]

so in this instance, which piece is being felt through which? Doops 03:21, 11 May 2004 (UTC)

Sorry I didn't see the question and reply sooner. The white rook is felt through the black rook. Specifically, the white rook on c8 defends the white queen on f8, even though the black rook on d8 is in the way. --Fritzlein 02:50, 27 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Define felt? lysdexia 05:01, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)

The x-ray is a good thing to know, but I did not feel it showed it clearly enough. I added the second image to show the position after 2. Qf8+ where the x-ray is most clear. The variations in black's play are not illustrative given the topic at hand so I removed them, I hope that doesn't offend, I just felt that the point here is to illustrate the x-ray attack, not cover alternate moves possible and why they were not any good. The x-ray attack is subtle to chess novices and I think the second image and the additional discussion added makes it very clear. erislover

Would not the best move be to exchange the rooks to avoid this, or is this what the mistake of the novice would be? -Avochelm 12:16, 4 August 2005 (UTC)

Exchanging rooks was the line that erislover deleted in the interests of clarity (I understand the reasons for doing so, but I wonder if it's going to cause more confusion than englightenment; perhaps it's better to find a "cleaner" example of the X-ray which doesn't have such sidelines?). The line is question is: 1.Rc8 Rxc8 2.Qe7! Qxe7 (if 2...Qc6 3.d8Q+ is neatest) 3.dxc8Q+. --Camembert 13:01, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
The alternate lines can get pretty complicated, but since someone asked about it almost immediately after I removed it, I guess it was best to have it in. In that case, I have tried to be thorough. It still strikes meas distracting, but these are the compromises that must be reached. Players advanced enough to see the possibilities without mentioning it would already know the x-ray attack anyway, so the alternate lines do make sense in that light. Erislover 15:43, 4 August 2005 (UTC)

question[edit]

I have a question.


Bxh6+
a b c d e f g h
8
Chessboard480.svg
a8 black rook
c8 black bishop
d8 black queen
g8 black rook
a7 black pawn
b7 black pawn
f7 black pawn
g7 black king
e6 black pawn
g6 black pawn
h6 white bishop
c5 black pawn
d4 white pawn
f4 white circle
g4 white knight
a2 white pawn
b2 white pawn
c2 white pawn
f2 white pawn
g2 white pawn
a1 white rook
e1 white king
h1 white rook
8
7 7
6 6
5 5
4 4
3 3
2 2
1 1
a b c d e f g h
White: bishop takes bishop on h6; check
Kh7
a b c d e f g h
8
Chessboard480.svg
a8 black rook
c8 black bishop
d8 black queen
g8 black rook
a7 black pawn
b7 black pawn
f7 black pawn
g7 black circle
h7 black king
e6 black pawn
g6 black pawn
h6 white bishop
c5 black pawn
d4 white pawn
g4 white knight
a2 white pawn
b2 white pawn
c2 white pawn
f2 white pawn
g2 white pawn
a1 white rook
e1 white king
h1 white rook
8
7 7
6 6
5 5
4 4
3 3
2 2
1 1
a b c d e f g h
Black: king to h7 avoids check

My question is: Why didn't Black King move to h8 instead of h7? How is h7 a better move than h8? Or is either move as checkmate-able as the other? Thank you. bananaketchup (talk) 06:38, 21 February 2009 (UTC)

They are equivalent. Bf8 checkmates with either. Bubba73 (talk), 15:11, 22 February 2009 (UTC)

Accuracy of this article[edit]

I think the definition of X-ray given in this article may be wrong, and no sources are given. See Wikipedia talk:Wikiproject Chess#X-ray (chess) for discussion. Quale (talk) 07:39, 22 February 2009 (UTC)

Redirected to Skewer (chess) per aforementioned discussion. Quale (talk) 16:43, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
I un-redirected it, restoring the supported usage, and deleting the usage that is, as I had indicated by my fact (citation needed) tag, unsupported. Krakatoa (talk) 01:08, 18 March 2009 (UTC)

example[edit]

Silman, Complete book of chess strategy, p 133
a b c d e f g h
8
Chessboard480.svg
g8 black king
b7 black pawn
f7 black pawn
g7 black pawn
h7 black pawn
e6 black pawn
f6 black knight
c5 white knight
d5 black bishop
g4 white pawn
c3 white pawn
e3 white pawn
f3 white bishop
g3 white king
h3 white pawn
f2 white pawn
8
7 7
6 6
5 5
4 4
3 3
2 2
1 1
a b c d e f g h
1. Nxb7! and the knight is protected by an x-ray

Silman's Complete book of chess strategy has two pages about x-ray on 132-33, one example here. Bubba73 (talk), 03:09, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

I will have to check and see if I have that book (I'm not at home now). That is very interesting, since it supports the controversial meaning of the term - one piece supporting a friendly piece through an enemy piece. That meaning was in the original version of the article, but no one could find a source to support it. As you'll recall, Quale (understandably) was insistent that without a source for that meaning, it had to go. This is an important tactical concept, and one that is sometimes hard to see. Another, flashier example is IM Andrew Whiteley-Dunn, London 1989, a big upset apparently: 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e5 3.dxe5 Ne4 4.a3 Qh4 5.Be3 Bc5 6.Qd3??? Nxf2 0-1 Krakatoa (talk) 21:05, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
As I thought, I don't have the book, so I just ordered it. Nice find! Krakatoa (talk) 09:59, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
It is a pretty elementary book. Bubba73 (talk), 11:16, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
Oh well. It was only five bucks. Krakatoa (talk) 14:34, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Two dark square bishops[edit]

Um, why are there two dark square Bishops on the upper left picture? O.o Thewriter006 (talk) 09:21, 7 January 2011 (UTC)

It must be an error. The Bishop on e3 was probably supposed to be on e2 (or maybe d3). I'll change it, but I don't know if it is correct for that opening. Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 16:58, 7 January 2011 (UTC)