User talk:Bkonrad/Archive 31

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Noah Haynes Swayne

Would you please take a look at him. He was on the panel to arbitrate the boundary dispute between Michigan and Ohio. Thanks. 7&6=thirteen (talk) 22:13, 28 February 2009 (UTC) Stan

I knew you would have the answer. Thanks you. 7&6=thirteen (talk) 02:12, 1 March 2009 (UTC) Stan
To complete the job, I would think that Swayne deserves a mention and a link in the Toledo War article. Just a suggestion. Happy editing. 7&6=thirteen (talk) 02:53, 1 March 2009 (UTC) Stan
BK, thanks for updating Toledo War and tidying up Noah Haynes Swayne. However, you eliminated this from Further reading, and I think that was an inadvertent mistake. Further reading: *Simon, James F. (2006) Lincoln and Chief Justice Taney: Slavery, Secession, and the President's War Powers (Paperback) New York: Simon & Schuster, 336 pages. ISBN 0743298462). If it was just an inadvertent deletion, please consider putting it back. Cheers. 7&6=thirteen (talk) 22:35, 1 March 2009 (UTC) Stan
That was inadvertent. I got an edit conflict and saved my changes intending to go back and resolve the differences. But I had to take care of rescheduling a canceled flight and couldn't attend to it immediately. olderwiser 22:57, 1 March 2009 (UTC)

No worries. I'll put it back. I think this article beats virtually anything else out there on this gentleman. He was a very good lawyer and a mediocre justice. Sort of the Peter Principle in operation. He was breaking trail for G. Harrold Carswell and Roman Hruska, albeit Carlswell didn't get approved by the U.S. Senate. Thank you for your input. 7&6=thirteen (talk) 23:02, 1 March 2009 (UTC) Stan

I am not yet familiar with all the ins and outs on templates. This did not work out.

Huebner, Timothy S. (2003). Renstrom, Peter; Hall, Kermit L, eds. The Taney Court: Justices, Rulings, and Legacy. ABC-CLIO. pp. 103–6. ISBN 1576073688.  Missing |last1= in Editors list (help) Can you fix it? Thanks. 7&6=thirteen (talk) 01:55, 2 March 2009 (UTC) Stan

I don't see that where there are any editors listed for that book. Looks like Timothy Renstrom is a Series editor, but I don't see any mention of Kermit Hall associated with the book. olderwiser 02:26, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

DYK for Treaty of Fort Wayne (1803)

Updated DYK query On March 1, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Treaty of Fort Wayne (1803), which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Victuallers (talk) 10:40, 1 March 2009 (UTC)

Wikipedia Signpost — 2 March 2009

This week, the Wikipedia Signpost published volume 5, issue 9, which includes these articles:

Delievered by SoxBot II (talk) at 07:54, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

The flags and succession arrows on Wisconsin Territory

I know that the flags are hardly the most informative thing on the page, and their placement can be discussed. However, the arrows themselves are highly informative, keeping track as they do of what polities ruled over which territories when; I use the flags of the United States as kind of placeholders for the nonexistent territorial flags of the Michigan Territory, the Minnesota Territory, and Iowa Territory, and this is standard practice on Wikipedia (since the territories are not independent units but creations--and therefore extensions--of the federal government). Since I am about to go on an infobox spree among former US organized incorporated territories, I think it prudent to inform you that whatever agreement is reached over the placement or non-placement of flags next to the succession boxes, the arrows themselves must remain in place. Thanks! Lockesdonkey (talk) 23:37, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Was there an agreement reached somewhere that I'm unaware of? The arrows are nearly unnoticeable. I never saw them until you pointed them out. Such unintuitive features aren't very useful if they are readily not apparent. The flags themselves provide virtually no information. I'm not sure what to suggest, but the present standard for presentation in this regard leaves a lot to be desired. olderwiser 00:03, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

sorry about the eyesore

I noted this edit of yours to the Longwood disambiguation page. Indeed, the NRHP dab cleanup tag is a bit of an eyesore on dab articles. It's only meant to be temporary, but sometimes it takes me a little while to get around to cleaning up a dab so marked. In the future I'll consider placing it at the bottom of a dab, particularly if there are many non-NRHP entries on the page. Thanks for moving it down rather than removing it, anyhow. And now that dab page is cleaned up. doncram (talk) 18:06, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Wikitionary links

Hey there! I saw that you fixed my placement of the Wikitionary box in a few articles. Thanks for that! Although I have created a few disambiguation pages I was not sure how to apply this. Should I encounter more pages for which a Wikitionary link could be useful and I apply it just like that, at the top, that would be the way to go? Thanks for your help! doxTxob \ talk 02:48, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

Hamtramck, Michigan

Albanians and Bosnian pop. figures? I would think we would go with whatever he census said. How people choose to ethnically identify themselves, especially as political boundaries change across the seas, is problematical at best. Not to mention the whole Balkan 'ethnic cleansing' wars. Please take a look. 7&6=thirteen (talk) 13:24, 7 March 2009 (UTC) Stan

fishing info

how do i put fishing info on the pages?

Wikipedia Signpost — 9 March 2009

This week, the Wikipedia Signpost published volume 5, issue 10, which includes these articles:

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Happy St. Patrick's Day

Irish clover.jpg

Have Black & Tan (Guiness and Harp (although they are owned ironically by South African Brewing Company). Enjoy the day. Best regards to you. 7&6=thirteen (talk) 16:14, 17 March 2009 (UTC) Stan

Re: Hurricane (disambiguation)

Hi there. I was referring to, WP:MOS/DAB, where small bold section headings are used throughout rather than large ones. Thanks, Miremare 15:53, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

WP:MOSDAB doesn't recommend using level five headings instead of level two headings. On shorter lists, it is often acceptable to use bolded headings, as with plain bold wikimarkup ''' or by using a definition list heading by starting the line with a semicolon. By some standards using lower level headings without higher level headings is defective. Wikipedia:Writing_better_articles#Headings, Wikipedia:Guide_to_layout#Headings_and_sections, Wikipedia:Accessibility#Headings and Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style#Section_management recommend that sections should begin with level two headings and then use lower levels hierarchically. olderwiser 16:18, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
Oh yes, righto. Thanks, Miremare 03:35, 23 March 2009 (UTC)

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Delievered by SoxBot II (talk) at 03:45, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Norvell, Michigan

Hi there, I've been maintaining the list Wikipedia:U.S. cities without articles, and I see you've been continuing to chip away at the Michigan ones--thanks! I tend not to delete bluelinks from the list unless I'm sure that the target article has been created or redirected properly. With Norvell, I saw no mention of a community named Norvell in the township article it redirects to--I'm not sure if that's an oversight or if there's not an actual community by that name, just the township. Let me know--it's been blue for quite a while! Katr67 (talk) 22:22, 25 March 2009 (UTC)

ANI notification

FYI, You've been brought up on AN/I. --OnoremDil 14:49, 27 March 2009 (UTC)

Toledo War

BK, FYI, nice and long article on a new book on this subject in todays Detroit Free Press. 7&6=thirteen (talk) 12:19, 29 March 2009 (UTC) Stan

The content In The Historicity of Jesus Is a Clear Violation of The NPOV, Original Resource and Reliable Resource Policy

Carrier is only stating his opinion. It is not factual. Carrier suggested their no facts for him to look through; unproven POV statement is what it appears to be. The statement about Tacitus mislabeling Pilate a procruator, when he was a prefect, is false. Pilate was indeed officially the procuarator of Judea. Tacitus attacked and promoted Nero-propoganda by calling them evil. Also think about it. Why would a person of religious faith attack their deity, as France and Guignebert suggested? It's the equivalent of solid Republican supporting a Democrat, or vice-versa75.72.233.213 (talk) 21:54, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

I've no interest in this whatsoever. All I did was unhide some text that got inadvertently hidden. olderwiser 22:39, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

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Delievered by SoxBot II (talk) at 19:47, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

Information on Robert Cherrie

An article on the Pine Lake Iron Company clearly shows the correct spelling of the manager of the company: His last name is spelled Cherrie. There is a Cherrie spur off the main line of the Chicago & West Michigan line out of Charlevoix and UConn has all kinds of paperwork relating to the pig iron operation in Ironton that has the correct spelling. NOT Cherry. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 08:32, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

The source cited in the article, Walter Romig's Michigan Place Names spells the name "Cherry". If there are other reliable source that can be cited, that would be fine to mention, but citable sources are needed. olderwiser 10:51, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

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Delievered by SoxBot II (talk) at 18:45, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

Ironton (Eveline Township)

Here is just one source from the Charlevoix Historical Society) concerning the spelling of the Pine Lake Iron Company owner's name:

May 15, 1886


Matters at Ironton seem to be going forward with the activity that usually precedes a blast. The furnace is being overhauled and put in shape, kilns are being rebuilt, and the smoke from several of them indicates that the charcoal product will soon show itself. The tug Bob Stevenson, which has been submerged for over a year, has been raised and a force of men are at work on her hull and machinery. It is intended to put her in good shape for doing the company's towing. Mr. Cherrie is personally superintending the company's improvements in all branches of its affairs. The date of starting up is not yet decided, but will depend upon the outcome of the labor complications. The Company has got out about 20,000 cords of furnace wood the past winter, and if matters adjust themselves satisfactorily, the Company is in good shape for a lively season's business. The schooner Narragansett will do the ore carrying again this season from St. Ignace. The good people of Ironton seem to be moving forward in material, social and religious progress. The G. A. R. Post is completing a neat and commodious hall, erected upon a site kindly given by Mr. Cherrie, and they will soon occupy it. The contract for building the "First Congregational Church of Ironton" has been let to the Charlevoix Manufacturing Company and the work will go forward at once. It will be 30 x 50, a neat and well built chapel. Rev. Wm. VanAuken, of this place, has done excellent work at Ironton, and already has a society organized there with something over forty members. Mr. VanAuken will continue his ministrations until such time as they shall secure a settled pastor, which the people of Ironton will be loath to do as long as they are so ably supplied at present. Miss Cherrie and Mrs. Adams, Mr. Cherrie's sisters, both active congregationalists in their home church at Chicago, have done much to make the Ironton church a success, as has also Mr. Cherrie.

(From the Rosa Nettleton collection) (talk) 13:41, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

Thanks. Provide some publication information that can be used to cite the source and then there's something to work with. 14:04, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

Living Machines

Hello - I went in and edited information about the living machines (a company i work for owns the trademark to this product). I then noticed that all of my edits were deleted and the original copy appeared. It had your username in the history following my edits. I'm new to Wikipedia - can you help me understand why this happened?

Thanks so much.

Cleanh2o (talk) 14:20, 9 April 2009 (UTC)

The edits appeared to be promoting your product. The article needs to be written from a neutral and unbiased point of view. See WP:NPOV. Also statements should be backed up with references to reliable third-party sources, especially qualitative or evaluative statements. See WP:CITE for mechanics of how to cite your sources. Please see WP:COI for more information about avoiding conflict of interest when editing articles in which you have a material interest. olderwiser 15:50, 9 April 2009 (UTC)
Further, while your company might own a trademark for "The Living Machine", the article is about the generic concept of living machines, of which your company's product is merely an example. olderwiser 15:52, 9 April 2009 (UTC)

Suttons Bay

So when I created the Leelanau County template, I completed missed adding Suttons Bay? Nyttend (talk) 19:34, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

Looks like it. I seem to recall a couple of other incorporated places that were similarly omitted from the county templates, but not such a big deal really. olderwiser 19:40, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

South Bass Island Links

Unfortunately your statement is incorect. The definition of encyclopedia is:

a work that contains information on all branches of knowledge or treats comprehensively a particular branch of knowledge usually in articles arranged alphabetically often by subject.

As you can see by looking at the website in question, it actually contributes a great deal of information including history, local information etc. Lets look at this thru a much larger set of glasses. For example look at Islamorada, a city and island of equal size and similar demographics. As you can see at this Wiki site the website Is permitted as an external link. Please note that the information contained in the sub sections are very similar to those of the website

Therefore, as I have stated before, there are NUMEROUS examples of where websites of similar design and content ARE considered to add encyclopedic value.

Unless you are saying that all of these should be removed, please EXPLAIN why this is not the same and why you keep removing the NON COMMERCIAL website??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 01:19, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

I've already replied to the IP, giving warning of 3RR (after all, the IP has already done 5RR); I'll block if any more of this comes. Nyttend (talk) 02:04, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
Blocked. Nyttend (talk) 02:16, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
Another IP ( is blocked; it went around randomly removing various links from Florida location articles, citing your edit summary from this edit. Because of a statement that the made after being blocked, I've warned both that they'll be treated as sockpuppets or meatpuppets from now on. I'm online frequently; if you discover any more, just tell me and I'll make the block quickly. Nyttend (talk) 12:47, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
Thanks. olderwiser 17:40, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

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Delievered by SoxBot II (talk) at 16:00, 13 April 2009 (UTC)


Hey. Regarding the page Boston (disambiguation) you write in the history that "as it is a piped link, it should be in the description". Why's that? Fanoftheworld (talk) 14:32, 17 April 2009 (UTC)

See WP:PIPING. In general, the linked terms on disambiguation pages are not piped. There are some exceptions, and one is when the link is in the description, rather than at the start of the entry. olderwiser 15:20, 17 April 2009 (UTC)
Thanks. I have corrected the link. Fanoftheworld (talk) 15:59, 17 April 2009 (UTC)

April 2009

Information.svg Welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your comments, which you added in discussion at Talk:Presence. Please note that on Wikipedia, consensus is determined by discussion, not voting, and it is the quality of arguments that counts, not the number of people supporting a position. Consider reading about the deletion policy for a brief overview for the deletion process, and how we decide what to keep and what to delete. We hope you decide to stay and contribute even more. Thank you! --Avant-garde a clue-hexaChord2 22:51, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

Thanks. I understand, but just as putting lipstick on a pig doesn't change the fact that it is a pig, pretending that a poll is actual consensus is delusional. olderwiser 22:55, 19 April 2009 (UTC)
And not to mention his apparent habit of using standard "welcome" templates on oldbie talk pages is annoying enough, without his clueless and pov-pushing disregard for WP:TALK's prohibition on messing at will with people's comments. If you could take this to ANI, that would be great. I've made a list of events on my talk page. -Stevertigo 22:58, 19 April 2009 (UTC)
Just see this diff. I don't support trolling. You may do. --Avant-garde a clue-hexaChord2 23:00, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

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Delivered by SoxBot II (talk) at 18:08, 20 April 2009 (UTC)


After reading your comment regarding township names on the WP:Pennsylvania talk page, I was confused: what did you mean about the "contention in US city naming conventions"? Has someone ever tried to add county names to municipalities that are unique in their state, such as "Detroit, Wayne County, Michigan"? Nyttend (talk) 12:39, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

No, I meant the seemingly interminable arguments over whether US cities should be pre-disambiguated. That is, if there is an article for a city named "Foo, State" and there is no other article with the name "Foo", many feel that the article should be moved to the simpler name because disambiguation is unnecessary. It was much the same argument with TV show names. Many editors had begun naming articles pertaining to particular TV show with the title pre-disambiguated with the TV show name in parentheses, primarily for consistency. For example, suppose there were a TV series named "Bar" and there were an article about an episode in that series title "Foo"; many of these episodes were being created with names such as "Foo (Bar)", for consistency among episodes in the series, regardless of whether there were any need to disambiguate the title from other articles named "Foo". olderwiser 12:47, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

Detroit River‎

BK, What is this thing about Fort Erie, Ontario? Any idea. I looked at Niagara River, which includes map, and I just don't see what our new contributing editor is getting at. Obviously you don't get it either, as you reverted it, too. FYI, I am going to send our correspondent a note. 7&6=thirteen (talk) 12:43, 24 April 2009 (UTC) Stan

Boke disambiguation

See Project disambiguation talk. My doing. And much to discuss as it is "corrected." Proofreader77 (talk) 22:04, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

You said it, Bkonrad: "Oy vey." Would it help if I apologized for what I have done? -- llywrch (talk) 03:34, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Another editor had moved it to (disambiguation) for a reason

Responding to problems I've alluded to. Proofreader77 (talk) 22:32, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

You are hereby formally requested to cease editing the page while the issues are discussed

The issues are being laid out in great detail. Your dismissive rush edit amidst discussion is noted for the record. Proofreader77 (talk) 09:11, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

FORMAL COMPLAINT re administrator User:Bkonrad and rollbacker User:Kotniski


Careful and diligent examination of why Boke was formatted that way is in progress.

Changing the page so that what is being discussed is poor form, and certainly beyond the pale for an administrator.

There is no legitimate reason to rush the reformatting of a page under discussion. Continuing shall result in a DR.

NOTE: A DR not for a content dispute — but for outrageous editing behavior by an administrator and a rollbacker.

Dismissive and contemptuous of the community and of process.
--Proofreader77 (talk) 09:27, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

FORMAL REQUEST: Restore the page to the state it was when discussion began

-- Proofreader77 (talk) 10:10, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

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Delivered by SoxBot II (talk) at 03:58, 29 April 2009 (UTC)